What are Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez's Flaws?

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Since 1992, Costner has financially supported a variety of Democratic politicians, including Al Gore and Tom Daschle, but also made contributions to Republican Phil Gramm as late as 1995. He said publicly in 2008 that he has no ambition to run for political office, adding "I've lived quite a colorful life".

lol:

look at these morons trying to gorilla channel @aoc's green new deal pic.twitter.com/vCjzQcM6mt

— cristina lópez g. (@crislopezg) February 8, 2019

conservatives are so broke brained that they are literally believing it though

I thought conservatives liked drinking piss

I posted something like this as a response and all I got was "is that supposed to be a joke?"

J---- J--
I seriously hope this is fake. Because, yuck.

J---- J--
Nobody is peeing in my coffee.

N-- R---
well we know the President loves piss so we could possibly have a bipartisan deal here!

J---- J--
Is that supposed to be funny?

that is literally what we will all have to do if we keep destroying the planet, nice detective work republicans

not a joke. not even slightly. that is a deliberately and carefully fabricated lie, designed to look as convincing as possible by making it appear "in print" with an easily deciphered "code" that will attach it to AOC. the fact that it has no basis at all in reality is irrelevant. this lie will circulate and create its own reality. and harm. much as we'd love to laugh off this shit, it is very real shit and it will stick to the GND as it hits the word-of-mouth stage among it target audience. just like black helicopters and similarly far-fetched nonsense that have stuck.

enh I'm not at all convinced it'll stick

Pee-to-potable tech has been around for a long ass time and it’s a good idea that shd be in GND

otoh, peeing into a jug and letting it sit in the sun for six hours before using it brew tea is not a good idea and has no connection to GND

I'm not at all convinced it'll stick

contrails stuck. Vince Foster stuck. it doesn't have to go mainstream to gather belief among susceptible people and those believers will share it as widely as possible because it is designed to provoke that kind of "would you believe it? those GNDealers want us to piss in a jug and drink it!" rumor-mongering activity. it's too good not to spread once you've swallowed the bait.

there's an old saying that a rumor flies around in the world in the time it takes for truth to get out bed.

I don't care about conspiracy nuts and no one else should either, to the extent that they're influential it's very much on the outskirts of culture. birtherism was just as prominent, if not moreso, than any of those and it didn't prevent anything,

eh the thing about contrails or the Vince Foster thing (or Seth Rich, or Uranium One, etc etc) is that there's no way to prove it one way or the other, especially when it involves Things They Don't Want You To Know, this on the other hand is pretty easy to verify as false

I don't care about conspiracy nuts and no one else should either

It's basic FUD (Fear, Uncertainty, Doubt), and it's all part of the dirty tricks arsenal, by sowing confusion and misinformation. The very fact that you heard it from someone you know, even if you had doubts about it, means something in the low-information environment that tens of millions of rural and urban poor voters live in. The last election hinged on less than 100,000 strategically located votes.

piss on these people

you realize that they don't like to be pissed on? it only feeds their resentment of 'urban elites' and makes them gleefully embrace con-man shitheads like Trump in order to prompt your libtears?

Now Twitter is mad at her for saying that democratic socialism and capitalism can be compatible, I guess?

xp dang, that's a convincing argument, i suppose i will not actually piss on another human being after all

i suppose i will not actually piss on another human being after all

they can still sense your strong desire to piss on them, especially when you say "piss on those people". it's a what they call "a tell".

Now Twitter is mad at her for saying that democratic socialism and capitalism can be compatible, I guess?

"twitter" isn't, socialists on twitter are. they want to destroy capitalism. so of course they're not wild about this. but I think they're mad about the opinion, not taking this as some kind of betrayal on AOC's part. I don't think anyone considers her a dyed-in-the-wool socialist. she already sorta distanced herself from DSA

most of them are fine to let AOC do her thing and expand the horizon of the possible for budding leftists and dazzled liberals but they get a little nervous when she threatens to mainstream socialism into being basically just a capitalist welfare state

do they have a more plausible alternative route to socialism?

there's an old saying that a rumor flies around in the world in the time it takes for truth to get out bed.

A lie travelling, not a rumour, and commonly "before the truth has finished pulling on its boots," or similar. Derived from Swift, speaking closely to your point: "Falsehood flies, and the Truth comes limping after it; so that when Men come to be undeceiv’d, it is too late; the Jest is over, and the Tale has had its Effect…"

I would need to hear the full quote to see the context (literally working on recollections of spotting it this morning), but it sounds like she's redefining socialism, not arguing for a path to instituting it (under any definition I'd recognize, anyway) xp

ppl get defensive about these things because they're used to having their views misrepresented from the right as opposed to a theoretically sympathetic liberal left. but tbh I don't care much about this either way because I don't think anyone should be relying on AOC for their abstract political theory.

True or False: Kermit-drinking-tea meme is actually Kermit-drinking-piss

how deep does this go????

The fact that the creator of the fake green new deal piss thing made it specific to "males" is a big tell imo

I guess mandatory soy would have been too obvious

just like black helicopters and similarly far-fetched nonsense that have stuck.

remember the "death panels" mandated by the ACA?

definitely, they executed my grandma last year after a televised trial, it was awful

i don't worry too much about people believing really dumb fake shit about GND because if those people weren't spending their time believing that dumb fake shit they'd be spending it believing some other dumb fake shit

[obligatory these people have more time than you think quip post]

karl otm

they can still sense your strong desire to piss on them, especially when you say "piss on those people". it's a what they call "a tell".

if those people weren't spending their time believing that dumb fake shit they'd be spending it believing some other dumb fake shit

the pity is, all the dumb fake shit they're fed is weighted toward keeping the power and money flowing toward the worst sort of people, but if the 'good people' were to propagate a counter-offensive of dumb fake shit that favored the 'right policies', it would quickly extinguish the very principles that made the 'good people' good people to begin with. you'd end up with The Protocols of the Elders of Wall Street, or some such garbage.

Has anyone pointed out how shitty this thread title is for the AOC conversation hub?

No, but it IS annoying having to keep opening three political threads!

we should have one for everyone

What are Matt Whitaker's Flaws?

have you seen his hair?

no

re: climate change. I think we're doomed to a future world with deeply curtailed human carrying capacity, which means a lot of suffering over the next couple centuries till a new equilibrium of remaining resources and population is achieved. Science communicators have systematically underplayed how grave the consequences, and how difficult total decarbonization will be. More importantly, even later this century as social collapse expands from the most insecure developing nations to their neighbors and right to the borders of the "rich" world, there won't be political will to live smaller, within the planet's limits. As a species, we're just not wired to think of indirect consequences that span millenia into the future. Hell, many go right back to eating cheeseburgers after coronary bypasses.

However, its just awful living with constant reminders of how hopeless the situation may in fact be. I personally aim to live small (vegan, public transport, small apt, sweaters over heating, etc), certainly well below my means, but I'm so tired of the despair, which infects everything. Better that we have politicians that at least make the right noises that they're aware of the situation and offer some sense of hope, than the willfully ignorant making arguments from personal incredulity. So, while I've got reservations that any politically palatable Green New Deal will deter people from using fossil fuels enough to make a marked difference in the world's fate, I'm 100% behind AOC and her GND just so we can have the illusion of hope.

xps i'm holding out for "do you think alexandria ocasio-cortez is a sociopath?"

lol!

Jonathan Chait thinks she's a socio-something].

While rightly insisting on the primacy of climate change, it betrays its own confidence by submerging climate policy into a broader array of priorities. It simultaneously argues that we must move with urgent speed on climate, but that we must first achieve comprehensive socialism in order to move.

life's a bitch

thread title is a ref to the old "what are barack obama's flaws" thread i assume

right

ILX can be hard to follow if you’re just tuning in; you gotta read some recaps of the backstory at least

Shoulda called it "Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez: New, Green, and Deal!"

Wait, there’s a thread called What Are Barack Obama’s Flaws? I just thought it would be appropriate to highlight her shortcomings. Weird!

Alfred, actually it’s even worse, there are 4 politics threads to click back and forth between. It’s living hell!!!!!