C/D ::: Tortoise's TNT

Then McEntire and Brown split off and formed Tortoise.

I thought it started with Herndon and McCombs, to some extent. Then McEntire and Brown joined. Then Bitney. Not that the order matters, I've just never heard them described as a Gastr spin-off. A lot of the stuff was happening at the same time and overlapping.

Codeine ... not too much overlap there. I think Grubbs appears on one album?

― Josh in Chicago, Sunday, February 10, 2019 12:25 PM (four hours ago)

Doug Scharin (Rex, HiM, Directions In Music) replaced Chris Brokaw on their 2nd album.

I thought it started with Herndon and McCombs, to some extent. Then McEntire and Brown joined. Then Bitney. Not that the order matters, I've just never heard them described as a Gastr spin-off. A lot of the stuff was happening at the same time and overlapping.

I mean sure, I don’t know. I’m just trying to make a simple point that there is some stylistic overlap in the GdS album if you listen for it.

Wasn't there a book about post-rock's history coming out late last year or this year? I forgot both author and title.

This one, maybe? It came out in 2017.

https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/41qYjStpxWL._SX347_BO1,204,203,200_.jpg

That was it, thanks!

Chicago Underground Quartet s/t fits in well here too. Jeff Parker's work with Makaya McCraven also worth seeking out (discussed on the rolling jazz thread).

I thought there were more people from the Tar Babies in the band. or that more of teh band had been in the Tar Babies, certainly thought there was band history in them when i picked up the 2nd lp No Contest on cd. Quite fun hyper funk hardcorish stuff, I think it reminded me of the early meat puppets but coming more from funk instead of bluegrass. Otherwise similar melange of different influences played faster than you're used to from the original influences.
Looks like it's only Dan Bitney that were in them.

Did we mention 5ive Style? Another related side note.

Then McEntire and Brown split off and formed Tortoise.
I thought it started with Herndon and McCombs, to some extent. Then McEntire and Brown joined. Then Bitney. Not that the order matters, I've just never heard them described as a Gastr spin-off. A lot of the stuff was happening at the same time and overlapping.

― Josh in Chicago, Monday, 11 February 2019 01:06 (fourteen hours ago) Permalink

This is my understanding as well, the idea was for Herndon & McCombs, who got to know each other when Precious Wax Drippings & Eleventh Dream Day respectively toured together, to be a kind of rhythm section for hire a la Sly & Robbie. That was the germ at least (and they played one show that way? Opening for the Ex) and as mentioned above there was just a lot of Chicago/Louisville/etc overlap.

arrangement of gesualdo's madrigals for five guitars by Noël Akchoté

that's a fun record, noel akchote is a curious character

indeed, i'm listening to his record of weird coltrane arrangements for acoustic guitar. very much along the lines of "huh, this is a coltrane song? i thought i'd heard this one before."

ok, now i've been tracking grubbs' career and i found out that he's on this arrangement of gesualdo's madrigals for five guitars by Noël Akchoté, fairly interesting

that's a fun record, noel akchote is a curious character

I like Akchote's electric work on this Grubbs' song:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=737E-NURglE

(McEntire on drums just to stay topical)

^ another one that was in heavy rotation around the same time

Totally forgot about that record.

Anyone else going to be at Pitchfork's Midwinter festival in Chicago this weekend? Lineup is quite good all around, but I'm most looking forward to Tortoise's performance of TNT.

https://midwinter.pitchfork.com/

Big fan of "Whirlweek." Grubbs's post-Gastr song-based records don't get as much love as O'Rourke's, and they're admittedly a bit spotty, but there's still some good stuff to be found.

This was listed in Downtown Music Gallery's newsletter of this week, although the release (of another Tortoise sideproject) isn't new: http://www.chicagoodenseensemble.com/

Found ‘Standards’ pretty rough to get into (I guess I like my Tortoise easy and jazzy) but really liked ‘It’s All Around You’. Surprised not to see it mentioned itt

It's All Around You was very proto-chillwave

Standards has 'Monica', which is a top 10 Tortoise track for me. It's All Around You was their last great record imo.

It's All Around You is prob my second fave Tortoise (aside from the A Lazarus Taxon b-sides/remixes collection, which I listened to a ton).

pandering to the madison area crowd with that one tho

lol

Listening to IAAY and the title track has that great rhythmic illusion going on. I think it's almost entirely down to the drum kit in the left channel doing that persistent 4-against-3 thing?

Five Too Many is almost deconstructed Afrobeat, and continues the proud/shameful tradition of songs with the time signature in the title.

I remember writing an old demo that was basically Afrobeat in 5, it must have been inspired by this.

I like Akchote's electric work on this Grubbs' song:

(McEntire on drums just to stay topical)

― Jersey Al (Albert R. Broccoli)

haha, "whirlweek" was the first solo grubbs song i heard, had no idea that was akchote on it!

Thanks for the Savath + Salas heads up. This is magnificent.

Oh hey: https://pitchfork.com/reviews/albums/tortoise-tnt/

That's the first time I've read pitchfork in many, many years and the reason why:

TNT’s opening title track is the most live-sounding cut on the record, but it, too, was carefully built one part at a time. As it begins, the cymbals and snare taps are like the tide rolling in, the skitters and crashes are as jazzy as Tortoise get, and out of this foamy pile emerges Jeff Parker’s immortal guitar line.

Anyone who listened to M/Aerial M during this time period knows that this is 100% Pajo.

I wrote this upthread, and this sentiment is exactly what I was referring to:
"Relistening to TNT now, it's funny how people are Jeff Parker this/that, but Pajo is all over this, I guess people forgot he was still in the band at this point."

i think it's a 13-note phrase, by my mind's recollection..

classic, tho

Anyone else going to be at Pitchfork's Midwinter festival in Chicago this weekend? Lineup is quite good all around, but I'm most looking forward to Tortoise's performance of TNT.

https://midwinter.pitchfork.com/

― Indexed, Tuesday, February 12, 2019 3:57 PM (five days ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I hope someone records the TNT set, would love to hear that

Guess I'm the only person who really liked The Catastrophist?

(I like every Tortoise album btw)

Pulled out my vinyl copy of TNT tonight, which I've had for nearly 20 years, and learned for the first time that sides 1 and 3 have cool locked grooves.

i have to admit I'm not 100% sure that's Pajo on the first track -- the style is more Pajo but the tone sounds like Parker to me. Is there a definitive answer somewhere?

I mean, here's them live in 98 with just Parker

https://youtu.be/Zfujgu5w54E?t=1826 (around 30:55 -- sounds pretty damn close to the record to me)

This article makes me wonder if Tortoise even knows who came up with the guitar part for that song.

http://drownedinsound.com/in_depth/4149985-album-by-album-with-tortoise

I definitely saw Tortoise a bunch early on, and since I remember when Jeff started playing with them (it was the first time there was guitar on stage) I'm pretty sure it was Bundy I saw playing with them before that. (I remember Bundy being this more mysterious figure; I have no idea what became of him.) I'm 90% sure I never saw Pajo with Tortoise.

McCombs did indeed play a lot of six-string bass/baritone guitar. I remember that being his thing in Tortoise. I once saw Eleventh Dream Day play an in-store around 1994, as a trio, and I kept trying to identify the fish icon on the back of McCombs' bass. Eventually someone turned around, gave me a look like I was the dumbest person in the world, and just says "it's a bass," and I was, like, "ohhhhhhhhhh!"

Yeah I remember seeing them live and realizing that a lot of those especially thick sounding guitar parts were actually Doug on a Bass 6. But even with that, they switched up so much in the live show that I'm not sure that was necessarily him on the record for those particular parts either.

https://scontent-lga3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/51549861_10161292479860304_4637805763253764096_n.jpg?_nc_cat=108&_nc_ht=scontent-lga3-1.xx&oh=7b84ab703b3f6573b9abbcf7f51d296d&oe=5CF6FD45

Interior is not much better.

A friend of mine pointed out that it was bought only recently for $720,000, so my guess is it's an attempted Amazon HQ2 flip. Whoops.

solid revive

lol wrong thread on last post obv

lol xp i was like "is that the house where they lived and recorded TNT?"

ate only rice iirc

(I remember Bundy being this more mysterious figure; I have no idea what became of him.)

I really like the Directions in Music album he did. Sort of post-classic-rock.

Yeah, but that was 15 years ago or so right?

23 years ago!

(aside from the A Lazarus Taxon b-sides/remixes collection, which I listened to a ton).

Listening to 'Waihopei' and the way the blown-out acoustic drums keep popping in and out of the track around the drum machine, man, I tried to rip that off many times in the mid '00s.

(I remember Bundy being this more mysterious figure; I have no idea what became of him.)

I really like the Directions in Music album he did. Sort of post-classic-rock.

― Position Position, Monday, February 18, 2019 4:49 PM (yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

this is perhaps my favorite record of the whole scene/time, love all the dubby textures sitting with acoustic guitars. all the musicians on it sound great.

i remember reading a long time ago that Brown was working as an EMT.

also, because of this thread i listened to the For Carnation s/t album for the first time. i had the marshmallows cd back in the day and never liked it much, but this record is great!

That s/t For Carnation is a lost classic. Kinda like Spiderland or a Low record - if you settle yourself in and embrace its mood, it’s pretty brilliant.