US Politics April 2019 Thread: 'I find that pretty hard to believe'

/‘strike-replacement high school teacher’

so... a scab? this fuckin’ guy/

otm, who would ever do that, let alone admit to that

otoh not sure why he’d go out of his way to point that out on twitter and i know frothing in indignation is the point of this thread so carry on i suppose

You can just not have school imo

Oh? Where will my students get ⅔ of their meals?

Should they just play in front of crack houses all day, or stay inside and watch tv?

you sound like a well meaning twitter left dilettante who knows nothing abt the realities of schooling imo

sorry abt shots fired but no, you can’t just not have school if you care abt kids

frothing in indignation is the point of this thread so carry on i suppose

...

yes! Proof it’s endemic and contagious in these threads right here

carry on!

*slithers off*

sorry abt shots fired but no, you can’t just not have school if you care abt kids

yah but are a lot of options between “leave children to the wolves” and “undermine people who care (maybe the most) deeply about kids”

otm

look sorry I got mad. I teach chem and physics. Ok sure, you can just not learn chem and physics I totally agree. But school is a lot more than science class. Here’s a not exhaustive list of things students in just my ap chem class rely on school for

— aforementioned breakfast lunch and afternoon snack
— safe place for children as young as 10 to be during day
— peace of mind for working parents of those children
— safe haven from ICE and CBP, DACA counseling
— health care (examples: free supplies for students with chronic health conditions such as diabetes, free feminine and sexual health products, free triage from school nurse for more serious acute conditions)
— mental health counseling (for students with depression, ptsd, etc)
— family therapy (esp popular with lgbtq students and survivors of domestic abuse)
— library
— internet access
— place to play sports
— work permits, financial aid

etc etc

I mean I have a kid whose bedroom is a walk in closet in a motel six. Where’s he gonna go if there is no school?

well as a union teacher I’ll tell you I wouldn’t strike if I thought the school would actually close during a strike and I don’t feel undermined by non union subs in the least

I forgot we also give out free clothes, provide public transport vouchers and have a food bank

this all is actually why I support teach-ins as opposed to strikes

you are otm and I’m sorry you have to explain this basic shit

signed, s.o. of a middle school teacher

it’s okay the one constant in public service is that everyone who doesn’t do it is an absolute expert on it

You can absolutely temporarily not have school, forcing the district to negotiate with the union. It also means that it won’t have to happen in the future if management realizes labor is willing to use its power.

Similar excuses can be made for all manner of scabbing and it’s never acceptable.

There is also the tactic of the "rolling strike", where a subset of teachers walk out on successive days.

oh phew the experts are here

Yes rolling strikes are a thing, probably not as good a starting move as teach-ins imo, also yes sometimes as in w.va as a last resort general lockout strikes are necessary, i’ll agree w that

if you concede that last point, tlg, then what exactly are you arguing w ppl abt?

i support teach ins before strikes (not ruling out strikes) because children and families are stakeholders and teach-ins help them become educated about the issues so they can have a voice in the process (and so that we get the right verdict in the court of popular opinion)

xp well i suppose i don’t rightly know, carry on and peace out then, hopefully (for everyone) last time i make the mistake of checking in here

It would be interesting to now how many teachers are currently working in districts where the contract has expired, but school continues to operate as it normally would. From my observation, this seems to happen a lot.

My father was the president of his teacher's union when I was 11 years old. My mom was an officer in her teacher's union. Portland teachers came close enough to striking that year that the district sought and got a court injunction against it. Our family was carefully instructed what to do if both our parents were in jail. I can hardly say this makes me an expert of any sort. I was only 11 at the time, but I do come from a family filled with teachers, including the one I married. The profession is hardly opaque to me after many decades of shop talk at the dinner table.

actually i do know, i’m arguing in favor of one’s right to be a scab and for the necessity of scabs, because all men are brothers and because it’s not always just about your personal interest, but fuck it who cares

xp thanks for aimsplaining it to me

Scabbing undermines brotherhood and the collective good.

xp thanks for aimsplaining it to me

Imagine saying this after advertising your expertise in the face of all these other people who just don't get it.

eh fuck off

aimsplaining it to me

jeez you're irritable. I was relating my personal history.

you right, sorry

i thought the whole thing of being a scab is that you're prioritizing your personal interest over the collective?

fwiw my experience of this is limited to graduate worker organizing (TAs and RAs) so i imagine there's just tons that doesn't translate. but, TLG, i don't think anyone here is saying that if a union has planned and structured an action in such a way that *by design* classes will continue and that replacement teachers of some kind are part of the plan, that it would be bad to be a replacement teacher under the union's terms. (tho not knowing the ins and outs, it strikes me as weird to design a strike in such a way rather than either withholding teaching or arranging partial teaching on your own terms.)

but if the union's job action involves not teaching by design, then someone stepping in to teach and allow the boss to continue business as usual is being a scab and undermining the union's ability to bargain effectively for the collective....... right? or is your position not so much "i want to defend these scabs" as "i want to oppose this kind of strike for teachers' unions, because i think they're harmful to the students, and think instead they should only pursue job actions that has these kinds of limits/guarantees for the sake of the children?"

i really haven't followed a lot of teachers' strikes - have there been a lot that failed to address the kids' food needs, etc.? because that does seem like a real problem, and also a huge liability in terms of winning the public relations battle so it'd surprise me if that was a recurrent thing. but this could expose me as a total naïf.

today in euphemisms

Fact check: At a rally on Saturday in Green Bay, Wisconsin, President Trump revived an inaccurate refrain about doctors “executing babies” https://t.co/Xc6JyVg5wh

— The New York Times (@nytimes) April 28, 2019

xp i know that in w va teachers packed bag lunches for kids using their own personal $$$

Idk I don’t have a union to my dismay but I support the right to strike for everyone including teachers, EMTs, home health aides, firefighters, and children. Kids to the pickets.

Anyway u know I’m a chaos agent just fp me

No kid of mine gonna cross the picket line if their teachers are striking (jk I won’t have kids)

late great: are you saying it should be illegal for teachers to strike because they provide a service that is essential to public welfare and safety? do you think the recent strikes in W. Va and LA were tactically or morally bad?

fwiw LAUSD managed to provide a safe space for kids to be, without hiring scab teachers, during their ~2 week strike in the second biggest school district in the country.

it wasn't easy, and it wasn't a great experience for the kids. but it's possible. and (in hindsight) pretty much the the entirity of LA thinks the strike was a huge success for the kids of LA (as evidenced by the insanely pro-union result in the one school board election since the strike).

here's an example of how this impacted parents (and obviously poor families were more impacted by most of this stuff): https://laist.com/2019/01/08/lausd_teachers_strike_guide_for_parents.php. you're right that striking isn't free. schools are community resources and if they close that hurts the community.

but look at the outcome of the LA strike! they'd already won the pay increase *before* they went on strike. the strike was about class sizes, libraries, nurses, counseling, etc. (see https://www.nybooks.com/daily/2019/01/23/the-striking-demands-of-la-teachers/).

TLG your list of essential things schools provide to the community was ... not being provided. your list was pretty much their list of things they were striking about.

i don't think it should be illegal for teachers to strike and i wouldn't want to draw analogies between what i do and what, say, air traffic controllers or cops or firefighters do

i don't think the strike in w.va (which lasted a day or two iirc?) was tactically or morally bad. i didn't think so at the time, either. i don't think the strike in LA was tactically bad, and i certainly wouldn't presume to call it immoral.

i wouldn't be comfortable with my school closing for two weeks, but if my school wasn't providing those services to my students then

then i might be

tlg I appreciate yr take on things and your posts here even when I don't agree 100%

As opposed to some other regulars who post 100% garbage, reading this on mobile reminds me again why I use killfile.

🥺

dang

Y'all --

Richard Lugar died, a bygone relic of an age of bipartisan contempt for liberals.

he always reminded me of those battery people in the old Duracell commercials