REM: Classic or dud?

there's an entertaining discussion of the theory that the name of the band might come from Ralph Eugene Meatyard, whose photography Stipe studied and whose aesthetic is suggestive of r.e.magery

Yeah, I can't wait to read this, although my ideal R.E.M. book would be where the band go through each song from beginning to end and detail inspirations, who wrote what, studio experiences, what some of the more cryptic lyrics mean etc.

This band meant so much to me that I've been reluctant to pick up any books about them but I totally recommend the Lurie book. It took me back to times related to the band (discovered them between Reckoning and Fables) and not (the description of Athens circa ~1980 reminded me of early 90s Champaign). Didn't much appreciate his theorizing on the meaning of songs on/after Fables, but so much of the book is lovingly researched and thoughtful. I was kind of sad to finish it.

Begin the Begin: R.E.M.’s Early Years is pretty amazing. Lurie did a ton of research, found and interviewed a lot of people who haven’t gone on the record before, and as far as I can tell from my own experiences 1979-83 gets all the details right. As a biography of the band, it’s definitive. In many ways it’s more informative as a history of the early Athens scene than Party Out of Bounds and Athens, GA Inside Out.

I'm reading Begin the Begin and wholly enjoying it so far. I'm at the part where R.E.M. have opened for XTC and signed with I.R.S. instead of RCA. It's acronym pandemonium.

R.E.M. and XTC played at the B&L iirc

https://flagpole.com/music/music-features/2018/04/18/random-athens-memories-remember-when-xtc-and-r-e-m-shared-a-bill

Gonna have to read that book. I'm always intrigued to learn more about all the early '80s Athens stuff that I was living right in the midst of and had no idea was happening because I was four.

the drinking age in Georgia was 18 then so you could probably have gotten into the clubs with a fake ID

can't believe four-year-old lunch was such a square smdh

Always meant to ask my parents for physical descriptions of my babysitters on the offchance that maybe like Fred Schneider wound up reading me bedtime stories at some point.

That book was a lot of fun to read. Really got me thinking about how much my fandom of the band affected me during some big life changes/memories. It's a pretty well written music book and my copy is already lent out.

maybe like Fred Schneider wound up reading me bedtime stories at some point.

"Goodnight mouse, and Good-NIGHT-HOUUUSE!! Goodnight, KITTENS! Goodnight, MITTENS!"

irl lol

REM releases an unreleased track, Peter Buck and Mike Mills have stayed musically active (and have of course legally agreed to play Adam Scott's backyard, reunion permitting), Billy Berry has been making the odd public appearance playing music again ... I bet these dudes won't be able to stay away from getting back together for much longer.

but there are so many more old albums to remix in surround sound!

Got to agree with you. It is the funniest breakup/retirement going.

I mean, it's not uncommon for individual band members to stay musically active after a band breaks up(?)

Well, Bill was the most "retired" of the batch. The fact that he is active at all musically is the most promising development. Also, the fact that when Mills and Buck were asked, however jokingly, to reunite to play a BBQ, neither said "that's not going to happen, ever," which is something you'd hear from a lot of bands, especially this close to the original breakup. Don't know what Stipe is up to, exactly, but consider that virtually no band with all living members has stayed broken up besides the Smiths and CCR, plus the prospect of $$$, and ...

They should do an IRS years tour or classic album tour. I'd actually consider going to see something like that.

Cocteau Twins, there's another one whose whole line-up is alive that hasn't reunited. They came close, but no cigar.

the whole band being based around a couple who separate acrimoniously aspect is important there, i feel.

REM reunion I'm very ambivalent about because i think it would be kind of lame and there is a bunch of REM material i have no interest in but i would probably buy a ticket if they came to town and it wasn't too exorbitant

i might be wrong, but it feels like the world needs a stipe solo record with an allstar cast of producer and / or helping hands.

no former bandmates allowed, though.

I'd love to see them play in a chill small venue but not in an arena again (even though KC stadium in a monsoon was actually great :I'll Take The Rain followed by Have You Ever Seen The Rain)

I think Bill's only recent shows have been local fundraising events, I can't imagine him wanting to leave the farm for a reunion tour

For sure.

the whole band being based around a couple who separate acrimoniously aspect is important there, i feel.

But hey, Stereolab just reunited, I never expected that!

FWIW, Stipey's been doing solo stuff too: https://www.stereogum.com/2042301/michael-stipe-new-solo-song-your-capricious-soul/video/

I could see them all coming together for a special occasion but I don't anticipate these guys are going to do another world tour.

I would like to see a Mike Mills solo album, maybe with involvement from Berry. Don't care if there's a tour or not - Bill can stay on the farm! But I'd like to hear what a Mike Mills album sounds like.

you know after reading the Lurie book and reading about Stipe's side projects in the early days, that's the one I would want to hear.

I miss them. In the minority and I've said it a million times, but I think they were always really good. They had a very rich musical background and, at their best, were able to create a very American kind of music in a way that I don't really see happening again.

what is a very American kind of music

i am not american but i think i know what tim means. wilco would be another example i think. or bruce springsteen.

Mike Mills did make a solo-album

I would contribute money to hoping they stay retired: I love the good albums too much. Then again, streaming revenue from a catalog is so pathetic that bands don't sully their legacies anymore with reunion tours and what-not.

This is not a band where financial pressures would force them back into a reunion tour. When the band renewed their Warner contract in the mid 1990s for tens of millions of dollars, they are said to have invested the money well. If I recall correctly, in a post-<i>Collapse into Now</i> interview Mike Mils scoffed at the idea of a reunion tour because "it's not like he would have difficulties putting his kid through college".

That was my sense too.

Yeah I mean if they do reform it's because they actually want to and, fantastic as the live shows were, they gave every impression of hating touring. So I just don't think it's going to happen and that's fine.

My affection for REM embraces every twist and turn of their story. I don't NEED them to reunite or record or do anything in particular. Dayenu; it would have been enough if they'd all vanished after Monster or Up or Around the Sun or, heck, Automatic FTP. The essential music is there and always will be.

If they want to do more things, good for them; if they don't, cool. Everything I truly need from them is within my memory and can always be called to mind when I want it.

They totally seem like the sort of band that would secretly reunite, record a few songs, then release them as previously unreleased tracks. Like when Camper Van Beethoven released its track by track cover of "Tusk" they claimed was from the vaults, even though it was really an experiment to see if they could all get along together before reuniting for real. I want to say the same was true for another CVB "rarities" comp ("Camper Van Beethoven Is Dead. Long Live Camper Van Beethoven").

I saw Mike and Pete with The Baseball Project back in July in a venue that held maybe around 150, and it was terrific. I saw the band once, live, on the GREEN tour, and wish I could have seen them again. But as of now I can easily just rest on the existing discography.

what is a very American kind of music

Well, obviously, not one thing or one hundred things, but I’m interested in music that is evocative of its actual versus its conceptual environment. Growing up in California, that was a huge part of what was so mind-blowing about R.E.M. Their southern qualities were very palpable and I don’t think it was a put-on in the slightest. As they got farther away, living and recording outside the south, I think they did lose some of that, but on Collapse Into Now, there’s still things like “Walk It Back,” “take the leading chair at the fairground,” etc.

re: very kind of American music...there seem to be a lot of takes wondering where their legacy will end up, and increasingly I think The Band is the most likely outcome. Deified in their lifetime, but ultimately just a really good (American) band that moved the needle, perhaps less musically, and more as inspiration.

There was an article written around the time of Reveal where the author had interviewed band members, and he noted that they were spending most of their time in perfectly air-conditioned, posh five-star hotels around the world, "about as far as one could get from actual rock 'n' roll inspiration". At that time and ever since, there has seemed to be little distinctly American about them – so much of the buzz around Reveal happened in the UK or on the continent. At best, the band could represent New York City thanks to Stipe’s fondness for it, but anywhere provincial like Athens was already left far behind them.

in further news, U2 and The Thrills now represent Southern California exclusively

sometimes the UK like bands *because* they sound American?

https://pitchfork.com/thepitch/haim-and-the-uk-success-of-quintessentially-california-bands/?&cf=1

makes you think

the reason i mentioned it is just that it kind of raises an eyebrow in the same way that describing someone as "all american kind of guy" does - invariably, they're talking about white people. not calling out tim or anyone else (until relatively recently i would have agreed that REM or The Band sounds like platonic "american music" - i realize it's a kind of accepted musical genre term, for better or worse), just calling attention to it to make sure the term actually makes sense to use. i mean...would you describe something like Son House or Miles Davis as very American kind of music? it would be accurate to do so, but usually what we mean is that there are white guys with guitars playing it

Uncut magazine had the biggest boner for a certain kind of American music.

didn't realize uncircumcised music was back on the up and up

xpost It was kind of fascinating how big of an impact the Band apparently made on UK stars. George Harrison called them "the best band in the history of the universe.” There's a quote from Clapton: “I used to put it on as soon as I checked into my hotel room, do the gig and be utterly miserable, then rush back and put the tape on and go to sleep contented until I woke up the next morning and remembered who I was and what I was doing. (Music from Big Pink] was that potent)." The Band was supposedly the impetus for him leaving Cream, and also iirc the birth of Derek and the Dominos.

not quite sure i buy the dominance of the "American=white" trope, in this particular case. i'm thinking of e.g. greil marcus - whatever his other faults, his 'america' in music (the major theme in mystery train) is defined by sly stone and robert johnson as much as anybody else. and people are fond of namechecking jazz, hip-hop and rock as american contributions to the history of music writ large, though i'll admit that probably a lot of those people picture white people when they think of rock.

There's definitely a ton of references to what I'd call Americana and US history in their lyrics as well as many references to less familiar US towns.

I agree that R.E.M. falls into a continuum of bands that engaged with the concept of Americana (e.g., the Band, the Dead, the Beach Boys, 10,000 Maniacs, etc.), in a way that's not so true of the Replacements or Black Flag or Husker Du, etc.

(actually I don't know a lot about Husker Du, so forget that example; just namechecking some roughly contemporaneous & celebrated acts)