Which artists legacies have improved/worsened during the 2010s?

I know earlier we discussed the idea of Zappa aging into a cranky facts and logic guy but imho Lennon would have been just as likely a candidate for that

― Simon H., Thursday, August 15, 2019 7:48 AM (one hour ago)

john lennon was a leftist edge-lord and would be telling the truth about syria

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CXQiStxWwAEEM9u.jpg

Yes, idea that Lennon was immune to sentiment is nonsense, Goodnight, Beautiful Boy, Oh Yoko etc Tough exterior, soft centre.

Any one of us would've gotten as sick of the singing as Yoko did.

he was a born asshole and spent his whole life pushing against that tendency in himself. with mixed results, sure, but he had a family he loved and who supported him and he didn't give up. i don't know what that would he'd look like today but assuming he would turn into some execrable New Atheist is a big assumption!

What interview was this? Mayo is very sweet, AFAIK

I think it was this one? http://mattendahl.blogspot.com/2012/06/interview-with-mayo-thompson-part-one.html

To me it reads as really pretentious and kind of, "well, we were blowing everyone out of the water and no one understood what we were on about bc we were so far ahead of the game"

Which, whatever. I think he WAS making interesting and great stuff at the time which WAS distinct from much of what was going on, and I get that ppl who find themselves in that position sometimes just have like entirely different brain stuff going on which doesn't necessarily translate well into making good conversation at cocktail parties or whatever. But that said, there's something kind of exhausting about the way he communicates at least in that interview. like, come down to earth or whatever.

I recall reading this before... I think it's very interesting!

now I'm thinking what's going to be laughably passé in 2029... like who is the GADPY of 2019? who has the furthest to fall?

GADPY probably my least favorite ILM acronym, can never remember what it refers to and then of course it's something ridiculously nerdy and specific

it stands for Gaye Bykers on Acid

who has the furthest to fall?

Taylor Swift. Beyonce.

GADPY probably my least favorite ILM acronym, can never remember what it refers to and then of course it's something ridiculously nerdy and specific

― Οὖτις, Thursday, August 15, 2019 9:45 AM (eight minutes ago)

ILM didn't originate this

? who did?

I recall reading this before... I think it's very interesting!

I dunno. He just comes across as kind of insufferable to me. for an interview, there is no "I and thou" element -- it reads more as just him downloading data into the interviewer's brain. And a good part of the data seems to involve him casually comparing himself to Mozart and looking down on his (Mayo's) contemporaries, w the exception of maybe Ayler and Coltrane. I could get down with all of that in other circumstances, but there is something about his tone that I find off-putting.

for example,
We found that logic played a role in our thinking and in nobody else's. It was very simple to operate within parameters; to set up formal problems and work the logical parameters as they appear. Say you want to put some scrutiny on the idea of instruments. You find that on that record. So we start with, “This is a guitar. It has six strings. They are usually not tuned like this. They're played like this, but they usually don't sound like this.” [“Free Guitar”] is an exploration of the guitar as a set piece, as a trap, as an instrument: a thing that produces a certain kind of sound. There is no generic commitment to anything on that record. Idiom is deployed … not at all. There's no quotation in it, as such, there's merely instantiation. And so, expectation and anticipation become quite abstract. You don't sit there and wait for a chorus. If you're waiting for the chorus, you'll find out after so many minutes, "Doesn't look like there's gonna be a chorus here." That kind of stuff; that's what I mean by logic: creating a logical environment in which you set up a number of operators, you specify relations between them, and the results are what you might call facts. Where logic itself is turned into a kind of score.

I guess I get what he is saying but I find the way he talks, let alone the concept he is describing, to be really charmless. Haven't read the John Lennon Playboy interview, but I suspect its oodles of magnitude more amusing.

(pretend there is an apostrophe up there)

Here's how the interviewer frames the discussion, I doubt Mayo's detailed and technical/theoretical responses were unwelcome:

I was particularly interested in the musical "logic" used to record the album Coconut Hotel. I suspected that the Red Krayola was essentially exploring "free improvisation", contemporaneous with groups like AMM and Musica Elettronica Viva.

(I also doubt Mayo would give the same kind of responses in a Playboy interview, or be asked the same questions!)

xps Shakey I was mostly thinking of Animal Collective, like who is the 2009 Animal Collective of 2019

Here's a recent-ish online Q&A sesh w/Mayo

sidewiththeseeds
What are your thoughts on the Velvet Underground?

MayoThompson
Love them to death

Yeah... I guess when i read interviews w ppl whose music I like I am generally pleasantly surprised by how humble and self-effacing they are. He just rubs me the wrong way in this interview... Which, is fine and to be expected. He's a weirdo. But not my preferred sort I guess.

Thanks for that reddit link (words I never imagined I would type!!!!) he really does seem like a sweet dude. I guess it was just the context of the interview itself that I posted. Or indigestion issues of its reader/would-be interpreter.

I know, I *hate* linking to Reddit, lol

side with the seeds
What are your thoughts on Gaye Bykers on Acid

MayoThompson
Grebo is where it's at

Heh, among other issues the format is maddening to navigate. But, for whatever reasons the AMAs manage to shine at times. (am particularly thinking of the recent Bernie Sanders, David Berman ones...)

I am a big Felt guy and was skimming to see if anyone on there asked him about producing The Poem of the River. iirc Lawrence supposedly recorded his vocals in the dark for that one? And now repudiates the production i think? I personally think it's a very warm-sounding record. The guitar tones alone, wow.

who is the 2009 Animal Collective of 2019

I don't know if there's an answer to that since 2019 hasn't had an album that has dominated the critical conversation like MPP did in 2009.

So at this point, I'm just gonna say Big Thief.

Or Lana Del Rey, since I could see this being the last year where she puts out something that gets a lot of recognition.

^right, that's closer to what I mean. 2009 AC isn't just MPP, it was the peak of a decade of gradually increasing critical respect + (relative) commercial success

LDR fits, first album in 2012 and NFR looks like it could be her masterpiece

It’s not GADPY, it’s GAPDY.

GADPY probably my least favorite ILM acronym, can never remember what it refers to and then of course it's something ridiculously nerdy and specific

― Οὖτις, Thursday, August 15, 2019 9:45 AM (eight minutes ago)

ILM didn't originate this

― bookmarkflaglink (jim in vancouver), Thursday, August 15, 2019 12:56 PM (one hour ago) bookmarkflaglink

Think again!

I always get it wrong xp

Also, there is no GAPDY analogue anymore thanks to poptimism/the reappraisal of R&B/way more rap coverage/ and a general move of music criticism away from "straight white college men elevating other straight white college men"

The whole Mitski/Dacus/Parquet/Soccer Mommy/Barnett/Snail Mail/War on Drugs/Kurt Vile/US Girls/Boygenius axis could have been gappin everything in its absence, but it's not that world anymore

revival of mashup thread makes me think mashups generally have suffered massively in the 2010s and that therefore Girl Talk's legacy must have worsened. but i guess the thread doesn't really work the same way for artists that came onto the scene in the 2000s, and maybe especially not novelty/phenomena things that nobody really expected to be actively listened to years down the road.

that mayo thompson interview doesn't strike me as being insufferable. he's talking about the band's creative process. if he's an asshole for engaging in an interview that goes beyond the "where do you get your ideas from" cliches than i wish there were more thoughtful and articulate assholes like him!

how the xx have fallen as they dont even get added to gapdy anymore

revival of mashup thread makes me think mashups generally have suffered massively in the 2010s and that therefore Girl Talk's legacy must have worsened. but i guess the thread doesn't really work the same way for artists that came onto the scene in the 2000s, and maybe especially not novelty/phenomena things that nobody really expected to be actively listened to years down the road.

i played out a few mashups last friday, and they went down an absolute storm.
you just have to select carefully.
that said, Girl Talk never had a decent flow, i never liked the 100 tracks per minute aspect of his thing.

Gapdyxx?

GADPY probably my least favorite ILM acronym, can never remember what it refers to and then of course it's something ridiculously nerdy and specific
― Οὖτις, Thursday, August 15, 2019 9:45 AM (eight minutes ago)

ILM didn't originate this

― bookmarkflaglink (jim in vancouver), Thursday, August 15, 2019 12:56 PM (one hour ago) bookmarkflaglink

Think again!

― Whiney G. Weingarten, Thursday, August 15, 2019 11:07 AM (fifty-nine minutes ago)

oops.

guys Lennon is five seasons deep on his podcast, but he records it in LA

https://www.earwolf.com/show/questions-for-lennon/

mashups are def in right now, they just gotta be a little funny is all

ha see i preferred girl talk at the 100 track per minute level, and for ages was tinkering on my own version of same. my feeling was that by the 2010 album he's really lost the plot by streamlining it down to much fewer and more obvious samples, the delirium was gone. probably he just didn't have time to craft the things at the same level, having become a worldwide sensation.

I am a big Felt guy and was skimming to see if anyone on there asked him about producing The Poem of the River. iirc Lawrence supposedly recorded his vocals in the dark for that one? And now repudiates the production i think?

Alan only ever asked me to do two things, otherwise he left me on my own. He decided to have a house producer at Creation. He said, “From now on, everyone has got to use the same producer, like at Motown. It will be Mayo Thompson.” In the end, only two of us used Mayo before he was dumped. It didn’t work out at all.
...
You could write a book on that one. I took it here, I took it there; I remixed it. We took it to Robin (Guthrie) to try to rescue it; we chucked two songs off; we wrote two new songs for it. Poem… is a great album and people love it, but it’s like an album with a mental illness. It’s crazy.

https://recordcollectormag.com/articles/lawrence

It’s funny how it has like the EXACT OPPOSITE problem that ignite has

Ha, thanks visiting. I swear I read something, I'm too lazy to look it up right now, where he recorded his vocals in the dark

I do love the original finished product. The guitars sound so warm. I'm the last person to ever be accused of being an audiophile, but I am not a huge fan of the remastered Felt reissues. There is a remoteness, vox and instruments seem distant somehow where they were formerly more intimate. I dunno what that's about, but also granted I don't listen to music mostly under the most ideal audiophile setups. I am a rather crude and simple man, you see...

Bizarre that he would take it to Robin Guthrie, as I thought Lawrence famously hated the production on ignite the seven... regardless, poem is yah kind of a weird record for someone as ocd as he to have put out in its final form. it is essentially a couple of hippie jams bookended by a bizarre "rock" song, the most beautiful jazz-inflected lyrical pop song ever, a dylan-ish tell-off, and a nick drake wadoff. That said, it is so good. PJR is even better and more insane by my standards, but then I love half-assed demo shit in which ppl spend a half hour complaining about the state of the world in two-minute bursts .it is like nutella to a honeybear for me.

brimstead, i'm not even sure what you mean, but preemptory lol. i guess artists are notoriously bad at evaluating their own stuff and what of it appeals to fans, etc.

What podcasts would Genghis Khan, Elagabalus, Socrates, Ching Shih, Helena Blavatsky and Henry 8th be on if they just stuck around a tad longer?

The Bugle

Ching Shih would be a good chapo ep

https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/81sHF0-loUL.jpg

^^^^^^ pretentious as fuck. None of these are as good as Bill & Ted's Excellent Adventure

when I work out Friends is always on, albeit with the volume off. to me the show is just an endless series of long conversations that end in 2 characters making out

― frogbs, Wednesday, July 17, 2019 10:24 AM (one month ago)

Here’s an article about this phenomenon: https://www.theguardian.com/tv-and-radio/2019/aug/21/the-age-of-comfort-tv-why-people-are-secretly-watching-friends-and-the-office-on-a-loop

Not artists, but ideas/attitudes

Something I recently thought about that I haven't thought about in a very long time: the cult of drugs. Those guys who over-mythologize the role of drugs in creativity, searching for the right combination of drugs so they can magically turn into Jimi Hendrix. Have they all died out?

The tradition of building up a band then knocking them down. I wonder why this happened and how deliberate it was, but a lot of people recognized it.
I get the impression that somehow the business only accommodated a small enough number of bands at a time, so people would inevitably grow sick of them. High priority bands that some magazines felt obliged to praise are later left to any reviewer who wants to stick the knife in them?
When paging through music magazines I used to notice bands I was sick of getting this treatment and I started to feel a little ghoulish about being pleased to see them get low scores, felt really bad about it eventually.
How much does this still happen? Why did it ever happen? When did it start and when did it peak?