long-time reader first-time bread-maker

Also we have (hopefully) learned to store ovenware with the lids on upside down.

the ceramic coating is not porous so you may be able to save it. eeeeeek

Any focaccia recipes to recommend? Something to do with 00 flour other than pizza dough?

Soon I will be a first-in-a-long-time bread baker. Is that no-knead a good way to go or should I try something else. I may or may not have a KitchenAid mixer. It was acting a bit weird last I used it oh three or four years ago.

we are anxiously making our own sourdough starter. the first attempt died on day 4-ish, so this round we're being really by-the-book and worrying more than is probably necessary.

Yeah I'm gonna start with yeast, not sourdough starter. I don't need that heartbreak, I already have plants.

Is that no-knead a good way to go or should I try something else

It takes a long time (two proves of 12-18 and 1-2 hours each) but otherwise it ain't lying, just a minute or so of mixing necessary, no need for a mixer.

https://www.nigella.com/recipes/guests/jim-laheys-basic-no-knead-bread

Kneading is the best part. Highly therapeutic.

just don't knead too hard if you're making sourdough! needs to stay supple. keep those gluten strands strong, rather than mashed.

Any focaccia recipes to recommend?

if you like i can dig out my olde Green's cookbook that has a tried and true recipe i haven't made in years.

If you have the time and inclination, I’d love that!

shite. can't find the book. was certain it'd be where my other cookbooks are. may still be packed away or may have purged it (doubtful) when i moved a couple years ago. so sorry!

i'm gonna make this today though on account of you making me want focaccia, and me needing a little project:

https://www.epicurious.com/recipes/food/views/focaccia-with-olives-and-rosemary-322

We did this, it turned out much better than an other italian baking cookbook recipe we also tried. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=RQOhAeNAjKc

Oh wtf just embed

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RQOhAeNAjKc

I really like the Tartine Country White recipe for sourdough, but it can take a few tries to get it right and also takes a long time with all of the proofs. Not much kneading required though.

Those starting a starter should use distilled or spring water to feed the starter until it really get going. This avoids the chlorine in tap water that can inhibit early yeast growth.

i admire how this thread hurtled up out of my league so quickly

maybe i will make a starter at the weekend or something

I’ve done a lot from the river cottage bread book so I’d reckon their focaccia recipe would work welL

https://www.rivercottage.net/recipes/focaccia

i made rosemary garlic rolls with my dinner. i made bread! (ralph wiggum voice)

today i am making EASY PLAIN-FLOUR LOAF using this as my fast-action dried yeast:

https://i.imgur.com/AlEEJa8.jpg

(it does say instant dry yeast in little letters so nothing can go wrong in this non-turkish-speaking household)

my v supportive pal P has texted me to say "remember yr making BREAD not ROCK CAKES" in ref the picture up thread, along with multiple laughing-crying emojis so im stoked for this tbh

A good baking week. Big delivery of Shipton Mill flour finally came (ordered on the cusp of the crisis after a couple of weeks umming and ahhing about whether I would ever that much flour), inc 25kg of their basic white (number 4).
Couple of soda bread loaves for instant gratification earlier in the week, then a bit more time on a basic sourdough boule yesterday. I've been going at that one over and over; getting there. New flour good, timed and controlled the proofing better and getting better at the slap-and-fold knead after watching Richard Bertinet videos. Bit more confident handling dough.

ok now double in size you blobby pos

Coincidentally i also wound up with some Shipton No. 4, after biking to E5 bakehouse. Only 3kg for me though!

mark are you keeping it warm? 20C probably not enough - you want it more like 25 or so

you mean the dough when it's proving?

it's in the oven now and my main issue rn is it's not really browning very much

giving it a final 3-min blast at a higher temp to de-pale-ify it a bit then it's out (it smells good)

https://files.slack.com/files-pri/TV20059EW-F010Z8QA1NC/2020-03-28_16.45.51.jpg

terrible photo of pleasing subject

i was using plain flour not strong flour (much more kneading required) plus also the instructions for the turkish yeast are in turkish (i imagine they are standard but who knows). but it's recognisably what it purports to be (visually and tastewise) so yeah

https://files.slack.com/files-pri/TV20059EW-F010P8G6BPB/2020-03-28_17.13.24-2.jpg

it's p dense so probably could have risen a bit more -- will follow tracer's advice next time re ambient temp (cold brisk late winter's day in hackney today)

yeah when proving it should be warm. also you’ll get a better rise and less dense loaf if you use bread flour i.e. higher protein, at least 11%

but that looks great! next time you can try cranking your oven as hot as it will go for an hour before putting it in. then after 20 minutes on full temp you can lower to about 230C for another 30-ish. you’ll get that colour you want :)

wait this is an hour pre-bake consisting of 20 mins plus 30 mins ?

(i don't have any strong flour current so the experiment was "what happens if you use plain flour and knead twice as long" as per a recipe i found online)

this is a safe space for bread nerds and noobs alike, no worry too pernickety, no question too dumb :)

― mark s, Sunday, 22 March 2020 12:09 (six days ago) bookmarkflaglink

What are some other good ideas for proofing dough at home (keeping it at ~80-90 F / ~26-32 C while also staying humid)?

Can you do it in a slow cooker on low, with a cup of water next to the dough?

Can you do it on a low stovetop burner somehow?

mark:

pre-heat oven on max for an hour
put in dough
lower to 230C after about 20 minutes and bake for about 30 minutes more

ah interesting: that's less heat *and* less time than my recipe said -- except i think it did originally say something closer to yours but various punters reported overbaking and even burning so they reduced both

well adjust if you need to - everybody’s ovens are slightly different! but that ought to be pretty close to what you want

ok i have a question abt fan ovens then: do i change the numbers when the fan is on (i always put the fan on bcz why wouldn't i)

don’t put on the fan - the fan will extract all the nice moisture that helps the bread push upwards in that first 20 minutes

in fact, slightly next-level is to put a pan of boiling water in bottom of your oven for that first 20 minutes to maximise steam situation. take out out when you reduce the heat.

blimey these are the tippiest tips :)

I've struggled with proofing, but 2 methods I've tried lately -
Oven off (or just 2-3 minutes of warm-up to take the chill off), then a pan of boiling water sitting in the bottom with your dough on a shelf above it. (this made black flakes fall from the top of my oven, so that was shameful and I stopped trying it after the first go).
Boil water, and put the water in a normal saucepan with lid upside-down on top. Put your bowl/banneton of dough on the lid. Cover the dough. Refresh water if it needs more time/heat. This seems to work for me.

those sound like good tricks. above the fridge is usually a warm spot too. or you could go the other way and prove overnight in the fridge, in a plastic bag, works v well for me.

Yeasted breads prove quicker and at a lower temp though - i am less familz with them. from what i understand the yeast is more powerful so the fermentation goes quicker. hence the whole “punching it back” thing - ya gotta tame it!

ok this is a level of lore way over my head

If you want to make panettone you have to let it rise then punch it back 4 times in 24 hrs.

what if i dont though

then the yeasty beast is too unleashed

I neglected my starter in the run up to xmas, thought I got it going again but baked over the weekend and it felt closer to a ciabatta rather than a boule. Think I need to keep feeding that little dude even more than I thought.

people say you can let it go a month but ime if you leave it longer than maybe 10 days you really have to work to get it strong and active again

We were away for a few days after Christmas. Forgot to put the starter in the fridge & I suspect the kids had the heating on full blast, because there was pink mould on top once I got back. No smell, and very liquid. Seemed dead.

Got a couple of tbsp from the bottom and fed it a good mix of wholewheat, white and rye. Nothing after 24 hours. Tried to convince myself that it would be healthy and unsentimental to start a new starter from scratch & that I should get better at baking with instant yeast anyway.

But then! Tiny little bubbles the next day. Took about a week to actually recover, but it's alive & is baking as well as ever.

Taken it as a warning - I slowed down on baking since I got a dog, but I enjoy it & I was so glum when I thought the starter was gone. Made me realise I need to pick up the rhythm again.

(& of course I discarded & fed every day till it was back to its usual winter self - sluggish, 8-10 hours to ripen)

pink pink pink pink
pink mold