What are Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez's Flaws?

Most people shouldn’t be permitted to drive cars

"most" - who? "permitted" - by whom?

Anyone who’s able to ride the bus; the State.

ok good times!

Stop encouraging this viewpoint.

i'm sorry, i didn't realize GOP operatives were trawling this thread for rhetorical ammunition. i'll be more circumspect in the future.

this is for a different thread (for example, the climate change thread), but i think it's perfectly reasonable to hold the viewpoint that meaningful action on climate change would involve some changes that seem unthinkable to many people today (like confronting the idea that maybe we can't grow exponentially grow the economy ad infinitum). not everyone agrees. there are plenty of people that think that economic growth and environmental protection aren't inherently at odds with each other. i used to be of that opinion of myself, and it is certainly the prevailing viewpoint of most politicians who advocate for the environment. it makes a lot of political sense to hold that view, and regardless of the reality of climate change, it may be the most effective point of view to hold, in terms of trying to promote beneficial policies (which i think is where shakey is coming from). theoretically, it is possible to grow the economy in an environmentally friendly way, but i think we blew straight past that point. there's only so much time that one can say "if we make X and Y changes within the next 20 years, we'll be ok". i've been hearing that since i was a kid. i think we're past that time now, and now we're entering the territory of having to make fundamental changes that seem unthinkable to many people today.

it's true that holding the point of view that fundamental changes are required isn't exactly politically savvy, or at least that's been true in the past. but imo it's perfectly reasonable as a personal point of view, and especially on an internet thread.

Nothin but net

another 'trying to make her look bad but making her even cooler' moment

the things about her history in this tweet, while indeed not disqualifying her in any way, are lies

the video of her explaining political corruption posted slightly upthread is brilliant, all over the internet, and speaks to a very novel talent for social media communication that is well beyond her old-guard competition.

the right don't seem to know what to do without a woman to froth at the mouth over; the refreshing thing about aoc is that she makes them look like the mouth-frothing lunatics they are

we'll see how she holds up to thirty fucking years of this shit

there is a very particular, and desirable talent that very few people have for saying very complicated things very simply without simplifying them. That video is almost like "ways of seeing" for ethics and oversight in contemporary governance. This talent for plainspokennes seems particularly crucial in the age of trump, where simple formulations are seen to be incredibly winning in capturing public imagination. MAGA, take back control. what distinguishes AOC is that her formulations aren't just meaningless iterations of primal nativist chest-beating.

Mozart is in the bad place. ijs

tbh "fighting global warming" in any sense would really mean a profound transformation in human civilization -- no more transcontinental flights, most people not permitted to drive cars, an acceptance that constant economic "growth" is no longer desirable -- that almost noone is prepared to accept. nor are there really any mechanics to effect it. so we're doomed imo.

― affects breves telnet (Gummy Gummy), Friday, 8 February 2019 Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

This politician is good but we're fucked anyway is a good attitude I guess.

some of my antipathy towards Green parties stems from a feeling that we are fucked anyway, and some of their gestural politics might see them throw disableds under a bus to save knotty-faced sea squirrels or whatever.

shall we see the (UK) Green party policy towards the disabled

https://policy.greenparty.org.uk/dy.html

have a read

I am just generalising about Green ideology and how I feel where it might end up, not saying it is a perfect pov. But lots of people are having as rough an existence as the planet is rn.

one thing I do usually notice is that (and this doesn't always hold true) people who care about the planet also care about the well-being of the unprivileged, and vice versa

I wish someone would explain to some of these lovely people that many disabled ppl need single-use plastic straws, for starters.

Green politics seems like the ultimate utopian "socialism in one country" thing where unless the whole planet is unequivocally committed to it, it's localised pressure groups - pissing into the wind. I mean even if the whole planet was committed to the cause, how many centuries could we delay The Great Dying 2.0 by?

I am not so green that I don't use still disposable plastic straws on occasion although I've picked up a nifty pack of stainless steel ones for home use. I have gone through a TON in my life. More than most people I think, as there was a period when I used them as a jaunty affectation. What is your particular use for them, calzino?

I don't use them, I'm not disabled - just know ppl who are and say they can't use metal ones.

I mean even if the whole planet was committed to the cause, how many centuries could we delay The Great Dying 2.0 by?

I really, really get this feeling, but it's essentially the path to giving up all together no? Ie lol we're all gonna die. I'd dread a world where the centrists or the godforaken libdems are the most 'left'/utopian politicians around, but it seems you've abandoned hope on the place of idealism in politics?

in theory i like the paper ones but in practice they turn to mush in about 30 seconds

"I don't use them, I'm not disabled - just know ppl who are and say they can't use metal ones."

why?

I had friends virtue signaling all over the damn facebook when banning these in SF was being discussed; they'd never once seemed to care about the disabled prior (I mean personally I'm sure they did but they really wanted to make a show of "what about the disableds!") but none of the arguments were very cogent. There are paper straws. You can use them. Sure they taste a bit gunky but many places have used them for years and you do get used to them.

shut the fuck up dickhead, I'm not even wasting my time on you.

That escalated quickly

sorry a bit rude, but when ppl display extreme ignorance + use "virtue signalling" an internal switch goes in me.

just curious if you guys have read the GP FAQ bc it's extraordinarily ambitious - it's honestly v hard for me to imagine it being implemented let alone asking for something even more dramatic: https://assets.documentcloud.org/documents/5729035/Green-New-Deal-FAQ.pdf

what are AOC's environmental stances, I assume they are good ones

My hope is that AOC inspires more working-class people to get into politics. If you can lay out your convictions plainly, (assuming they're inclined towards building an actual viable future for living people) and make clear your positions haven't already been bought and sold, no one will care about gaffes.

Anyone who’s able to ride the bus; the State.

― Norm’s Superego (silby), Friday, February 8, 2019 3:36 AM (eleven hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

lol ilu

apparently that FAQ might be fake - sorry if so!

quoting Alan Moore

in theory i like the paper ones but in practice they turn to mush in about 30 seconds
― illegal economic migration (Tracer Hand), Friday, February 8, 2019 1:14 PM (three hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

personally I just avoid beverages. simplifies things.

sorry to bring this back to an AOC thread, but plastic straws are the most versatile and least problematic of straws for some disabled people to use for liquids including life giving sustenance and medication, not just beverages. I bet AOC would agree with me tbf.

lol ilu

― There's more Italy than necessary. (in orbit), Friday, February 8, 2019 7:28 AM (one hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

thanks!

lmao conservatives really think the "Green New Deal" involves drinking piss

https://scontent-ort2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/51735329_568773206866772_6398036816041082880_n.jpg?_nc_cat=102&_nc_ht=scontent-ort2-1.xx&oh=ff4b28fc1bd7c05d0ebd0e0c11f4feb6&oe=5CEEFD5B

what are AOC's environmental stances, I assume they are good BAD ones

I thought conservatives liked drinking piss

?_nc_cat=102&_nc_ht=scontent-ort2-1.xx&oh=ff4b28fc1bd7c05d0ebd0e0c11f4feb6&oe=5CEEFD5B

Since 1992, Costner has financially supported a variety of Democratic politicians, including Al Gore and Tom Daschle, but also made contributions to Republican Phil Gramm as late as 1995. He said publicly in 2008 that he has no ambition to run for political office, adding "I've lived quite a colorful life".

lol:

look at these morons trying to gorilla channel @aoc's green new deal pic.twitter.com/vCjzQcM6mt

— cristina lópez g. (@crislopezg) February 8, 2019

conservatives are so broke brained that they are literally believing it though

I thought conservatives liked drinking piss

I posted something like this as a response and all I got was "is that supposed to be a joke?"

J---- J--
I seriously hope this is fake. Because, yuck.

J---- J--
Nobody is peeing in my coffee.

N-- R---
well we know the President loves piss so we could possibly have a bipartisan deal here!

J---- J--
Is that supposed to be funny?

that is literally what we will all have to do if we keep destroying the planet, nice detective work republicans

not a joke. not even slightly. that is a deliberately and carefully fabricated lie, designed to look as convincing as possible by making it appear "in print" with an easily deciphered "code" that will attach it to AOC. the fact that it has no basis at all in reality is irrelevant. this lie will circulate and create its own reality. and harm. much as we'd love to laugh off this shit, it is very real shit and it will stick to the GND as it hits the word-of-mouth stage among it target audience. just like black helicopters and similarly far-fetched nonsense that have stuck.

enh I'm not at all convinced it'll stick

Pee-to-potable tech has been around for a long ass time and it’s a good idea that shd be in GND

otoh, peeing into a jug and letting it sit in the sun for six hours before using it brew tea is not a good idea and has no connection to GND