Bob Marley : classic or dud?

I don't think he ripped off Perry.

The Perry-period stuff is marvellous and rightly gets great respect. The Studio 1 material is, I think, very mid-60s Coxsone business and too often overlooked, at least by comparison.

marley was beloved of a white audience. the lyceum '75 audience was 80% white, for example. do any blacks even bother listening to him these days?

classically DUD.

Lee Perry is not the most reliable of sources, though, is he?

Marcello, several of the names you mention above will have, at certain points in their histories, have attracted audiences in the UK which were substantially white, and I'd be very wary of trying to map that on to musical quality.

My understanding is that Bob Marley is enormously popular in many black communities around the world, and I know he's listened to where I live. Certainly he garners enormous respect on the reggae lists and newsgroups I've read over the years, including from people who know their reggae inside out.

I'd never really thought about this until I read that David Katz biography of Perry where (i think) Jimmy Riley and Clancy Eccles both point out that not only did Marley's vocal style change as a result of working with Perry but he began to sound like Lee Perry. One of them said something like "Listen to Marley after he worked with Perry, that's Lee Perry's voice you're hearing". It's not so much a case of Marley ripping Perry off as of Perry coaching Marley musically and vocally.

(It's probably also fair to say that the likes of Mr. Eccles know what they're on about much more than the likes of me. But it's nice to try to make my own mind up sometimes...!)

If they did would that make him good?

This is a joke, right?

However, after learning more about Reggae and reading up on some of the backstories of some of his songs ("Burnin' & Lootin'" etc), I realised that a lot of his stuff was based not in abstract ideas of how the world is fucked up, but in experiencing the world's fucked-upness firsthand.

So my question, to try to put it in specific enough terms, is: do you think that there's a specific point at which Marley's lyrics stopped being about trying to get the ppl in his backyard to stop shooting each other, and started to be about trying to get ppl everywhere to stop shooting each other? A specific point in time when it stopped being about preaching to a very specific community and started being about more-or-less universal messages?

Catch A Fire = C
Everything Else = D

Errrrrrrrrr, he did actually

xpost - wow, hating on Diana Ross AND Bob Marley? That's double the wrongness for one low price!

(in unrelated news, I was lucky enough to meet Horsemouth Wallace last week and was totally starstruck in an "OMG you played on Augustus Pablo sides!" sort of way, and he told me a bunch of really awesome stories and it ruled)

check this quote out from hansard:

"I ask my hon. Friends to look at the citizenship issue. It is not just a small question ; this is the big stuff. Listen to Bob Marley. It is all there. Perhaps hon. Members do not know that Bob Marley was a great singer, a Rastafarian, and some of his songs are the most wonderful one could have. One of them tells the whole story of what Government say to us year after year : please do not worry about anything because everything is going to be all right. That is what we have been told time and time again, and every time it has blown up in our faces. I say to those hon. Members who are not worried about citizenship that it does not just mean voting in council elections. I ask them to think about the three-year review and about the fact that the Council of Ministers will be able to act without limit."

on the common agricultural policy:

"I was appalled to see in the Red Book--I do not think that we can possibly send this to the Commission--that contributions this year will unfortunately be higher, although they will be lower thereafter. I have seen Red Books for about 31 years. Every year in which we have been in the EU people have said, "Unfortunately, the position is worse this year, but do not worry--it will be better next year." It is like the Bob Marley song: "Don't you worry about anything baby, because everything's going to be all right."

My own personal opinions regarding Marley (don't like him, much) and vocal-dominated reggae in general (ditto) are particularly unilluminating. One thing I'm curious about that may be worth discussing, tho, is: How did Bob Marley become THEE reggae musician in North America, the one with the Top Ten albums and fratboy-popularity? Is it because he wrote stuff with more "melody" (in the Hongro sense) like "No Woman No Cry" or "One Love" - the stuff that gygax called 'pop-reggae'? Or do such songs merely SEEM more accessible & commercial due to their longtime overfamiliarity? (A chicken/egg conundrum.)

I think his ascent to What I Mean When I Say "Reggae"hood in the U.S. had a lot to do with the fact that he toured here, and toured hard, and that he did so at the exact moment when both punks and rock geezers (Keith Richards especially) were name-checking reggae. Also, by all reports (and on the recorded evidence), he was incredibly charismatic live, and his band was just murderously good. So he got a running start on everybody. Plus, he had a very sweet singing style, sort of in a Lovers' Reggae mode but more wistful, less treacly.

I think too, yes, that the tunes themselves are ace pop songs - even the earlier stuff ("My Cup" for example) shows he's got a real gift for hooks.

I'm standing by this statement! And I don't hate on Diana Ross and Bob Marley, I quite like both of them (esp. Diana Ross).

What is "Bob Marley Anniversary Programme"? It is on at the pictures tomorrow, and me wonders if it is worth the effort.

Is this what you mean? http://www.odeon.co.uk/fanatic/film_info/s81/Covent_Garden/m10733/Bob_Marley__Anniversary_Programme/

Yes, that's it, only without the Q&A.