i never heard anything other than "red snapper" because "lol she was a redhead and the carpet matched the drapes"
― sarahell, Friday, 8 March 2019 06:55 (five years ago) link
“I’m going to put this red snapper into your red snapper” was Cole’s quote of himself iirc
― steven, soda jerk (sic), Friday, 8 March 2019 08:37 (five years ago) link
”...Let’s see how your red snapper likes this red snapper!” That was it. It was the nose of the fish, and that girl must have come 20 times. But it was nothing malicious or harmful, no way! No one was ever hurt.
― steven, soda jerk (sic), Friday, 8 March 2019 08:55 (five years ago) link
As Mike said you don't know people's triggers but also I think you would, frankly, get an angry reaction from some punters and who wants to deal with that for the sake of playing these tracks?
Absolutely, I should have mentioned that too - I've been visualising a good mood turning sour, and who wants that indeed?
― mike t-diva, Friday, 8 March 2019 10:22 (five years ago) link
Sic, first, even if you take that quote as definitive proof of anything (which uh), it comes from Richard Cole, not from a band member. The story in Hammer of the Gods, which is what I was commenting on, was that the members of the band were responsible and the acts it describes go further than what Cole describes himself doing (and would have probably resulted in injury). Second, Carmine Appice has also claimed that he was the one responsible. Afaik, no women have ever come forward to say they were involved.
I've said before on ilx that I do consider what the band did to Ellen Sander horrifying and defensible, and much worse than any of these groupie stories. (Obv doesn't affect my appreciation of the music.)
― All along there is the sound of feedback (Sund4r), Friday, 8 March 2019 12:57 (five years ago) link
that's probably why I said Cole
― steven, soda jerk (sic), Friday, 8 March 2019 13:03 (five years ago) link
Why did they have a fish in the hotel room?
― Trϵϵship, Friday, 8 March 2019 13:05 (five years ago) link
*indefensible xps
OK, but, then, even Cole was debunking something more than just the type of marine creature involved.
― All along there is the sound of feedback (Sund4r), Friday, 8 March 2019 13:06 (five years ago) link
relative to the story in HOTG
― All along there is the sound of feedback (Sund4r), Friday, 8 March 2019 13:07 (five years ago) link
Why did they have a fish in the hotel room?― Trϵϵship, Friday, March 8, 2019 1:05 PM (ten minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
― Trϵϵship, Friday, March 8, 2019 1:05 PM (ten minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
You could fish from your balcony.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Edgewater
― ☮ (peace, man), Friday, 8 March 2019 13:17 (five years ago) link
I guess it's not really an ironclad debunking as much as that a story that always sounded like bs has multiple competing versions with afaik no one still defending the original version and no evidence in its favour.
― All along there is the sound of feedback (Sund4r), Friday, 8 March 2019 13:47 (five years ago) link
the grossest thing about that was how giddy it made Frank Zappa, who immediately wrote a terrible song about it
― frogbs, Friday, 8 March 2019 14:22 (five years ago) link
Sure, but he did that all the time about everything.
― Andrew Farrell, Friday, 8 March 2019 14:24 (five years ago) link
Ha, I went to look it up and realized that I used to own the album it's on but, weirdly, had no clear memory of it.
― All along there is the sound of feedback (Sund4r), Friday, 8 March 2019 16:10 (five years ago) link
Lucky you.
― The Vangelis of Dating (Tom D.), Friday, 8 March 2019 16:14 (five years ago) link
I don’t get why it’s even considered a good story and not just gross and weird.
― Trϵϵship, Friday, 8 March 2019 16:24 (five years ago) link
I mean... Bad and Dangerous were both worldwide #1, multiplatinum albums and the premiere of the "Black and White" video was the most-viewed ever at that time. The amount of hype it generated still stands out in my mind.― All along there is the sound of feedback (Sund4r), Thursday, March 7, 2019 6:42 PM (yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
― All along there is the sound of feedback (Sund4r), Thursday, March 7, 2019 6:42 PM (yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
i also remember when the "Scream" video debuted and it was this enormous event, followed of course by You Are Not Alone. "Scream" was his comeback (and a pushback against those who made the initial allegations against him).
― omar little, Friday, 8 March 2019 16:34 (five years ago) link
https://www.cnn.com/2019/03/08/entertainment/simpsons-michael-jackson/index.htmli recorded this on cassette tape off of the television and listened to it like 8 zillion times.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hLIUlaJsGwU
― Fuck the NRA (ulysses), Friday, 8 March 2019 16:50 (five years ago) link
seeing that was covered upthread now. everything is terrible.
― Fuck the NRA (ulysses), Friday, 8 March 2019 16:52 (five years ago) link
My wife's name is Lisa and has had a massive hate-on for MJ for years because she has believed that he abused thiae kids. Ever since she got on FB, I have gotten up early on her birthday and pre-emptively scanned her account to eliminate well-meaning posts of that clip.
― ☮ (peace, man), Friday, 8 March 2019 16:57 (five years ago) link
those
ok can we derail this thread into talking about invasion of privacy and access to the social media accounts of significant others? (。→∀←。)
but not really tho
― ( ͡☉ ͜ʖ ͡☉) (jim in vancouver), Friday, 8 March 2019 17:02 (five years ago) link
This is a mod we are talking about too. He is probably doing this to all of our facebook accounts.
― Trϵϵship, Friday, 8 March 2019 17:38 (five years ago) link
oh shit, let me clarify: by messaging the people and asking them to take down the posts!
― ☮ (peace, man), Friday, 8 March 2019 17:43 (five years ago) link
phew, lol
― ( ͡☉ ͜ʖ ͡☉) (jim in vancouver), Friday, 8 March 2019 17:44 (five years ago) link
I mean, privacy issues notwithstanding, someone could get hurt feelings if they thought my SO was ignoring or deleting their birthday posts off her wall. Everybody involved has been real understanding.
― ☮ (peace, man), Friday, 8 March 2019 17:47 (five years ago) link
by whom
― steven, soda jerk (sic), Friday, 8 March 2019 19:10 (five years ago) link
― omar little,
Comeback from what? His last American hit, "Will You Be There," surpassed expectations and rode the top ten for a while, thanks to Free Willy.
― Let's have sensible centrist armageddon (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Friday, 8 March 2019 19:17 (five years ago) link
i assume omar doesn't mean commercial comeback but coming back from the first allegations
― jolene club remix (BradNelson), Friday, 8 March 2019 19:22 (five years ago) link
oh! Makes sense
― Let's have sensible centrist armageddon (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Friday, 8 March 2019 19:25 (five years ago) link
my recollection was that the legal issues all started up in earnest after Dangerous and Will You Be There? But I could be wrong. Maybe "comeback" should be in "scare quotes", since he was coming back from the accusations of sexual abuse and the single was a pretty clear attempt to confront them angrily.
brad otm -- i think Dangerous was a huge album but the allegations obviously put his career to a halt for a minute before HIStory (which did sell 20 million worldwide, wtf, but it could be argued it was maybe the most New Jersey of all New Jerseys, of which MJ arguably had three perhaps?)
― omar little, Friday, 8 March 2019 19:27 (five years ago) link
coming down from the extreme Thriller heights required a three-step New Jersey process perhaps.
― omar little, Friday, 8 March 2019 19:28 (five years ago) link
i recall HIStory being a HUGE deal (and i bought it!) and Dangerous maybe not performing at the level people were hoping for.
― Fuck the NRA (ulysses), Friday, 8 March 2019 19:30 (five years ago) link
MJ's worldwide sales figures go something like:
Thriller - 66 millionBad - 35 millionDangerous - 32 millionHIStory - 20 million
I assume HIStory's sales figures were boosted a bit by the double-CD = 2 unit sales?
― omar little, Friday, 8 March 2019 19:32 (five years ago) link
well not to mention the 2nd disc was a greatest hits comp which gave a whole new generation reason to buy it. whose decision was that, anyway - MJ or the record company?
― frogbs, Friday, 8 March 2019 19:34 (five years ago) link
there was also a controversy regarding the scream video because mj beats up a car. america has changed quite a bit since then.
― officer sonny bonds, lytton pd (mayor jingleberries), Friday, 8 March 2019 21:28 (five years ago) link
Zappa, I think, for one. Cole and Appice both also sound like they were bragging.
― All along there is the sound of feedback (Sund4r), Friday, 8 March 2019 21:52 (five years ago) link
Btw, was just teaching a 7yo (not the one mentioned above) an exercise involving the 1st 3 notes of a minor scale and he commented that it sounded like the beginning of "Billie Jean".
― All along there is the sound of feedback (Sund4r), Friday, 8 March 2019 22:14 (five years ago) link
The beating up a car was from one of the Bad singles, right, not Scream?
― Siegbran, Friday, 8 March 2019 23:16 (five years ago) link
Black or White
― ☮ (peace, man), Friday, 8 March 2019 23:19 (five years ago) link
XP The long version of "Black or White, I think? It was definitely part of the video premiere after the Simpsons (remember that?).
― a large tuna called “Justice” (C. Grisso/McCain), Friday, 8 March 2019 23:20 (five years ago) link
"Scream" is MJ and Janet on a spaceship.
― a large tuna called “Justice” (C. Grisso/McCain), Friday, 8 March 2019 23:21 (five years ago) link
Zappa, I think, for one. Cole and Appice both also sound like they were bragging.This is a total of one outside observer
― steven, soda jerk (sic), Friday, 8 March 2019 23:23 (five years ago) link
in 2009, Vanity Fair published an index of detailed reported pieces that Maureen Orth had written on Jackson's grooming/molestation cases in 1994, 1995, 2003, 2004 and 2005: https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2009/06/michael-jackson-is-gone-but-the-sad-facts-remain
― steven, soda jerk (sic), Monday, 11 March 2019 21:00 (five years ago) link
Unrelated to the sex abuse, but his behaviour over the Beatles catalogue purchase should have put paid to any "oh he's just a waif-like innocent man-child" bullshit in and of itself. Kind of an indication of how he really was behind the mask (pun(s) intended).
https://www.biography.com/news/michael-jackson-paul-mccartney-beatles-music-catalog
― Zeuhl Idol (Matt #2), Monday, 11 March 2019 21:09 (five years ago) link
the faxes and the tape on the plane were the most disturbing parts of this for me
Even though the details of the abuse are absolutely horrifying, that's the only time we see/hear the way Jackson actually spoke to these boys (rather than them reporting what he said)
it's just so palpably wrong
― Number None, Monday, 11 March 2019 23:07 (five years ago) link
I didn't see the doc - merely here to post this pretty good reaction piece:
https://newrepublic.com/article/153270/michael-jackson-its-different
― xyzzzz__, Monday, 11 March 2019 23:17 (five years ago) link
― steven, soda jerk (sic), Monday, March 11, 2019 9:00 PM (yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
thanks for the link -- just finished reading the first of these. chilling stuff.
i think there may have been a time when i would have found this anecdote funny, but it made me physically recoil just now:
One Hollywood screenwriter remembers that immediately after his baby was born in a Santa Monica hospital a release form was thrust at him. "What's this?" he asked. "It's from Michael Jackson," said the nurse. She explained that Jackson frequented the hospital to stare into the eyes of newborns. "He feels then that he can really see their souls."
― (The Other) J.D. (J.D.), Tuesday, 12 March 2019 00:57 (five years ago) link
that is some weird shit right there
― Fuck the NRA (ulysses), Tuesday, 12 March 2019 01:35 (five years ago) link
Jimmy Saville had free access to hospitals (and morgues) for which he did fundraising, for three decades.
― steven, soda jerk (sic), Tuesday, 12 March 2019 01:49 (five years ago) link