Hillary Clinton: Classic or Dud?

the Peter Daou thing is incredible to me, you never see people deeply entrenched like that just see the light so...suddenly

xp Sure but the way she did it 😂

“We can pick apart anybody. I mean, that’s a great spectator sport. But this man who’s there in the Oval Office right now poses a clear and present danger to the future of the United States. So get over it,” Clinton said. “Look at the candidates, look at what they’ve accomplished, look at what they have fought for — and vote for anybody to get rid of Donald Trump.”

this faction is still so outraged that primaries exist

hillary defending joe b should be surprising to exactly no one

yup. she sees only 'the good man I know' and looks right past the testimony of women who say otherwise. "get over it" could not be more dismissive.

Dauo was on some podcasts a few months ago talking very progressive stuff. The hosts were kind of like are you for real?

Hillary Clinton is probably the best candidate liberal democracy has to offer.

al gore

yeah, he was great too. picking joe lieberman as his veep was a classic consensus-building move.

https://www.out.com/transgender/2019/10/14/hillary-clinton-says-we-must-be-sensitive-transphobia

https://thumbs.gfycat.com/ComplexFatKitfox-size_restricted.gif

At first glance I thought maybe that was just another out-of-context twitter gotcha, but this is the kicker:

“There are women who'd say [to a trans woman], ‘You know what, you've never had the kind of life experiences that I've had, so I respect who you are, but don't tell me you're the same as me,’” Hillary said. “I hear that conversation all the time.”

"I hear that conversation all the time...in my head."

she did go on a listening tour

she did essentially summarize a terf argument yes. i hear it all the time too

wow I wonder if Hillary will survive getting cancelled

huge lol at this all coming out during a discussion about ‘the book of gutsy women’

I mean, I hear a lot of things all the time

people are saying

Fuck off, Hillary

had a big fight about my wife about this, despite neither of us having any particular clue about what it was she actually said. argument turned out to have little to nothing to do with what she actually said, because, you know, what does it even fucking matter these days.

whatever, i can't even get upset at her at this point. oh god no some boomer trying to sell a book is engaging in mealy-mouthed equivocation! fine, she can be the voice of her generation's sickness, and chelsea can just shoot out death glares like "why the fuck are we even talking about this, jesus".

yeah i could be mad at her like i could be mad at my mom or i could just, you know, cut them both out of my life. and that's more what i'm trying to do.

At best, it looks like she’s admitting that trans issues are something boomers have ignored historically ignored and that she’s suddenly being asked to learn/have a position on something that’s new to her. Except that’s not the case: as the Out article explains, she made trans-inclusion a part of her 2016 campaign and now appears to be staking out a middle ground in order to please....who, exactly?

At best, it looks like she’s admitting that trans issues are something boomers have ignored historically ignored and that she’s suddenly being asked to learn/have a position on something that’s new to her. Except that’s not the case: as the Out article explains, she made trans-inclusion a part of her 2016 campaign and now appears to be staking out a middle ground in order to please....who, exactly?

― Maria Edgelord (cryptosicko)

oh, that's an easy one. people who want to carry the torch for "liberal democracy" and "respecting other people's opinions", who are the bulk of her target market at this point. i mean, who but hillary clinton is speaking to the struggles of the poor put-upon white cishet boomers? we all know they're the real victims of trumpism.

I increasingly think she is just a fucking idiot
https://www.axios.com/hillary-clinton-tulsi-gabbard-russia-d963ab0c-cd57-4f14-875b-65e63ea1781a.html

Like an idiot in the sense of a smart but non-exceptional A student who has always played by the rules and maximized every advantage she had in life and never really proven herself.

russia could at least pick someone who has a chance to win ffs, really disappointed in putin and his team tbh

an idiot in the sense of a smart but non-exceptional A student who has always played by the rules and maximized every advantage she had in life

iow, she'd make an above-average US senator.

WASHINGTON (AP) — The State Department has completed its internal investigation into former Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton’s use of private email and found violations by 38 people, some of whom may face disciplinary action.

https://t.co/jXePKf0VuU

— Zeke Miller (@ZekeJMiller) October 18, 2019

"absent 3rd party candidates" - you know that Gary Johnson got 3x as many votes as Stein, right? - were those votes rightfully HRC's? https://t.co/WzeDQBIMe8

— Doug Henwood (@DougHenwood) October 18, 2019

WASHINGTON (AP) — The State Department has completed its internal investigation into former Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton’s use of private email and found violations by 38 people, some of whom may face disciplinary action.

wasn't it reported early on in the trump admin that numerous officials (including whatever Ivanka is?) were insecurely using private email as well? shouldn't they start by disciplining whoever is currently doing it? this email shit is very serious, of course

russia could at least pick someone who has a chance to win ffs

― expedited frictionless convergences (bizarro gazzara)

wait, there's a lottery for facial feminization surgery? how do i enter?

i think hillary clinton is very smart but is also a boomer and for some reason almost all of the boomers are all fucking insane right now

almost all of the boomers are all fucking insane right now

hey, I resemble that remark!

ok, it's a hacky lazy generalization (even moreso because i really just meant _white_ boomers), but over time those of who aren't boomers are slowly coming to believe it: something is just bad wrong with white boomers, something i've never seen an explanation for that i believe. sorry for my part in the latest overblown Generation War but i can't see a way to recuse myself.

I think there are lots of ways to explain why boomers are so fucked up in America. I am sure there are loads of articles on this.

Yes, there are, millions, and I don't believe any of them!

generation of sociopaths by bruce gibeney (warning: a techbro and most likely a shitlib) is pretty instructive on this topic

(no offense aimless; lots of good boomers obv)

you don't believe how vietnam fucked up so many boomers? or how women were financially and reproductively crippled before the 70s fucked them up? There are so many of of these factors. xpost

i mean at some point it just became a Fall of Rome question where everybody has their reasons and hobbyhorses some of which are perfectly plausible but maybe don't explain the depth of the fucked-up-ness and some people have "novel" solutions like lead poisoning or some shit and some people say "well, actually, rome didn't fall at all, they just collectively decided they'd rather all go back to foraging and die of starvation at the age of 20", and all the answers say more about the people explaining the problem than they do about the problem, viz: white boomers are, as a generation, uniquely fucked up and dangerous.

oh, I am sure it's always easier to blame an earlier, not so distant generation because there are always better records documenting the triggers, like civil rights, and real life experience to relate.

i don't think I responded correctly to your post on re-read. I have no clue what you are saying besides people are stupid and believe stupid things.

generational talk is false consciousness encouraged by those who seek to divide you from your boomer comrades, the majority of whom suffer as you suffer; it's just not useful to think about. so it's a pity that they are already destined to be remembered forever as the genocidal narcissists who tried to take the world with them. oh well

btw, having witnessed society as run by the so-called Greatest Generation, they also fucked things up a fair bit, including very large amounts of racism, sexism, homophobia, and widespread, staunch support for the Vietnam War. not all of them were race-baiting, VFW, 'better-dead-than-red' types, just a considerable swath of them. You look at the March on the Pentagon and there were tens of thousands of middle-aged activists against the Vietnam War; they just weren't in strong enough numbers to win many elections.

as I've often said, Bill Clinton is (ok, was) smart, and a lotta good that did us.

What do you want me to say, #notallboomers? Yeah all group consciousness is false consciousness, all generalizations erase nuance and some of the more beautiful and worthy parts of individuals, and if we atomize it enough we can make it look like there isn't a problem with the boomers at all, people are just people and always will be, nothing to be done about it, suck it up starfish.

If you're a boomer and are consistently kind and caring and supportive, congratulations! You're not like most boomers of my experience. Boomers still suck and people are still going to assume you suck just because you're a boomer. You've lived long enough to be the villain, hell, maybe you can outlive being the villain. Give it a shot at least.

What do you want me to say, #notallboomers?

Nah. I'm tremendously disappointed in the failings of my fellow boomers, when considered en masse. But the poisons in our society are not somehow newly born into any particular generation. Every generation imbibes them and time will tell how brilliantly the up-and-comers perform through the decades. They may get beaten down and fed enough fear and hatred that you won't recognize them when they're old. Or not. I wish all of us the best of luck.

Lol UK boomers are completely fucked up too and they didn't have a Vietnam. They were the first generation born into a world with universal healthcare, free university tuition, bought their first house for an affordable price, good stable unionised job. A whole plethora of simmering resentments that has led to them endorsing pretty much every attempt to limit or curb the advantages gifted on them going to subsequent generations. These coddled babies of the welfare state have become the most viciously acquisitive advocates of punitive individual responsibility and civic distrust. I mean notallboomers etc but. I don't know what the common factor is

UK boomers mend and make do austerity fetishism is maybe in part becaus of not having a Vietnam! Of not having to go through what their parents did, and having a mix of both preceding generations (in the past) and following generations (today) calling them coddled and priviledged.

The weird co-opting of the second world war to be one of their signifiers, the nihilism in on some level wanting Brexit to cause problems. In some ways it feels like either replicating how their parents viewed them OR a transferring of guilt to generations below. Possibly over-compensation for feelings of undeserved position

I don't know that there is a common factor though, and even if there was the differences seem too substantial

(I may be wrong, but I think 55-79 was the only age group to have a majority for leave, over 80s skewed remain)

The common factor is Rupert Murdoch, isn't it?

Nah. I'm tremendously disappointed in the failings of my fellow boomers, when considered en masse. But the poisons in our society are not somehow newly born into any particular generation. Every generation imbibes them and time will tell how brilliantly the up-and-comers perform through the decades. They may get beaten down and fed enough fear and hatred that you won't recognize them when they're old. Or not. I wish all of us the best of luck.

― A is for (Aimless)

I mean, maybe I'm projecting here, certainly Gen X already has its fair share of monsters (waves to Silicon Valley). The problems of the Internet specifically are, I think, on us and not on boomers.

But this catastrophe means that in some sense I've already gone through that phase; when I was young I thought we were saving the world when in fact we were destroying it, and regarding white boomers that realization didn't seem to really truly hit until about 2016.

The projection is that I spent decades as an undifferentiated "fucked up person" with all sorts of diagnoses and in retrospect a lot of my problems turned out to be more simple and obvious than I thought they were, and this _unique_ boomer fucked-upness... yes humanity as a whole is fucked up yes you didn't start the fire but white boomers, I really believe, have a specific and specifically differentiable generational/cultural problem; something happened to them, and I don't know what it is, but I do think it's _knowable_.

I wish I could find where I once read that the internet got nastier once the boomers showed up

idk if it was total gladwell style cod-research but it has a certain old man yells at cloud computing truth for me nevetheless