sounds ran their themed double issue called new musick (also a bad name lol but way better than "post-punk" sorry if this offends), featuring (from memory) kraftwerk, devo, the residents, throbbing gristle, siouxsie and the banshees, plus essays on dub and disco (possibly also pere ubu and cabaret voltaire?)*it seems important that literally everything listed here with the exception of souixsie predates uk punk
― Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Monday, 3 February 2020 17:09 (four years ago) link
feelgood if you amp up wilko's bug-eyed oddness maybe, the rest of the pub rock was raucous 12-bar pop and country
doctors of madness for sure, a bit earlier the groundhogs, the edgar broughton band, the pink fairies
― mark s, Monday, 3 February 2020 17:12 (four years ago) link
tbh ums there may have been others included that were more recent, i haven't set eyes on the relevant pages for 43 years -- but the people who argued for the issue and wrote and edited them were jon savage and jane suck, two of the key punk writers at the paper, so it wasn't *just* a retrogression (and was not at ALL presented as one rhetorically)
― mark s, Monday, 3 February 2020 17:16 (four years ago) link
mark otm on influence + post punk. People describing "Pink Flag" as post punk always makes me chortle.
― (includes digression on farting) (Tom D.), Monday, 3 February 2020 17:55 (four years ago) link
Has anyone read the "Red Set: The History Of Gang Of Four" bio? Any good?
― Gerald McBoing-Boing, Monday, 3 February 2020 22:15 (four years ago) link
Simon Reynolds on Andy Gill
https://pitchfork.com/thepitch/remembering-gang-of-fours-andy-gill-who-ripped-punk-to-shreds/?fbclid=IwAR0vQfhHnaSzNltWQcdFHWVnXS8DNnxh2-24V3BWge1RCtNNIZErID3RhOo
― Kibbutzki (Jaap Schip), Wednesday, 5 February 2020 03:06 (four years ago) link
x-post-- Am curious about the "Red Set: The History Of Gang Of Four" book too. I see there was also a 33 1/3 book on the Entertainment album, but the one review excerpt thing I read about it online just says that the 33 1 /3 book author Kevin Dettmar focuses heavily on (and "beats one over the head with") the Situationist and Marxist aspects of the lyrics
― curmudgeon, Sunday, 9 February 2020 21:38 (four years ago) link
So when Gill and King went to NYC in fall 1976, they were on a university grant, stayed in NYC with critic/filmmaker Mary Harron, and visited Moma by day (from an online blurb about the Red Set book about Go4)
― curmudgeon, Sunday, 9 February 2020 21:51 (four years ago) link
Wow
― TS: Kirk/Spock vs. Hitchcock/Truffaut (James Redd and the Blecchs), Sunday, 9 February 2020 21:54 (four years ago) link
Nice work if you can find it.
― (includes digression on farting) (Tom D.), Sunday, 9 February 2020 21:54 (four years ago) link
harron became a film-maker later obviously but she wasn't one in 1976
also i only just discovered that she dated tony blair at oxford lol
― mark s, Sunday, 9 February 2020 21:57 (four years ago) link
I can see how Gill was struck by the distressing and "misuse" of familiar elements in the music of Beefheart, maybe especially as a guitarist---also, if he's serious about The Band--or not---certainly the sense, especially on Music From Big Pink, of what xgau called the music's "sprung"quality: something to the effect that if you took away one piece, the whole thing would go flying apart: ah, those self=taught hillbilly mechanics! (My Granpaw, who attended a mechanics' school in St. Louis, started by Henry Ford, went home to the hills and found he had all kinds of competition from consumer-hackers). Prob not really---the Hawks/Band were always known for their chops, and Garth for one was formally educated), but Go4 tapped into that sense of suspenseful tumult under the hood.And yeah the first times I read about "punk" (in Creem, natch), Bangs was already agitating for distress, misuse, extension of the term: he tried applying it to James Taylor, Helen Reddy, and saying why they were that. A kid wrote in to say he considered punk not only to be the Seeds and the Dolls, but listening to Sun Ra while doing orange sunshine, and Eugene Ormandy with Dubonnet on ice: Bangs agreed; "The chief criterion is excitement." Surely the 60s roots-continuity-ongoing lives of Patti Smith, Televsion, Voidoids, Joey Ramone (the former Jeff Starship) was had to do with the spirit, not the letter of punk (also all the young geezers Mark cites below), before the rise of Taliban hardcore.without getting too het up abt two of my bugbears (ancient: "stop saying influence and use better words please", less ancient: "no one called it post-punk at the time and its use now is distorting") the move in the UK to move BEYOND PUNK was strongly afoot as early as 1977, when sounds ran their themed double issue called new musick (also a bad name lol but way better than "post-punk" sorry if this offends), featuring (from memory) kraftwerk, devo, the residents, throbbing gristle, siouxsie and the banshees, plus essays on dub and disco (possibly also pere ubu and cabaret voltaire?)*
i think the notion of a split within punk is just utterly basic to its sense of identity: it was always about forcing splits within a movement, not just the counterculture at large as a movement, but within punk as a movement -- and in some ways within ourselves. identify the contradiction and make it the hook! so it's less a "bullshitty vibe" really than a basic element in the make-up of many of those drawn to it -- we were always drawing paradoxical lines and insisting on impossible definitions, it was our thing! i wish the loudersound interview had called gill out on that a bit -- half his statements seem to me to be screaming "call me out on this! it'll be fun! open for a surprise!"
*with the exception of the banshees all these folks pre-existed punk, this is one (small) reason why i dislike "post-punk"Also the split had to do, within factions and some bands and some individuals, between break on through/back to basics.
― dow, Monday, 10 February 2020 04:38 (four years ago) link
(and "basics" could incl. several kinds of constriction)
― dow, Monday, 10 February 2020 04:48 (four years ago) link
Speaking of distressed knowns/"knowns", David Johnson, host of the invaluable Night Lights, reminds us:Jazz writer Dan Morgenstern once compared the sound of tenor saxophonist Albert Ayler's 1960s avant-garde groups to "a Salvation Army marching band on LSD." Now that's what I call post-punk.https://indianapublicmedia.org/nightlights/holy-ghost-albert-ayler.php
― dow, Monday, 10 February 2020 05:21 (four years ago) link
That reminds me: when I went to see Gang of Four back in 2015 (at a local venue!), during a lull in the performance Andy riffed about French Situationism for a little bit. Also, he was still pretty gorgeous.
― We Live as We Dee, Alone (deethelurker), Monday, 10 February 2020 12:57 (four years ago) link
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wMlhWvIh7U4
― TS: Kirk/Spock vs. Hitchcock/Truffaut (James Redd and the Blecchs), Monday, 10 February 2020 17:58 (four years ago) link
Thanks for that Wilko Johnson video.
― curmudgeon, Wednesday, 12 February 2020 16:56 (four years ago) link
still intrigued by simon reynolds' claim that gill's and wilko's fingernails are "hardened" -- are (or were) they? how?
― mark s, Wednesday, 12 February 2020 16:58 (four years ago) link
Lots of fingerstyle guitar players use artificial nails, not sure if that’s what he is referring to, tend not to think so.
― TS: Kirk/Spock vs. Hitchcock/Truffaut (James Redd and the Blecchs), Wednesday, 12 February 2020 17:04 (four years ago) link
Simon Reynolds doesn't how guitar playing works - shocker!
― High profile Tom D (Tom D.), Wednesday, 12 February 2020 18:13 (four years ago) link
I've heard stories of particularly bass players using super glue to reenforce calluses.
― Josh in Chicago, Wednesday, 12 February 2020 19:31 (four years ago) link
hardened skin absolutely! i used to play double bass in orchestras so i know exactly how that works -- but i don't think you can't callus fingernails
brb researching nail art, i already discovered tippi hedren is why so many US nail bars are vietnamese-run
― mark s, Wednesday, 12 February 2020 19:38 (four years ago) link
gang of four shd write a song abt it tbrr
Maybe he imagines that said nails were gradually vulcanized into steely talons as a consequence of their owners' picking style?(That's not what happens, no.)
― Diddums Is a Ranter (Vast Halo), Wednesday, 12 February 2020 19:40 (four years ago) link
Yes, I believe that is exactly what he thinks
― TS: Kirk/Spock vs. Hitchcock/Truffaut (James Redd and the Blecchs), Wednesday, 12 February 2020 20:40 (four years ago) link
That's not what happens indeed. I love this part in an episode of a Matt Sweeney series, in which James Williams talks about the Fake Fingernail Mojohttps://youtu.be/9OvB-wDt7mA?t=521
― willem, Wednesday, 12 February 2020 21:04 (four years ago) link
rules that legendary stooge james williamson basically confirms my not-entirely serious nail-bar theory
― mark s, Wednesday, 12 February 2020 21:13 (four years ago) link
Catherine Mayer, Andy Gill's widow, has a new piece up about his passing. There is a strong possibility -- though as the piece clearly states, no specific evidence -- he was an early victim of COVID-19
https://www.catherinemayer.co.uk/post/2020-vision-14-may-16-00
― Ned Raggett, Thursday, 14 May 2020 16:34 (three years ago) link
Many thanks for posting that.
― stirmonster, Friday, 15 May 2020 13:37 (three years ago) link
My brother has just texted me, "Respiratory illness after touring Asia". I think I'd hold fire on that one.
― (includes digression on farting) (Tom D.), Saturday, 1 February 2020 21:08 (three months ago) bookmarkflaglink
― Frank Bough: I Took Drugs with Vice Girls (Tom D.), Friday, 15 May 2020 13:50 (three years ago) link
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/jun/01/spate-of-possible-uk-coronavirus-cases-from-2019-come-to-light
― Is Lou Reed a Good Singer? (Tom D.), Monday, 1 June 2020 13:34 (three years ago) link
The trajectory of Gill’s illness, which took medics looking after him in January by surprise, is now familiar – sudden deterioration, low oxygen levels and organ failure. He had fallen sick after his band returned from a trip to China in late November. A short time later, his 26-year-old tour manager was taken to hospital in Leeds with a severe respiratory infection.
Knowing what we do now it does seem likely it was covid, although apparently the band cancelled last spring's Chinese dates after he was hospitalised with another chest infection.
― Matt DC, Monday, 1 June 2020 13:51 (three years ago) link
MATADOR RECORDS TO OVERSEE CLASSICGANG OF FOUR ALBUMS
ENTERTAINMENT!, SOLID GOLD, SONGS OF THE FREE, AND 14 LIVE SHOWS NOW AVAILABLE TO STREAM
LISTEN TO A CURATED PLAYLIST OF LIVE TRACKS
We are pleased to announce that Matador Records will now oversee a number of key catalog titles by legendary Leeds, UK band, Gang of Four, including the classic albums Entertainment! (1979), Solid Gold (1981), and Songs of the Free (1982).
These records are once again available across streaming services and are joined by 14 live releases capturing performances between 1979 and 1984. Find a curated playlist of highlights from the live tapes.
“Ether,” the introductory track on Entertainment!, was recently sampled by Run The Jewels, who used the song’s core riff to form the backbone of their track “the ground below” on the recently released RTJ4.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mCQtCj39TN0
More to come.
― Loud guitars shit all over "Bette Davis Eyes" (NYCNative), Wednesday, 15 July 2020 22:15 (three years ago) link
yay!
― curmudgeon, Friday, 17 July 2020 17:26 (three years ago) link
W/r/t live tracks playlist, the entire Mpls gig used to be up on youtube (seems to have been taken down, natch) and it is a fucking scorcher
― chr1sb3singer, Friday, 17 July 2020 18:11 (three years ago) link
Ah-ha, I see the whole show is up already up on the various streaming services, nice, I thought they were just doing the playlist
― chr1sb3singer, Friday, 17 July 2020 18:17 (three years ago) link
Songs of the Free never gets the love it deserves. "Call Me Up" and "We Live As We Dream...Alone" are as good as anything from Entertainment.
― beamish13, Friday, 17 July 2020 19:10 (three years ago) link
"We Live As We Dream...Alone" is a good one
― curmudgeon, Saturday, 18 July 2020 15:59 (three years ago) link
On the August 1979 Toronto show they cover the Mekons and Rezillos!
― Boring, Maryland, Wednesday, 22 July 2020 18:20 (three years ago) link
I think about "We live.." all the time. it does something powerful to me.
― Boring, Maryland, Wednesday, 22 July 2020 18:21 (three years ago) link
“The Problem of Leisure: A Celebration of Andy Gill and Gang of Four”
http://musicglue-images-prod.global.ssl.fastly.net/gang-of-four-usa/product/the-problem-of-leisure-limited-edition-cd-pre-order?u=aHR0cHM6Ly9tdXNpY2dsdWUtdXNlci1hcHAtcC02LXAuczMuYW1hem9uYXdzLmNvbS9vcmlnaW5hbHMvZWM4MDFkNjgtNmEzNi00MDc1LWIxMDEtYjBjZGY3ZWU0ODU3&mode=contain&width=800&v=2
A new compilation album featuring globally famous names with original artwork by Damien Hirst to be released on May 14, 2021
The Problem of Leisure: CD One Vinyl One, Side A 1. IDLES - Damaged Goods (UK)2. Tom Morello & Serj Tankian - Natural’s Not in It (USA)3. Helmet - In the Ditch (USA)4. 3D* x Gang of Four feat. Nova Twins - Where the Nightingale Sings (UK)5. Hotei - To Hell With Poverty (Japan) Vinyl One, Side B 1. Gary Numan - Love Like Anthrax (UK)2. Gail Ann Dorsey - We Live as We Dream, Alone (USA)3. Herbert Grönemeyer feat. Alex Silva - I Love a Man in a Uniform (Germany)4. LoneLady - Not Great Men (UK)5. JJ Sterry - 5.45 (UK) The Problem of Leisure: CD TwoVinyl Two, Side C 1. La Roux - Damaged Goods (UK)2. Everything Everything - Natural’s Not in It (UK)3. Dado Villa-Lobos - Return the Gift (Brazil)4. The Dandy Warhols - What We All Want (USA)5. Warpaint - Paralysed (USA) Vinyl Two, Side D 1. Flea & John Frusciante – Not Great Men (USA)2. The Sounds - I Love a Man in a Uniform (Sweden)3. Hardcore Raver in Tears - Last Mile** (China)4. Killing Joke x Gang of Four - Forever Starts Now (Killing Joke Dub) (UK)5. Sekar Melati - Not Great Men (live version) (Japan)
Stream the first single - "Natural's Not in It" by Tom Morello & Serj Tankianhttp://gang-of-four.ffm.to/naturals-not-in-it
― Loud guitars shit all over "Bette Davis Eyes" (NYCNative), Thursday, 14 January 2021 15:43 (three years ago) link
I was just about to say what's with the shitty artwork and then...
― Eggbreak Hotel (Tom D.), Thursday, 14 January 2021 15:46 (three years ago) link
All I know is if someone told me Gang of Four was one of the most influential bands ever, and then I saw that track list, I would probably call bullshit.
― Josh in Chicago, Thursday, 14 January 2021 16:28 (three years ago) link
3. Helmet - In the Ditch (USA)1. La Roux - Damaged Goods (UK)
I'd fancy hearing these two but that's about it
― stylish but illegal (Simon H.), Thursday, 14 January 2021 16:30 (three years ago) link
that certainly is the bloke from System of a Down on that cover version, I'll say that
― Sven Vath's scary carpet (Neil S), Thursday, 14 January 2021 16:32 (three years ago) link
Box Set Now Due In March (Vinyl & Cassette) and April (CD)
http://www.slicingupeyeballs.com/2021/02/02/gang-of-four-77-81-box-set-rescheduled/
― "what are you DOING to fleetwood mac??" (C. Grisso/McCain), Wednesday, 3 February 2021 06:02 (three years ago) link
Hope this one does well, so they do a second one. I've held out paying $$$ for _Hard_ on Discogs, and will get the next period's cd box set. _Songs of the Free_ ("I Love a Man in Uniform") and _Hard_ ("Independence", "Arabic") are the two I fell for in college.
― the body of a spider... (scampering alpaca), Wednesday, 3 February 2021 15:32 (three years ago) link
so uncool to not include the cassette in the CD version
― fbclid=fhAZ3l (f. hazel), Wednesday, 3 February 2021 16:25 (three years ago) link
bit shit that it doesn't include the single versions
maybe the Fast Product EP was a licensing issue?
― CP Radio Gorgeous (Colonel Poo), Wednesday, 3 February 2021 16:50 (three years ago) link
still owned by Bob Last
― dan selzer, Wednesday, 3 February 2021 18:51 (three years ago) link