Big Thief - Two Hands

I feel this more about Angel Olsen than Big Thief.

not sure i'd blame the collapse of the music media landscape on this phenomena which was observable at least ten years ago, and the fact that a nyt editor is pushing back against the deluge of love for big thief means the space for backlash isn't lost

also imo there is nothing "emperor's new clothes" about this band unless you just hear them as undistinguished folk rock, fleet foxes 2.0. which would be v superficial listening. which critics aren't immune from

I'm not against the argument that something better may be out there, but if so, let's see it.

it's a very big leap to go from 'i don't like this hyped artist' to 'everyone who likes this artist is faking it for clout.' it reminds me of a (much less malicious) version of right-wingers calling liberals/leftists 'virtue-signalers'

i don't begrudge the fact that 20,000 people pay to see billy joel at msg every month.

The Neil Young/Crazy Horse vibes are what take them to the next level for me, way above Fleet Foxes et al. I can't bring myself to stomach her voice, though – it's instinctive, and it's a damn shame.

agreed that it's a shame

'everyone who likes this artist is faking it for clout' is basically chris ott's classic indie rock conspiracy isn't it lmao

Might have to do with the voice as presumed seat of subjectivity and how it needs to partially mirror your own sense of self or whatever. Something about Lenker's vocals registers as inauthentic or false to my ears and no amount of discourse or autosuggestion can change that (well, for now). Everything else about them is wonderful.

but where is the 'hype' here? they've just grown steadily and got better over a number of years by... making consistent records and being a good live band over 5 years. its not like the attention is sudden or some sort of cooked up PR hype here... the PR isn't making the band - the band being good is what makes the PR job easy?

journos shouting hype almost always translates to them being late to the party, and being convinced that if a band could get attention without them noticing, they must have been bamboozled by nefarious means

i made a thread for masterpiece bc i heard the title track and "real love" and thought they were pretty tight and also at the time they were on saddle creek, who put out hop along's painted shut the year before. both bands felt special in a similar way. i'm def an unwitting victim of the pr machine

I have lectured my charges over the years endlessly about the difference between "not liking something" and "something not being good" and I argue this band is not good. People love what they love. I'm just making a critical statement and a social observation.

— cganz (@mehpatrol) October 15, 2019

I feel this more about Angel Olsen than Big Thief.

Agreed. I only listened to the new album once but it was a slog, particularly towards the end.

Reads like trolling tbh.

xp

Agreed. I only listened to the new album once but it was a slog, particularly towards the end.

― kornrulez6969, Tuesday, October 15, 2019 8:03 AM (forty-five seconds ago) bookmarkflaglink

"I only listened to the new album once"

journos shouting hype almost always translates to them being late to the party,

OTM

When I ask if she will actually take a day job sometime soon, she responds instantly: “Yeah, probably. I’m not afraid to slow down.” The only thing that matters to her is longevity, flame-keeping. “I’m not afraid of needing to work at a diner. I know I can be happy doing that. I was just as happy living out of a busted RV, burning CDs and selling them, and playing shows for no one. I was happy doing that; it felt right.”

Yes, this definitely sounds like someone who is thirsting to be the new indie-rock queen. Nobody's saying you HAVE to like this band but the guy who tweeted out the original thing about "emperor's new clothes" just seems really small, not to mention a total jag.

pretty sure it's a lady, but otherwise yeah

caryn is a woman yes

Haha my mistake for assuming someone who would unironically use the phrase “my charges” was a man

but where is the 'hype' here?

i dunno about hype, i think i might have heard of them before but didn't really know anything about them—a journalist teased the super-positive pitchfork review also in super positive terms and i took a listen. that journalist, along with what was just said here, seemed to be keyed to the idea of the band/records being special moreso than good, which is i think where the potential for critical disproportion comes in.

what's this all about? I don't have three minutes

This B*g Th*ef thing is the emperor's new clothes of 2019 rock, don't even think of @-ing me

— cganz (@mehpatrol) October 15, 2019

Egregious bait works best.

seemed to be keyed to the idea of the band/records being special moreso than good, which is i think where the potential for critical disproportion comes in.

does "special" not imply and include "good"? the feeling i get when i listen to their records is that something is transpiring in their interplay that other bands will likely be unable to repeat. to me that's special

it does imply and include good but i don't think being special is just the same as being good but at a higher point of intensity

if they would just have more than one rhythm my feeling would be different i'm sure

i understand the job of critics, but i hate it when they think / talk like their opinion is fact. hate it, hate it, hate it.

who gives a flying fuck what theoretical Pitchfork writers are supposedly going to think about this record 10 years from now?

people who post on the pitchfork is dumb thread about the 2010s retrospective pitchfork publishes in 2029

I'm proud of myself for not looking at that list, therapy is working

it's your privilege that lets you stay insulated from best-of lists, some people don't have that luxury

hahaha

irl lol

understand the job of critics, but i hate it when they think / talk like their opinion is fact. hate it, hate it, hate it.

― alpine static,

Example?

Pitchfork's application of the Ludovico Technique was probably a bridge too far, but that's where we are now

lol j.

xxp that cganz tweet from above ("i have lectured my charges...") seems like a relevant one

Arguments like this are stupid as shit and not worth engaging in, but it's particularly grating with Big Thief where (1) I discovered the band by accident, having no idea whatsoever who they were (no "hype" played into it) and (2) they have been my favorite contemporary band for the past couple of years. I love their music on a really deep level, and if they're not ROCK AND ROLL enough for you, fine, but honestly just fuck off. Don't tell other people what they feel.

luv 2 be a twitter bluecheck w/no name or identifying details

yeah and on that note who is this person, am I supposed to know who they are?

The tweet is dumb, Big Thief barely warrants a takedown bc I mean whose oxygen are they really stealing, and anyway as someone who mostly comes away from Next Big Thing indie with a shrug, I took to this band immediately with the first album. Her voice never bothered me but I also have built up immunity after years of listening to Neil Young.

everyone self selects their Twitter bubble so what seems like an overbearing national discourse on Big Thief is basically like 20k nerds and no one gives a shit

the tweeter in question is a music editor at the nyt

Also, "emperor's new clothes" is just a weird criticism to make of them in particular even if you don't like them? Emperor's new clothes makes me think of something more like, IDK, that absurd overwrought orchestral project that Jack White did, lots of bluster and not much substance. Big Thief's music is obviously carefully and lovingly crafted and extremely sincere whether it's your thing or not.

make up your mind, is it gonna be 'to each his own' or 'fuck you if you say anything against this obvious gem'

the tweeter in question is a music editor at the nyt

oh boiee

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_RXwe-v72rE

make up your mind, is it gonna be 'to each his own' or 'fuck you if you say anything against this obvious gem'

― j., Tuesday, October 15, 2019 9:37 AM (fourteen minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

it's "don't even think of @-ing me"

as a critical posture it's both dismissive and defensive, two things i think criticism should strive not to be but ymmv

Yeah, I thought it just looked like they were wiped out after being on the road for awhile.

What's that "chord" that Buck Meek seems to play so often, e.g. on the first song on that video - Shoulders - at around the 58 second mark?

Stretching over 5 or 6 frets

Dunno why I put the word chord in inverted commas. It'll be a chord of some kind.

Now I've heard there was a secret chord
That Buck Meek played, and it pleased the board

That so-called chord

I'd say he's either barring in a A major shape with his pointer finger on and then playing melodic lines off that with his remaining fingers, or he's in an alternate tuning that has necessitated a big stretch.

But judging by chords he plays later in the piece, he's in standard tuning.

it looks like he's doing a big stretch to grab two notes that are 5 frets apart. i doubt it's a full chord.

that note could be played on a higher string without the stretch, so i think its either easier for him to pick or he's just showing off. i think it's the latter but it's OK cuz it's subtle and he rules

After watching that live video, she sounds under the note to me a lot of the time on studio recordings as well, though, if not as strongly. It's not even a bad thing, necessarily, just something I hadn't noticed. I like a lot of singers who bend pitch.

that note could be played on a higher string without the stretch, so i think its either easier for him to pick or he's just showing off. i think it's the latter but it's OK cuz it's subtle and he rules

― diamonddave85​​ (diamonddave85), Tuesday, October 12, 2021 11:56 AM (one hour ago) bookmarkflaglink

he has enormous hands from what i can tell

buck not so meek after all

Couple friends of mine saw him in a coffee shop the morning of a show here, before pitchfork. He ordered an XL magnum size

maybe he should change his name to... Buck Naked

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/AxuBVGMCAAI7KYv.png

(I realize it's time for me to resign from ILM after making that joke)

Looks like Consequence of Sound published, and then deleted, a promo piece on the new album yesterday?

there was a pre-save link for the album that lead to that article which is gone too

seems like album announcement & "time escaping" are coming in the next week

& album title is dragon new warm mountain i believe in you releasing on feb 11 as previously leaked

"time escaping" coming in the next week

if this is true... the "most wonderful time of the year" is coming early!

yeah there was a pre-save link for "time escaping" that got dug up too & it apparently indicated a release next week

That's good news, I hope we don't have to wait too much longer! I'm surprised by how much I'm anticipating this record.

The bass playing on "Not" is an underrated feature of "Not"