Fleabag

I assumed the audience asides come straight from the stage show

They do and it's a more theatrical gesture than a televisual one since the audience is right there. Doing it on a TV show isn't that unusual but thinking but the shift makes it interesting, it goes from being you to ...who?

this is the best tv show of all time

I personally find the priest character a difficult to believe but have enough faith in FWB to think that he's supposed to be - or that he's not supposed to be but we'll find out later why is like he is and i'll suddenly believe in him.

On the other hand, Killing Eve was not believable, to me, in any way really (I saw two episodes). I do not want to be condescending, and apologies if it sounds so BUT I wonder If Martin McDonagh put her up to writing a serial killer thing which does not seem to be her register at all, based on the episodes I forced myself to finish.

People either loved or hated that, I know. the standard crit that it was "all over the place" is what I felt about it. So many things seemed like they were supposed to be funny but were not at all, for me.

I love the asides and the extremity of it all

I don't think Killing Eve was supposed to be "believable." I liked it for its stylishness, seductiveness and acting.

what's an unbelievable serial killer drama other than that, though?

I mean, what is it other than unbelievable? Reckless, gratuitous, pointless, dangerous? Ah, right, entertaining.

also, stylish, which it wasn't.

Sorry, I know I'm talking to myself here but and no offence is intended to anyone that liked it but... what's the intention in making a TV show about a female serial killer (which there are a notably small number of) and making it (allegedly) stylish and funny? FWB is a good writer but she had just started going out with a man that makes notably misjudged, but highly praised, serial killing/revenge "comedies" when she came out with KE.

a lot of notably's there.

Ugh, no, not the ‘woman takes on new partner’s interests by osmosis’ thing and BTW although she likes her job, Villanelle is better described as a contract killer.

how much were the books written in that tone? I haven't read them but got the impression they were 'irreverent' or what have you

No idea, but it’s worth remembering that until very recently, Luke Jennings was the Guardian’s very underemployed dance critic.

ug myself a bit of a hole there. ignore those posts, i was steaming.

dug

ohhh, I didn't know who she was dating. something new to look up.

although i've seen plenty of people in the performance writing/creating world partner off and whose work gets suddenly bad because both sides of the partnership start to agree with each other too much and privately clearly do so much more. that's what i was trying to get at, i think, but it's midsjudged up there. apologies.

xpost

i loved Killing Eve but actually just popped in here to say how wonderful this series of Fleabag is. It’s touching and funny and really really smart.

and the performances and script are better than ever.

I'm rewatching s1 - the idea that she's talking to Boo is tempting but doesn't actually make much sense. In the pilot she introduces us to a bunch of characters Boo would already have known.

what's the intention in making a TV show about a female serial killer (which there are a notably small number of) and making it (allegedly) stylish and funny

whatever the intention, it might as well be ascribed to Sally Woodward Gentle, who optioned the books and commissioned PWB to develop the adaptation. She's certainly gone for "stylish and funny" aproaches to serious and murdery material in the past.

I'm ashamed enough about those posts!

<3

fwiw, Villanelle seemed styled rather than stylish. the pink puffy dress etc. is just a costume designer's project that would have been reigned in by a competent director.

again, saw 2 episodes so that might be bollocks.

but with regard to the theatre/tv binary discussed upthread, costuming of that sort the kind of thing you can do in the theatre.

or in a Peter Greenaway film.

I've just caught up and this season is tremendous imo

Anyone still complaining about her poshness can STFU, tonight’s was INCREDIBLE.

When I heard they were making a second season I didn't think it was a good idea. The first season seemed like such a neat open-and-shut story that it would be a mistake to try to follow it up. I no longer understand why I thought that.

I feel like I could easily watch a hundred episodes tbh

i'm not sure i could take a hundred episodes of that. you tune in expecting 30 minutes of quirky comedy and then she does her little monologue...

she's too good for this creepy priest! it can't possibly end well, I just wanted her to get out.

^

I was so disappointed in the priest at the end. I know I should have seen it coming, but fuck off

oh i haven’t seen the latest ep yet. will stay off thread. but yes he was clearly creepy.

I was so disappointed in the priest at the end. I know I should have seen it coming, but fuck off

I was just relieved it wasn't worse, tbh.

YOU HAD 1 JOB

If that’s creepy, I want more creepiness in my life.

kneel

just started watching this. 3 eps in. enjoying it. i think i've spotted a plot point - she is the one who had sex with her friend's boyfriend, that provoked the suicide/manslaughter incident

Yeah that was covered in series one. I can't remember if he was Boo's boyfriend or just a guy she fancied

she's too good for this creepy priest! it can't possibly end well, I just wanted her to get out.

My feelings exactly

Anyone else think that this series is more of a drama than a comedy?

iirc S1 took a real turn around ep 4 where it was clear that it was aiming to be more ambitious than "just" a comedy. this season that ambition feels baked in from the beginning.

Just remembering the moment in the first ep of this season around the restaurant table where literally no one in her family had realised that Claire isn't a lawyer

Anyone else think that this series is more of a drama than a comedy?

i agree and i don't care. the first series was great, and this is even sharper.

I think the first series def tried harder to be a comedy (and succeeding). I'd say the new series is indeed drama, and that's great.

otoh I *literally* laugh out loud at this more than basically anything else that's on right now. her smashing the award within microseconds of handling it was sort of a hack gag but her performance and the editing completely sold it, for instance.

Finished season two yesterday. It's really amazing, but also quite complex and bittersweet. I loved Martin's big speech as an example of everything you shouldn't say, all 'it's not my fault! I can't help it! you just have to deal with me!' I still haven't really figured out what I thought of the very end, but it seemed to me that both fleabag and hot alcoholic priest decided to keep on working on themselves.

there is exactly one completely horrible person in the series and it's Martin

He was too awful to my taste, at times it really made Claire seem bad as well. He was being so awful to her sister!

Godmother is giving him some serious competition there IMO

most definitely

she's at least consciously and sometimes maliciously bad, and Martin is just a flailing douchebag

Also, the way Gelman delivered that speech was so unexpectedly great; this blubbering pile of terrified vulnerability that still manages to be completely unbearable while being self-aware about how unbearable he is. When I was watching it, I had a very strong "I identify with and wholly reject this" reaction.

Otm. I completely get the feeling. Why does my girlfriend keep getting annoyed that I never do anything I promise her that I'll do, I'm bad at remembering stuff, it's not my fault, she should write it down to me, including specific instructions, it's not my fault!

It's kinda male privilege in the extreme. Or in another way, he's at step one of the twelve step program, and has just decided it's easier to stop there.

I think I'd feel horrible rewatching just for that monologue, but now that you mention it, it's really is *chef kiss* bad

I kept wondering if the part was written with Gelman in mind. I can't imagine anyone else in the role.

Yeah, he really goes for that energy. I kinda hated him in Lemon, though.

His greatest work remains 1,000 Cats.

as per colbert interview, apparently gelman's agent was directly contacted by Amazon's casting people for the part and flew out to the UK the next day for filming.

anyways, my gelman love is always based around his work in Eagleheart which should've gotten him an honorary Tony and/or Pulitzer

Gelman is so good at being an asshole I kind of just assume he is one.

i totally just misremembered The Walking Dead and thought Gelman also played Gregory. Totally different actor.

I’m rarely shocked by anything on a show but when Fleabag shoved her godmother back against the wall in s1 ep5 it was really something. Not even a satisfying moment and just this really raw and believable thing. It also set up the moment of her punching Martin at dinner, since by now it was very much in character, and much later in terms of general show tone made the moment where Martin grabs her by the (cashmere) sweater in an aggressive threatening moment genuinely frightening.

Forgive the thread spam, but I wanted to note that this show's 2019 season is nominated in the 2019 ILX TV poll:

ILX's Best Television of 2019 Poll / VOTING AND CAMPAIGNING THREAD / Voting Ends January 31

If you like this show and you'd like to see it have a good showing in the poll (running in February) all you need to do is submit a ballot including it and your other favorites (4 minimum, 25 maximum, organized by your favorite to least favorite) to forksclovetofu at gmail by end of day today. It'll take five minutes; get to it!