Big Thief - Two Hands

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i had to research what the controversial big thief tweet was and i would like those three minutes of my life back thanks

american bradass (BradNelson), Tuesday, 15 October 2019 14:40 (one year ago) link

I feel this more about Angel Olsen than Big Thief.

TikTok to the (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Tuesday, 15 October 2019 14:42 (one year ago) link

not sure i'd blame the collapse of the music media landscape on this phenomena which was observable at least ten years ago, and the fact that a nyt editor is pushing back against the deluge of love for big thief means the space for backlash isn't lost

also imo there is nothing "emperor's new clothes" about this band unless you just hear them as undistinguished folk rock, fleet foxes 2.0. which would be v superficial listening. which critics aren't immune from

american bradass (BradNelson), Tuesday, 15 October 2019 14:45 (one year ago) link

I'm not against the argument that something better may be out there, but if so, let's see it.

Mario Meatwagon (Moodles), Tuesday, 15 October 2019 14:47 (one year ago) link

it's a very big leap to go from 'i don't like this hyped artist' to 'everyone who likes this artist is faking it for clout.' it reminds me of a (much less malicious) version of right-wingers calling liberals/leftists 'virtue-signalers'

flopsy bird (voodoo chili), Tuesday, 15 October 2019 14:51 (one year ago) link

i don't begrudge the fact that 20,000 people pay to see billy joel at msg every month.

flopsy bird (voodoo chili), Tuesday, 15 October 2019 14:52 (one year ago) link

The Neil Young/Crazy Horse vibes are what take them to the next level for me, way above Fleet Foxes et al. I can't bring myself to stomach her voice, though – it's instinctive, and it's a damn shame.

pomenitul, Tuesday, 15 October 2019 14:52 (one year ago) link

agreed that it's a shame

american bradass (BradNelson), Tuesday, 15 October 2019 14:53 (one year ago) link

'everyone who likes this artist is faking it for clout' is basically chris ott's classic indie rock conspiracy isn't it lmao

ufo, Tuesday, 15 October 2019 14:55 (one year ago) link

Might have to do with the voice as presumed seat of subjectivity and how it needs to partially mirror your own sense of self or whatever. Something about Lenker's vocals registers as inauthentic or false to my ears and no amount of discourse or autosuggestion can change that (well, for now). Everything else about them is wonderful.

pomenitul, Tuesday, 15 October 2019 14:57 (one year ago) link

but where is the 'hype' here? they've just grown steadily and got better over a number of years by... making consistent records and being a good live band over 5 years. its not like the attention is sudden or some sort of cooked up PR hype here... the PR isn't making the band - the band being good is what makes the PR job easy?

Hmmmmm (jamiesummerz), Tuesday, 15 October 2019 14:57 (one year ago) link

journos shouting hype almost always translates to them being late to the party, and being convinced that if a band could get attention without them noticing, they must have been bamboozled by nefarious means

Hmmmmm (jamiesummerz), Tuesday, 15 October 2019 14:58 (one year ago) link

i made a thread for masterpiece bc i heard the title track and "real love" and thought they were pretty tight and also at the time they were on saddle creek, who put out hop along's painted shut the year before. both bands felt special in a similar way. i'm def an unwitting victim of the pr machine

american bradass (BradNelson), Tuesday, 15 October 2019 15:01 (one year ago) link

I have lectured my charges over the years endlessly about the difference between "not liking something" and "something not being good" and I argue this band is not good. People love what they love. I'm just making a critical statement and a social observation.

— cganz (@mehpatrol) October 15, 2019

flopsy bird (voodoo chili), Tuesday, 15 October 2019 15:02 (one year ago) link

I feel this more about Angel Olsen than Big Thief.

Agreed. I only listened to the new album once but it was a slog, particularly towards the end.

kornrulez6969, Tuesday, 15 October 2019 15:03 (one year ago) link

Reads like trolling tbh.

xp

pomenitul, Tuesday, 15 October 2019 15:04 (one year ago) link

Agreed. I only listened to the new album once but it was a slog, particularly towards the end.

― kornrulez6969, Tuesday, October 15, 2019 8:03 AM (forty-five seconds ago) bookmarkflaglink

"I only listened to the new album once"

american bradass (BradNelson), Tuesday, 15 October 2019 15:04 (one year ago) link

journos shouting hype almost always translates to them being late to the party,

OTM

TikTok to the (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Tuesday, 15 October 2019 15:05 (one year ago) link

When I ask if she will actually take a day job sometime soon, she responds instantly: “Yeah, probably. I’m not afraid to slow down.” The only thing that matters to her is longevity, flame-keeping. “I’m not afraid of needing to work at a diner. I know I can be happy doing that. I was just as happy living out of a busted RV, burning CDs and selling them, and playing shows for no one. I was happy doing that; it felt right.”

Yes, this definitely sounds like someone who is thirsting to be the new indie-rock queen. Nobody's saying you HAVE to like this band but the guy who tweeted out the original thing about "emperor's new clothes" just seems really small, not to mention a total jag.

Evans on Hammond (evol j), Tuesday, 15 October 2019 15:05 (one year ago) link

pretty sure it's a lady, but otherwise yeah

flopsy bird (voodoo chili), Tuesday, 15 October 2019 15:09 (one year ago) link

caryn is a woman yes

american bradass (BradNelson), Tuesday, 15 October 2019 15:10 (one year ago) link

Haha my mistake for assuming someone who would unironically use the phrase “my charges” was a man

Evans on Hammond (evol j), Tuesday, 15 October 2019 15:14 (one year ago) link

but where is the 'hype' here?

i dunno about hype, i think i might have heard of them before but didn't really know anything about them—a journalist teased the super-positive pitchfork review also in super positive terms and i took a listen. that journalist, along with what was just said here, seemed to be keyed to the idea of the band/records being special moreso than good, which is i think where the potential for critical disproportion comes in.

j., Tuesday, 15 October 2019 15:18 (one year ago) link

what's this all about? I don't have three minutes

frame casual (dog latin), Tuesday, 15 October 2019 15:19 (one year ago) link

This B*g Th*ef thing is the emperor's new clothes of 2019 rock, don't even think of @-ing me

— cganz (@mehpatrol) October 15, 2019

pomenitul, Tuesday, 15 October 2019 15:19 (one year ago) link

Egregious bait works best.

pomenitul, Tuesday, 15 October 2019 15:20 (one year ago) link

seemed to be keyed to the idea of the band/records being special moreso than good, which is i think where the potential for critical disproportion comes in.

does "special" not imply and include "good"? the feeling i get when i listen to their records is that something is transpiring in their interplay that other bands will likely be unable to repeat. to me that's special

american bradass (BradNelson), Tuesday, 15 October 2019 15:21 (one year ago) link

it does imply and include good but i don't think being special is just the same as being good but at a higher point of intensity

if they would just have more than one rhythm my feeling would be different i'm sure

j., Tuesday, 15 October 2019 15:26 (one year ago) link

i understand the job of critics, but i hate it when they think / talk like their opinion is fact. hate it, hate it, hate it.

alpine static, Tuesday, 15 October 2019 15:55 (one year ago) link

who gives a flying fuck what theoretical Pitchfork writers are supposedly going to think about this record 10 years from now?

Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Tuesday, 15 October 2019 15:56 (one year ago) link

people who post on the pitchfork is dumb thread about the 2010s retrospective pitchfork publishes in 2029

j., Tuesday, 15 October 2019 16:01 (one year ago) link

I'm proud of myself for not looking at that list, therapy is working

Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Tuesday, 15 October 2019 16:06 (one year ago) link

it's your privilege that lets you stay insulated from best-of lists, some people don't have that luxury

j., Tuesday, 15 October 2019 16:08 (one year ago) link

hahaha

sleeve, Tuesday, 15 October 2019 16:08 (one year ago) link

irl lol

Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Tuesday, 15 October 2019 16:09 (one year ago) link

understand the job of critics, but i hate it when they think / talk like their opinion is fact. hate it, hate it, hate it.

― alpine static,

Example?

TikTok to the (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Tuesday, 15 October 2019 16:09 (one year ago) link

Pitchfork's application of the Ludovico Technique was probably a bridge too far, but that's where we are now

Mario Meatwagon (Moodles), Tuesday, 15 October 2019 16:10 (one year ago) link

lol j.

pomenitul, Tuesday, 15 October 2019 16:10 (one year ago) link

xxp that cganz tweet from above ("i have lectured my charges...") seems like a relevant one

flopsy bird (voodoo chili), Tuesday, 15 October 2019 16:11 (one year ago) link

Arguments like this are stupid as shit and not worth engaging in, but it's particularly grating with Big Thief where (1) I discovered the band by accident, having no idea whatsoever who they were (no "hype" played into it) and (2) they have been my favorite contemporary band for the past couple of years. I love their music on a really deep level, and if they're not ROCK AND ROLL enough for you, fine, but honestly just fuck off. Don't tell other people what they feel.

longtime caller, first time listener (man alive), Tuesday, 15 October 2019 16:13 (one year ago) link

luv 2 be a twitter bluecheck w/no name or identifying details

drunk on hot toddies (morrisp), Tuesday, 15 October 2019 16:14 (one year ago) link

yeah and on that note who is this person, am I supposed to know who they are?

longtime caller, first time listener (man alive), Tuesday, 15 October 2019 16:15 (one year ago) link

The tweet is dumb, Big Thief barely warrants a takedown bc I mean whose oxygen are they really stealing, and anyway as someone who mostly comes away from Next Big Thing indie with a shrug, I took to this band immediately with the first album. Her voice never bothered me but I also have built up immunity after years of listening to Neil Young.

omar little, Tuesday, 15 October 2019 16:16 (one year ago) link

everyone self selects their Twitter bubble so what seems like an overbearing national discourse on Big Thief is basically like 20k nerds and no one gives a shit

Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Tuesday, 15 October 2019 16:18 (one year ago) link

the tweeter in question is a music editor at the nyt

flopsy bird (voodoo chili), Tuesday, 15 October 2019 16:20 (one year ago) link

Also, "emperor's new clothes" is just a weird criticism to make of them in particular even if you don't like them? Emperor's new clothes makes me think of something more like, IDK, that absurd overwrought orchestral project that Jack White did, lots of bluster and not much substance. Big Thief's music is obviously carefully and lovingly crafted and extremely sincere whether it's your thing or not.

longtime caller, first time listener (man alive), Tuesday, 15 October 2019 16:21 (one year ago) link

make up your mind, is it gonna be 'to each his own' or 'fuck you if you say anything against this obvious gem'

j., Tuesday, 15 October 2019 16:37 (one year ago) link

the tweeter in question is a music editor at the nyt

oh boiee

drunk on hot toddies (morrisp), Tuesday, 15 October 2019 16:40 (one year ago) link

make up your mind, is it gonna be 'to each his own' or 'fuck you if you say anything against this obvious gem'

― j., Tuesday, October 15, 2019 9:37 AM (fourteen minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

it's "don't even think of @-ing me"

american bradass (BradNelson), Tuesday, 15 October 2019 16:51 (one year ago) link

I'm pretty much in the same boat as dog latin, but all the positive reviews have me curious, even though I'm still afraid a stripped-back Lenker solo album removes exactly the things I've loved the most about the two most recent Big Thief records.

soaring skrrrtpeggios (jon /via/ chi 2.0), Tuesday, 27 October 2020 18:08 (two months ago) link

I don't think the sound/feel of Songs is drastically different from U.F.O.F. (it's closer than Abysskiss was, even though that record had a few songs that actually appeared on U.F.O.F.).

New Adventures in WiFi (morrisp), Tuesday, 27 October 2020 18:18 (two months ago) link

It doesn't feel totally stripped bare.

Duke, Wednesday, 28 October 2020 17:01 (two months ago) link

I don’t think I’m as into her solo stuff as I am big thief. Not sure why it shifted off of my personal Pinterest board here, it’s not like it’s bad, but I’m not as much into the cult of lenker for whatever reason

ILX’s bad boy (D-40), Wednesday, 28 October 2020 18:21 (two months ago) link

I had trouble staying with Songs first listen as well, it's just a little too precious and meek for me, whereas I guess the full band balances that out somewhat and brings out her more aggressive side. I loved her live solo but I haven't heard recordings that quite capture the magic it had. The early solo stuff is cool and I like some of the songs on Abysskiss.

longtime caller, first time listener (man alive), Wednesday, 28 October 2020 19:56 (two months ago) link

Not sure those links posted, but Indiana, Kerina, and Jonathan

longtime caller, first time listener (man alive), Wednesday, 28 October 2020 20:01 (two months ago) link

precious and meek

I think this was the original name of Adrianne & Buck's performing duo ;)

Video Drama (morrisp), Wednesday, 28 October 2020 20:30 (two months ago) link

haw

longtime caller, first time listener (man alive), Wednesday, 28 October 2020 20:32 (two months ago) link

fwiw - I don't think there's anything particularly unusual or mysterious to be into a band but not so into the lead singer/songwriter's solo stuff (especially if it's acoustic). I love Hours Were the Birds, but it's very much a solo folkie thing - it doesn't sound at all like Big Thief (which didn't exist yet). The sound/vibe of Abysskiss is a little static and difficult for me to engage with, for whatever reason. The new one does kind of tap into the BT vibe for me (as I said above), but yeah, it's still not the full band.

Video Drama (morrisp), Wednesday, 28 October 2020 20:35 (two months ago) link

(it may be an interesting thread idea - "Love the band, indifferent to the solo artist")

Video Drama (morrisp), Wednesday, 28 October 2020 20:43 (two months ago) link

fwiw - I don't think there's anything particularly unusual or mysterious to be into a band but not so into the lead singer/songwriter's solo stuff (especially if it's acoustic). ... The new one does kind of tap into the BT vibe for me (as I said above), but yeah, it's still not the full band.

― Video Drama (morrisp), Wednesday, October 28, 2020 bookmarkflaglink

Funny, I was having a similar thought about the Jeff Tweedy album that just came out (on the same day as the Lenker stuff, I think). I like Wilco but I've never been super enthusiastic about his solo material, even though it's perfectly fine and not even that far off from the full band stuff!

sctttnnnt (pgwp), Thursday, 29 October 2020 00:22 (two months ago) link

three weeks pass...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TKcQyUszdhw

a great performance, i'm fascinated by her using a brush to strum on "dragon eyes"

ufo, Thursday, 19 November 2020 01:20 (two months ago) link

yeah! really great performance. she is very straightforward. i love that.

Karl Malone, Thursday, 19 November 2020 01:55 (two months ago) link

Just noticed Adrianne did an AMA on r/indieheads yesterday

nate woolls, Wednesday, 25 November 2020 06:05 (one month ago) link

Been coming back to this one a lot recently. In terms of composition I think it's my favourite. There are things they're doing with the music that completely confounds me, like I can't understand what it is or how they conceived it

Specific Ocean Blue (dog latin), Thursday, 26 November 2020 15:17 (one month ago) link

Or at least, at this stage, UFOF, Two Hands and Capacity hold level as my favourites. But these days it's the Two Hands material I find myself craving most

Specific Ocean Blue (dog latin), Thursday, 26 November 2020 15:20 (one month ago) link

two hands has such great, dry 70s drums

Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Thursday, 26 November 2020 15:28 (one month ago) link

one month passes...

The new Buck Meek album is really nice... kind of like a poppier Will Oldham, or mellow, mid-70s Dead. Upbeat tunes, pedal steel, warbly singing, etc.

one of the only artist who is genuine (morrisp), Friday, 15 January 2021 23:52 (one week ago) link

Wow, am only three songs in (Track 3 must've been the advance single, since I remember hearing that one months ago) but am already taken with the production on Two Saviors--finding it a flattering mix of polished but scrappy so far.

Co-pay Segundo (Craig D.), Saturday, 16 January 2021 00:15 (six days ago) link

a really good friend of mine, who has an excellent ear for production, also said he loved the sound of it

i have permanent "played drums in a concrete echo chamber" ears, so i have no fucking clue

Karl Malone, Saturday, 16 January 2021 00:18 (six days ago) link


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