Ha yes the tan line! Weโre #1!The sample for that plot is weird btw. There have been succesful unicorn ipos recently (mongo and elastic).Also re losing money to distort the market, a comparison between wework and itโs nearest competitor is instructive:
WeWork vs IWG (Regus) Basically the same size in terms of rented desks, different valuation. pic.twitter.com/HwgOl0Dr0h— Eliot Brown (@eliotwb) September 11, 2019
Typically companies like to show declining losses as they IPO A problem for wework: its losses are growing with its revenue pic.twitter.com/NI2AJF81Z6— Eliot Brown (@eliotwb) September 11, 2019
― ๐ ๐๐ข๐จ (caek), Wednesday, 11 September 2019 19:26 (four years ago) link
One of my past jobs I used to review/approve employee private investments and participation in private investments for conflicts and in order to place conditions on them. It's the get stupid wild west out there.
― Yerac, Wednesday, 11 September 2019 19:36 (four years ago) link
WeWork has basically invented a new business play: negative real estate arbitrage.
― longtime caller, first time listener (man alive), Wednesday, 11 September 2019 20:42 (four years ago) link
negative real estate arbitrage
Um, since real estate cannot be bought in a market in one place, then sold in another market elsewhere where the valuation is different, that phrase makes no sense.
― A is for (Aimless), Thursday, 12 September 2019 03:04 (four years ago) link
ยฏ\_(ใ)_/ยฏ
https://www.google.com/search?q=arbitrage+wework&oq=arbitrage+wework
― ๐ ๐๐ข๐จ (caek), Thursday, 12 September 2019 03:41 (four years ago) link
What those sites are calling arbitrage is not arbitrage in any fundamental sense, since the markets they are working within are unitary and inescapable. You may as well call house flipping in a hot housing market "arbitrage" (and I don't think it is). Yes, it is making money from an increase in valuation between the buying and selling price, but if that is arbitrage then so is buying a mutual fund and selling it a few years later, provided the share price went up over time. It empties the term of all its useful technical meaning.
― A is for (Aimless), Thursday, 12 September 2019 04:17 (four years ago) link
REITS (real estate investment trusts) would probably fit what you are looking for? Although I kind of lost what was being sought.
― Yerac, Thursday, 12 September 2019 12:20 (four years ago) link
xp ok but "'real estate arbitrage' makes no sense" is a bit strong/pedantic/demonstrably inconsistent with informed writers use of the term/wrong.
― ๐ ๐๐ข๐จ (caek), Thursday, 12 September 2019 13:30 (four years ago) link
Leasing in one market (long-term office) and leasing out in another market (short-term office).
― longtime caller, first time listener (man alive), Thursday, 12 September 2019 14:08 (four years ago) link
Well, then, good news for We (from Wikipedia):
When used by academics, an arbitrage is a transaction that involves no negative cash flow at any probabilistic or temporal state and a positive cash flow in at least one state [...] In principle and in academic use, an arbitrage is risk-free
― A is for (Aimless), Thursday, 12 September 2019 20:35 (four years ago) link
I think we can all agree that the term โarbitrageโ is overused these days to describe lots of things that could just be called โmaking a profit โ.
― o. nate, Thursday, 12 September 2019 20:43 (four years ago) link
all of academics talking about arbitrage.
― Yerac, Thursday, 12 September 2019 20:49 (four years ago) link
So, if the term "arbitrage" has one value in academia and when marketing departments hijack it and turn it into a marketing term where it can be sold to investors at a different, higher value, does that turn the marketing department flaks into arbitrageurs?
― A is for (Aimless), Thursday, 12 September 2019 20:59 (four years ago) link
Arbitrage arbitrageurs.
― DJI, Thursday, 12 September 2019 22:51 (four years ago) link
i don't think wework call it arbitrage. it's meant as an insult in this context.
― ๐ ๐๐ข๐จ (caek), Thursday, 12 September 2019 23:01 (four years ago) link
in economics arbitrage just means buying something and selling it to someone else at a higher price
― flopson, Friday, 13 September 2019 05:43 (four years ago) link
i agree w aimless wework aren't really arbitraging since they rent out the spaces then deck them out/renovate etc
― flopson, Friday, 13 September 2019 05:46 (four years ago) link
like to me arbitrage implies you don't have to do anything in between buying and selling
― flopson, Friday, 13 September 2019 05:47 (four years ago) link
Sure. Thatโs fair but saying that the guy selling umbrellas on the street corner is doing arbitrage sounds a little funny.
― o. nate, Friday, 13 September 2019 12:47 (four years ago) link
https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/61QPyraFfHL._SX258_BO1,204,203,200_.jpg
― mookieproof, Friday, 13 September 2019 13:17 (four years ago) link
When I brought up REITs above it was to address the post "Um, since real estate cannot be bought in a market in one place, then sold in another market elsewhere where the valuation is different, that phrase makes no sense." In this example you can go from public to private market valuations for the underlying real estate. But maybe that post was specific to wework and not real estate in general?
― Yerac, Friday, 13 September 2019 13:54 (four years ago) link
"negative arbitrage" was just a joking reference to the fact that they sublet real estate unprofitably.
― longtime caller, first time listener (man alive), Friday, 13 September 2019 14:21 (four years ago) link
This is hilarious
Oh my https://t.co/9rENkZOQp3— Eliot Brown (@eliotwb) September 13, 2019
― ๐ ๐๐ข๐จ (caek), Friday, 13 September 2019 14:31 (four years ago) link
man alive, I thought your explanation was clear/concise.
― Yerac, Friday, 13 September 2019 14:33 (four years ago) link
In case itโs not clear
reminder that wework has raised over $10 billion of equity!— Eliot Brown (@eliotwb) September 13, 2019
― ๐ ๐๐ข๐จ (caek), Friday, 13 September 2019 14:34 (four years ago) link
House of Saud gonna take a bath on this one
― president of deluded fruitcakes anonymous (silby), Friday, 13 September 2019 14:40 (four years ago) link
it's a $SNAP
― Mitch C. Palace (Sufjan Grafton), Friday, 13 September 2019 16:21 (four years ago) link
โ flopson, Friday, September 13, 2019 1:47 AM (yesterday) bookmarkflaglink
โ o. nate, Friday, September 13, 2019 8:47 AM (yesterday) bookmarkflaglink
umbrella on the street corner in the rain is different from umbrella in cvs six blocks away though
― flopson, Saturday, 14 September 2019 20:09 (four years ago) link
rip
WeWork postponing IPO until at least October. Scoop from @maureenmfarrell https://t.co/OVdYVDz8Ot— Eliot Brown (@eliotwb) September 16, 2019
― ๐ ๐๐ข๐จ (caek), Monday, 16 September 2019 22:07 (four years ago) link
dude looks like an acid casualty
― president of deluded fruitcakes anonymous (silby), Monday, 16 September 2019 22:08 (four years ago) link
NB I don't know what an acid casualty looks like that's just the phrase that came to mind
Iโm kind of buying into the idea that SoftBank (begins WeWork, etc.) could be the epicenter of the next recession/collapse.
― ... (Eazy), Monday, 16 September 2019 22:23 (four years ago) link
me too. i was skeptical but then i learned the softbank money is like 50% saudia arabian and the whole situation there _also_ seems like it might be a financial contagion.
― ๐ ๐๐ข๐จ (caek), Monday, 16 September 2019 22:34 (four years ago) link
Thatโd be more like world economy into the shitbin, no?
― El Tomboto, Monday, 16 September 2019 22:41 (four years ago) link
That main guy for WeWork is such a cartoon version of a tech ceo. He seems a pretty precious choad.
― earlnash, Tuesday, 17 September 2019 00:21 (four years ago) link
https://amp.businessinsider.com/images/5cdc09f1021b4c7124165cd3-1536-1152.jpg
― earlnash, Tuesday, 17 September 2019 00:24 (four years ago) link
WeWork more like WeDon'tWork
― wario in the streets, waluigi in the sheets (m bison), Tuesday, 17 September 2019 00:26 (four years ago) link
Neon slogans on WeWork office walls implore you to โHustle Harderโ and โGet S#!t Done.โ
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2019-05-15/wework-wants-to-be-its-own-landlord-it-also-wants-2-8-billion
― earlnash, Tuesday, 17 September 2019 00:27 (four years ago) link
WeSuck
It's as though Adam Neuman said to himself "Let's do an experiment as see just how far we can take the unicorn scam" and the market responded "One step less far than you just went, that's how far"
― longtime caller, first time listener (man alive), Tuesday, 17 September 2019 02:40 (four years ago) link
Meanwhile, unrelated but I guess sort of related, I was walking up second ave yesterday in an area I used to walk around a lot when I worked there a couple years ago, and there are a shit ton of empty and closed down stores, bars, restaurants now. Can't help but feel like that's a bellwether of something.
― longtime caller, first time listener (man alive), Tuesday, 17 September 2019 02:42 (four years ago) link
I hate that there are so many vacant storefronts on Columbus Ave and on Polk St in SF. I don't understand it fully but guess it has to do with the leverage necessary to buy these buildings and the rents required to keep the asset value up - and the owners' bank loans afloat
I think the owners should be fined for keeping storefronts vacant beyond a reasonable amount of time, though
― Dan S, Tuesday, 17 September 2019 03:15 (four years ago) link
we need a version of Vancouver's vacancy tax for commercial properties:
https://news.bloombergtax.com/daily-tax-report-state/u-s-cities-look-to-vancouvers-novel-empty-homes-tax
― sleeve, Tuesday, 17 September 2019 03:18 (four years ago) link
yes
― Dan S, Tuesday, 17 September 2019 03:42 (four years ago) link
the name softbank tells me all i need to know. yโall soft
― alomar lines, Tuesday, 17 September 2019 03:48 (four years ago) link
lol
― president of deluded fruitcakes anonymous (silby), Tuesday, 17 September 2019 03:52 (four years ago) link
vacancy tax didn't do shit
― flopson, Tuesday, 17 September 2019 07:21 (four years ago) link
It would be nice if all vacant commercial properties were subsidized down to a rent control level and allowed non-chain pop ups on a short term basis.
― Yerac, Tuesday, 17 September 2019 11:58 (four years ago) link
whoops minus the subsidy for landlords who keep their storefronts empty on purpose.
― Yerac, Tuesday, 17 September 2019 12:00 (four years ago) link
xxp flopson is that because it got watered down? or was it not enough to begin with?
― sleeve, Tuesday, 17 September 2019 14:07 (four years ago) link