17 Indie Artists on Their Oddest Odd Jobs That Pay the Bills When Music Doesn’t (not a poll)

I suppose the artist gets the self-indulgent thrill of creating something, but only in the short term. Of course, lack of recognition and lack of financial success can be demoralising and lead to apathy and a "what's the point?" attitude.

for some reason this is making me laugh ...

I forget some of you can't grasp the concept of enjoying doing something

― Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Saturday, April 13, 2019 8:23 AM (three hours ago)

otm x 10,000 -- being American, I know that matt does not get otm government subsidies

I Don't Enjoy Making Music

Paul, you’re making my point for me... Bedroom artists had ways of “succeeding” in the past, and they still do today (your pointless snark around CSH notwithstanding)

Also, FWIW, Barlow already had a rep from Dino Jr., he didn’t come out of nowhere

Sure, but the technology has changed so much that now you can make Low with a near-zero budget, if you have the time and creativity.

I would argue that you couldn't, and that one might try and set out to make Low with a near-zero budget, but what you'd end up with is the kind of characterless "in the box" sterility which characterises the music of this decade which already sounds stagnant and, dare I say it, cheap. The fact that you then go on to list artists using the laptop-and-Ableton combo says it all. I personally think there's a world of difference between music made "in the box" vs. what Daft Punk did on Random Access Memories.

Indeed. If a painting is commissioned and not sold or even looked at, then it has been a waste in the long term, no matter how enjoyable the process of creating the work was in the first place. If the work wasn't commissioned, then I suppose the artist gets the self-indulgent thrill of creating something, but only in the short term. Of course, lack of recognition and lack of financial success can be demoralising and lead to apathy and a "what's the point?" attitude.

Please feel free to GTFO. Painting, speaking from the perspective of a completely unsuccessful painter in terms of sales or even exhibitions, is something that is a lifelong pursuit and the means by which I come to terms with what consciousness is, how I organize thoughts and in fact the very act of perception and cognition. It is not a self-indulgent thrill, it's hard fucking work that sometimes pays off in unexpected ways but just as often is completely demoralizing strictly on its own terms, to say nothing of showing them or selling them. Yet somehow, for some reason, I continue to pursue it because it is a way for me to engage creatively with being a person. It's sad that you can't understand it but it's clear you have no idea what you're talking about.

many xposts

As for the notion that Skip Spence "made it", I would argue that he didn't. The small fame that he has in music critic circles is all based on the fact that he didn't "make it", and the small fame surrounding Oar is entirely based on natrative ("hey dudes, listen to this recording made by someone who was totally mental!") rather than the music itself.

*narrative

Jesus.

xxxpost:

Yet, you actually - whether you're aware of it or not - agreed with exactly what I was getting at!

at the expense of shy and awkward geniuses who might be creating the next Tusk, Dark Side of the Moon, Abbey Road, Low, or Avalon

Circling back quickly — Paul, were you suggesting that the artists who recorded (say) Low and Avalon were awkward introverts who never would have made it in today’s Instagram-focused times?

I certainly don't agree with a single thing you've said on this thread. Your opinions are garbage and I regret even letting your nonsense enter my consciousness.

That's not how it read, but fair enough - you now have a reason to paint a watercolour and feel demoralised about it afterwards.

Getting a wee bit too cocky these days, son. Remember what happened last time?

Turrican is being a total cock but the FPs will fall as they may

- it totally fucking sucks to be part of that 22% and to be out on tour and find that the promoter has just opted not to invest the time and take a loss on the show, and you drove three hours to play to six people, the show just isn't listed in the papers or even at the venue, this happens to people all the time

I started not knowing about gigs being on when 3/4 of the papers went away (including the dance music one) and also people started listing gigs exclusively on Facebook

Sometimes people just decide to go whole-hog and embrace Patreon and Kickstarter-- in many ways, I have to respect Amanda Palmer for being the most quintessentially American musician for, somehow, turning a monstrous profit with such little talent or personal magnetism.

she absolutely has personal magnetism: lots of people are repelled by her, a sufficient amount are strongly attracted.

Well, this is not a case of opposites attract. I am repelled by her but I oddly admire how extreme she has been in riding her learjet of virtue all the way to Australia.

And yes, I have NO IDEA what's going on in the city any more, aside from Facebook events, and we still have a free weekly here. Personally I miss local message boards and wish they'd never went away

Circling back quickly — Paul, were you suggesting that the artists who recorded (say) Low and Avalon were awkward introverts who never would have made it in today’s Instagram-focused times?

― get your hand outta my pocket universe (morrisp), Saturday, April 13, 2019 3:36 PM (fifty minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

No - I would not call Bowie or Ferry introverted at all. I was merely suggesting that the person who today might make records as great as Low or Avalon may also be a weirdo person who is afraid of social media, leery of anything with a whiff of networking, and maybe doesn't enjoy playing live

And I’m having trouble thing of many artists fitting that bill who achieved great popularity (and $$$) in the past; at least the “didn’t enjoy playing live” part. But there have always been Jandek types who achieved their own kind of success.

Steely Dan, Kate Bush, XTC...

...The Beatles after 1966

literally almost every big rapper today doesn't really play live until after they are big, they might enjoy it though

The Beatles didn’t have to tour anymore, they were established super-mega-stars. As for the other artists you listed, I could probably list rough equivalents today (keeping in mind that styles and “the industry” have changed, but not in a “it’s all Instagram’s fault” way).
xp

...and UMS makes my point that there are a whole other set of avenues for artists to “make it” today who might not have before, which is why I don’t follow Paul’s “it’s a net loss” argument.

Can you elucidate? Explain how you think a budding Kate Bush living in a small town is going to "make it" in 2019?

the new model has been a boon to savvy but dull people making mediocre-at-best music at the expense of shy and awkward geniuses

Like if you’re such a crippling shy & awkward genius that you’re not even interested or able to get your music heard today (of all eras), how would you have done in the ‘70s? Sent a demo to Virgin Records and hoped for the best?

xp that is, with no industry contacts and no rich and / or famous mom or dad

by adventuring on a riverboat or something iirc

How was Kate Bush “discovered”? I honestly don’t know

Like if you’re such a crippling shy & awkward genius that you’re not even interested or able to get your music heard today (of all eras), how would you have done in the ‘70s? Sent a demo to Virgin Records and hoped for the best?

umm...yes?

Kate Bush is maybe a bad example because iirc from her biography her family was pretty wealthy, which would have made a life in art a lot easier than it would be for, say, a single mom working at a Rite Aid in Pittsburgh

xp — And that’s better than today, when an actual small-town kid like Will Toledo was able to gather an initial following by putting his shit online? The fact that you think he sucks is irrelevant, your “Kate Bush equivalent” could do it too.

Who is Matador not signing b/c (in your opinion) they’re wasting their money on Will? Your point is, “We’ll never know, but that person wile at least have had a fighting chance in an era where they would have been hopelessly obscure rather than have avenues to get attention!”

For one thing, Car Seat Headrest afaict do not make the kind of music that would necessitate a budget like the one given to, let's say for example, Portishead (more shy people who did alright under the old model). For another thing, I acknowledge that Will Toledo, as much as I dislike his music, might have been a bonafide star if he'd released the same records in 1996. He might also be a millionaire. At the very least he'd be doing better than he is now.

How was Kate Bush “discovered”? I honestly don’t know

Not only was her family well-off but they shared a mutual friend with David Gilmour, who thus heard her demo when she was 16. You can still make it with those kinds of connections.

xp Which I guess circles back to the original post. Does Car Seat Headrest pay the bills? If it does now, will it always?

(these are rhetorical questions, obviously, because a) I recognize that it's tacky to speculate about the finances of a perfect stranger and b) I have no idea what CSH makes)

What, are we comparing the relative shyness(es) of different artists now?

I assume Will T. doesn’t need a day job, don’t know about the other guys he plays with. Once they’re in their 30s & 40s? Guess the hope is to become a band like Spoon which makes indie rock into a sustainable grown-up lifestyle, there’s never been many like that though.

My point is that there are (and will be) fewer and fewer like that under the current model

oh no there will only be 2150468741857139850 indie bands

we're friends with a legitimately great singer/songwriter who went back to work recently, partially because she's been a single mom with two kids. she doesn't really fit in a particular easy hip niche except being amazing at what she does, and despite being enough of a name to have a c/d thread on here and maybe 10-12 albums released along with several others in a group, she's likely never going to make a living at that alone unless there's an unexpected breakthrough, but if she was releasing albums 30-40 years ago she'd likely be doing pretty well for herself. as it is, i'm proud of her for just having a positive attitude and holding down a music career and a day gig and having kids.

I've narrowed it down to three possible candidates and I love all three artists

oh no there will only be 2150468741857139850 indie bands

yes there are 2150468741857139850 indie bands making a living playing music in 2019. Why, I cant even order a latte these days without being served by one of them

if she was releasing albums 30-40 years ago she'd likely be doing pretty well for herself

she almost definitely would not be going back to work

xp ok? i'm sure ppl who sell fidget spinners probably have to do more than solely that btwn now + eternity to make a living too. who cares.

(xp) Would she have had 10-12 albums out? There were a lot of singer songwriters back then who were pretty talented who never got beyond one album and guess what they did next? They went back to work.

There's re-writing the history books and then there's re-writing the history books and turning them into fairy tales.

Yeah, the catalogs of the week in the ‘70s & ‘80s are littered with obscure bands and solo artists who had one or two albums, maybe a few, and then were dropped and that was that. I have a hard time believing that it’s somehow “more difficult than ever before” now to make a long-term career as a rock ‘n roll artist.

(Somehow the phrase “major labels” got changed to the word “week”(!) in the first line of my post above)

And saying “well Steely Dan did it” is coming it at from the wrong end.... Open that “Terrible ‘70s album titles” thread and tell me how many of those people never had to go back to work. Maybe they didn’t need side jobs in the few years they were under contract, but what does that amount to? If indie labels had existed then like today, they maybe could have kept releasing albums, but still would have needed day jobs.