Should Marijuana be legalised?

Well, you underscore my point. There are *a lot* of dangerous or potential dangerous things that we allow and/or encourage! From a rhetorical standpoint it seems as tenuous to me to say potentially dangerous product A should be legal because dangerous product B, etc is legal as it is to argue, well, people are just going to do it anyway. Even if both of those things are true! I def. don't think the government should ban it and I never said they should. It definitely benefits some people. The challenge, when it comes to legalization, esp. recreational, is where to draw those lines, those restrictions. Obv. small children shouldn't use cannabis products. How about teens? At what age? How should they be penalized for using under age, or holding at school, or showing up at school high? These are as much social issues as they are legal issues, and these are things people have struggled with for years for all sorts of substances/activities. But it stands to reason that the more legal it gets the more it will be used and abused, so a question becomes how to deal with that and when.

xpost

If you hired a babysitter for your kid, would you rather she be stoned or sober? Would you care?

Like, you're not going to overdose on cannabis, so in that regard it's "safe." But it does alter and impair functions.

(I type, as I sip a delicious cold beer.)

xps. .this is a silly line of questioning. you would presumably want them to be sober.

I know! My point is it's safe, in that you won't die, but it still has an effect that is not always good. Which calls for some degree of regulation. The question is how much.

But it seems to me to be harder to regulate than alcohol.

It's interesting, I should talk to my kids about it. They are so aware of the dangers of tobacco smoke and (unaware) of its previous ubiquity that they react to even a whiff of it in public with total disgust. I wonder what they think of pot smoking (which I don't think they've encountered much of yet, just Juul kids).

(I should say I fully support legalization, I just don't know if everything has been totally thought through yet.)

I barely see students smoking cigs on campus anymore. Last November I asked a class of ninety journalism students if they smoked. Two raised their hands. When I asked how many vaped, about twenty raised their hands. "Should've asked us if we smoked something else," a kid in the front row said.

what do you mean by harder to regulate than alcohol?

basically all the same issues (minimum age for purchase, can't be under the effects of it when you're driving etc.)

I mean it's easier to sneak into places than it is to sneak in alcohol. It is also harder to gauge someone's level of inebriation.

This is total tangent, but a senior at my son's high school was recently stabbed to death by two middle school kids in an apparent botched Juul deal. Point being, there's probably a lot about teens today that we don't quite get either.

Man, my daughter complains about kids in the bathroom Juuling all the time.

I mean it's easier to sneak into places than it is to sneak in alcohol.

Uh... it's super easy to sneak alcohol into places and it doesn't smell. Vodka + Gatorade, the drink of functioning high school alcoholics.

my senior prom was cut short an hour early when some kids puked all over the hilton waikoloa village's bathroom after overindulging in what they'd snuck past the staff in salad dressing bottles

maybe they OD's on thousand island dressing? I would.

zesty

Josh: Convince me.
Everyone: These arguments convince us.
Josh: I still need more convincing.

Me: Think about the options as long as you need and if you still aren't convinced, well, OK. Be that way.

There's no guarantee that marijuana will never harm anyone in any way, or lead to some situation you find undesirable. Wanting that is like crying for the moon. Figure out where the least harm lies. That's the only approach that can deal with this kind of issue.

The results we are getting with our current approach do massive amounts of harm in my view. How about you convince me the harms you fear are worse?

Weed stores have been open in Washington for what feels like forever now, and the worst problem they’ve caused is gentrification

my senior prom was cut short an hour early when some kids puked all over the hilton waikoloa village's bathroom after overindulging in what they'd snuck past the staff in salad dressing bottles

― difficult listening hour, Tuesday, February 26, 2019 8:17 PM (eleven minutes ago)

look, I said I was sorry

i was ready to go tbh

Possible link to increase in pedestrian deaths:

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/02/28/business/pedestrian-deaths-marijuana.html

decrease in pedestrian lives tho

#pedestrianlivesmatter

i don't quite understand the argument JiC is making. in states where it's legalized, it's regulated. you have to be over a certain age to buy it (like cigarettes & alcohol) in many states, it's illegal to be under the influence of weed while you drive (like alcohol and many other drugs). so what's the objection?

if you don't want your babysitter to be high, you probably also don't want your babysitter to be drunk. so...do you ask your babysitter to please not get drunk before you leave the house for the evening? or do you try to find a babysitter that knows not to get drunk while they're looking after your kids?

i think JiC is concern trolling?

Maybe a little. I just mean for people arguing it is safe, then how can you simultaneously concede it's, say, not safe enough that you want someone in a position of authority using it? Yes, no more so than alcohol, but that's more an argument for the abolition of alcohol than it is for the legalization of cannabis.

How about you convince me the harms you fear are worse?

I think that's kind of silly and circular (not you, just the argument). As I understand it, ridiculous and arbitrary restrictions have made it impossible to freely study cannabis and its effects, longterm or medical or otherwise. But the contradiction I pointed out almost negates that: everyone knows alcohol is overwhelmingly bad for society, but ... so what, we've decided it's not going anywhere. The benefits to legal cannabis seem ancillary: decriminalize and it helps people legally, tax it and it helps the government financially. But the product itself? Its benefits and effects are more nebulous and inconsistent and anecdotal, as far as I've read.

Anyway, like I and you said, there's no "convincing" me. Legalization is the clear direction we are heading in. But I'll be the first to concede I don't know the legal ramifications or regulations at all. For example, how does regulation and enforcement in, say, Amsterdam compare to Washington? I have no idea. Are we (US) generally more legal? More strict? The same? How is Canada handling it? No idea, it's all so ad hoc. But I'll say it will be and is a fascinating experiment to live through.

everyone knows alcohol is overwhelmingly bad for society

the sources of alcohol have been symbiotic with society for so many millennia, changing us and being changed, that i'd honestly have no idea where to begin evaluating the quality of the relationship, but i'm confident no one needs to call the cops

The answers to all those questions are freely available if you really cared to know them.

everyone knows alcohol is overwhelmingly bad for society

Everyone does not know this.

xpost

Yes, not everyone, but I thought the cost (literal and figurative) to society, from alcoholism to violence to drunk driving deaths, was pretty well known. Maybe not!

The answers to all those questions are freely available if you really cared to know them.

How about a link or two? I did a quick search for Colorado vs. Amsterdam, and every article (for good reason) was from 2014.

I just mean for people arguing it is safe, then how can you simultaneously concede it's, say, not safe enough that you want someone in a position of authority using it?

Tandem sky-diving is safe, but I don't want the President issuing executive orders while HALO jumping.

This is a foolish argument. No one is going to say pot or alcohol are completely harmless. They are just not harmful enough to toss people in jail over.

No argument!

.

If you hired a babysitter for your kid, would you rather she be stoned or sober? Would you care?

the amount of everyone's time josh in chicago has wasted is like a nerdstrom poindexter x 1000 but everyone likes and puts up with him anyway because he's like a dad and stuff i guess

that's not cool.

No dadshaming on ilxor.com

I barely see students smoking cigs on campus anymore

I saw a neighborhood teen, who I was familiar with because he had bullied my son in middle school, walking down the street smoking a cigarette the other day. The sight put me in this really weird headspace where I wasn't sure whether to be grossed-out by him hacking on a Marlboro or happy that he wasn't Juuling like some fucking nerd all the other teenagers I see around town.

As an anti-inflammatory, is it even as effective as ibuprofen?

btw ppl with crohn's shouldn't take ibuprofen as it can exacerbate intestinal bleeding

yup. acetaminophen only.

Iirc the current line is that ibuprofen isn't very good for anyone, and should be seriously limited. In fact, also iirc, that ibuprofen is added to many Rx opiates to intentionally make them unpleasant in large doses.

Same with acetaminophen though.

And aspirin has its problems as well.

I ate an edible a couple of days ago to coincide with my menstrual cramping, nausea, back pain. They should pack that in every tampon box.

Do guys ever use turmeric capsules for inflammation?

Do *you guys