John Foxx Era Ultravox Vs Midge Ure Era Ultravox

What he said. Or Telekon or Replicas or Dance or...

Also, he's constrantly rhyming 'glimmer' with 'shimmer', which cracks me up. And the first version of 'Endlessly' is the best Thomas Dolby track Thomas Dolby never wrote. Also he has an interesting deformed ear. Finally, he's reinvented himself as a graphic artist.

Midge Ure? Didn't he front Gary Numan's backing band? Oooh, sorry, that's harsh. I LOVED 'The Thin Wall' - what a track!

"Midge Ure? Didn't he front Gary Numan's backing band?"

No, he used to front a little bunch of Bay City Roller wannabe's called Slik.

What's Mr Foxx's new material like then?

The last time I heard any Ure-era Ultravox in one place was the original singles collection and it pretty well reconfirmed my feeling that I don't need to hear any more than that again, aside from Lament -- when it gets to its second-side-of-Low phase, it becomes one strange and weird album. TBH, I think yer superlatives much more readily match Simple Minds at around the same time -- Sons and Fascination/Sister Feelings Call, Empire and Dance and New Gold Dream just make whatever Ure was doing seem so, well, stodgy. Which is odd given where Simple Minds finally ended up. ;-)

Very good point. Actually it's always puzzled me why there are albums out there in the racks claiming to be "The Best Of Midge Ure And Ultravox" when (since they don't include either anything by Rich Kids or anything by Ultravox with John Foxx singing on them) they quite clearly contain neither.

John Foxx solo stuff? I haven't got it all by any means but what I've heard is good but not as good as the stuff he did with Ultravox!

That said, I agree with Barrus.. though if I were forced to choose sides, I'd certainly choose UltraFoxx over Ure-ltravox. The only good thing to come out of Ure-ltravox, IMHO, is the song "White China".. whereas I could actually listen to entire early UltraFoxx albums.

OTOH, I went to pick up my copy of "Vienna" last week, and it had vanished, which pissed me off a lot. I'll pick up another copy tonight, I think. "Vienna" is great too, a smashing set of singles, & good album tracks as well. "Mr X" is one of my favourite pieces of music, it has a really strong sense of atmosphere & place to it. Again, I can't think of anybody else who really sounded quite like that.

Ultravox are probably at about the lowest point imaginable at the moment w/r/t public/music fan recognition, I think? I can't remember the last time I read anyone propping them. Weird that a small subset of brit "new wave" has been consistently influential/name-droppable, but this, which I think is a lot better, is still off the map. It's daft, b/c they have this back-catalog with loads of great music in it, an unexplored resource for ppl looking for ideas to cop. They were astonishingly good live the 2 times I saw them as well, especially on the tour for "Lament". I have real strong memories of this one - looking down from the balcony at a stage covered in black scrim netting, seeing all the blinking lights on the drum machines and hearing/feeling this mighty unstoppable pulsing machine-like rhythm. I'd kind of like to see that one again, tbh.

As well as this, the story of the band is surely worth retelling - they got dropped from island in '79, & their response was to self-book a tour of the US - commercial suicide/blow yr brains out! except they actually came back in the black! How they wound up with the singer from a '70's teen-glam-pop group fronting them, a genius move almost up there w/phil o recruiting 2 girls from a nightclub to replace the 2 departed synthesiser players & which paid off almost as well. Also, the care they took on their presentation, both live & on record etc etc. They were also, at certain times, a very good-looking band.

I'm curious, as well, about what exactly the ex-members are doing, don't dare look it up on google, b/c I suspect it might be depressing, but billy currie, chris cross, robin simon, and especially warren cann were real distinctive players.

Here be more info:

http://www.ultravox.org.uk/

http://www.discog.info/ultravox-interview.html

I googled for warren cann, and found that he'd briefly played for huw lloyd langton's group? wtf of the day...

The first three Ultravox albums (Ultravox!, Ha! Ha! Ha! and Systems of Romance) are all currently in the process of being remastered. Each disc contains material that has never previously been available on CD. The accompanying artwork is set to include lyrics as well as extensive sleevenotes.

01. Sat'day Night in the City of the Dead

2:34
02. Life at Rainbows End
(For All the Tax Exiles on Main Street)

3:43
03. Slip Away

4:16
04. I Want To Be a Machine

7:23
05. Wide Boys

3:15
06. Dangerous Rhythm

4:16
07. The Lonely Hunter

3:43
08. The Wild, the Beautiful and the Damned

5:50
09. My Sex

3:02
Additional Tracks
10. Slip Away (recorded live at The Rainbow)

4:08
11. Modern Love (recorded live at The Rainbow)

2:34
12. The Wild, the Beautiful and the Damned
(recorded live at The Rainbow)

5:15
13. My Sex
(recorded live at Huddersfield Polytechnic)

2:55

---

01. ROckwrok

3:35
02. The Frozen Ones

4:06
03. Fear in the Western World

4:00
04. Distant Smile

5:21
05. The Man Who Dies Every Day

4:12
06. Artificial Life

5:00
07. While I'm Still Alive

3:16
08. Hiroshima Mon Amour

5:13
Additional Tracks
09. Young Savage

2:56
10. The Man Who Dies Every Day (remix)

4:15
11. Hiroshima Mon Amour (alternative version)

4:54
12. Quirks

1:40
13. The Man Who Dies Every Day
(recorded live at Huddersfield Polytechnic)

4:15
14. Young Savage (recorded live at The Marquee)

3:25

---

01. Slow Motion

3:32
02. I Can't Stay Long

4:19
03. Someone Else's Clothes

4:28
04. Blue Light

3:11
05. Some of Them

2:32
06. Quiet Men

4:11
07. Dislocation

2:58
08. Maximum Acceleration

3:56
09. When You Walk Through Me

4:18
10. Just For a Moment

3:10
Additional Tracks
11. Cross Fade

2:53
12. Quiet Men (full version)

3:55

compilation from first three albums (foxx era) currently rocking my world

Good choice Mr J!

The first three of maybe four albums with Midge Ure >> anything involving John Foxx >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The "U-Vox" album and most of Midge Ure's solo output.

I came here to say something, only to discover that I said it pretty much to the word a year ago. Take it away, old-LJ.

(There's a special late-night state of concentration when this music becomes almost divine)

Geir Hongro, u mad on da drugz

"Slow Motion" is the greatest arena rock anthem that never was.

Love "Slow Motion", but not that much the early John Foxx stuff. That said, the first three albums were all great. But the next four were even greater.

This is just really fucking intelligent, emotional pop music, with some of the best use of strings (mostly violins) pop has *ever* seen.

The pending Korg reissue of the ARP Odyssey has sent me to Midge-era Ultravox beyond Vienna for the first time since I sold back that mid-80s greatest hits in horror when I realized what that era of the band sounded like.

Twenty years later, via Spotify, I'm actually quite taken with a lot of this – and find Midge's histrionics far less offensive than I remember. Vienna, Rage, Quartet, and Lament all have some great stuff on them. The extended version of the title track from Lament is great. "Hymn" is an earworm.

Billy Currie is the secret weapon of both eras. Midge def. knew his way around a hook. But whether it's the soaring ARP Odyssey solo on "Astradyne" or all those glassy textures on Quartet and Lament, it's the synths that are always keeping my attention. Tho Ha! Ha! Ha! showed he didn't learn it all from him, have to imagine Conny Plank had a big impact on him. Or maybe he was why Conny wanted to work work them.

Astradyne solo continues to amaze.

I agree, it's superb! The rest of the album is great too - top notch production.

NTI above mentions the reissued Korg Arp Odyssey. I have one, and after using it for a bit I've developed a renewed respect for Billy Currie. For some reason Arp didn't give the Odyssey traditional pitch and modulation wheels. Instead the rev1 model has a small knob for pitch and nothing for modulation, so players had to use the titchy VCO modulation sliders instead if they wanted to make the sound go wobbly.

Perhaps it was a patent issue. I don't know. Currie sold his original Arp Odyssey a while back and looking at photographs of it you can see where he wore the paint off the VCO 1 mod slider. I'm surprised the control didn't break off. Live footage from the period shows him continually adjusting the pitch and portamento controls. The "soaring" effect on e.g. Hymn is a portamento octave jump, which is simple but effective.

Korg's reissue comes with a reprint of the original manual. Page 41 suggests that you "resist the temptation to merely open as many sliders as possible, as far as possible". Currie seems to have ignored this advice.

As for Ultravox, the band is still a sucking void of conversation-stopped unhipness. It's odd how the *idea* of early-80s New Romantics is far more fashionable than the actual music, but then again even at the time the music was a backdrop to the fabulous clothes. Personally I find the band's first two albums too unpolished to enjoy, but Systems of Romance is terrific and still sounds awesome nowadays. On a sonic level it's easily four-five years ahead of its time. It's criminal that it wasn't a huge hit. Vienna and Rage in Eden have their moments but the sound seems to have gone back a step - the blend of guitar and synth on Systems is terrific whereas the guitar was toned right down for Vienna and Rage and to my ears they sound thinner. On a conceptual level Foxx and Ure had a similarly histrionic vocal style but whereas Foxx sounded as if he meant it, Ure sounded as if he was affecting a style. They were both affecting a style but Ure was less transparent.

I think on a more fundamental level John Foxx was better at creating an image of artistic credibility than Ure. Along with David Sylvian he managed to give the impression that he was a deeply intellectual and worldly cultured genius whereas Ure - and Gary Numan, Jim Kerr etc - were obviously faking it. This does raise the question of whether there's any difference between a perfect imitation of a cultured genius and a genuinely cultured genius - I suppose the former creates something new whereas the latter merely polishes it, which might be why so many pioneers go unsung, because their work was raw and unfiltered and less appealing to the senses than the refined products that their successors produced. Systems of Romance is an aberration, in that it's both inspired and polished, and yet it was a flop. The world doesn't make sense.

I've always wondered why Foxx left. His post-Ultravox albums weren't radically different from Ultravox. If he had stayed, his Beatlesy/psychedlic tendencies would have balanced out the band's stiffness. Ultravox totally ran out of ideas in the mid-80s and haven't generated any new ones since then, whereas Foxx's latter-day ambient albums are really good. By now he would be carrying the band but what's wrong with that? Purely as as backing band Currie etc didn't lose their mojo.

Another question. Cheekbones. John Foxx vs David Sylvian - who had the sharper, more delicate cheekbones? They were both gorgeous men, and yet the record-buying public ignored them. Did men find their looks threatening? Did women worry that they were competing with them? Were teenage recordbuying boys nervous that their friends would mock them?

A+ post, Ashley

Great post and otm re: real vs faked "genius" ( I'd call it "worldliness" in this case). Much as I love early Simple Minds, much Numan and much Ure Ultravox you can't deny Foxx and Sylvian had/have the advantage in the worldliness and creativity depts.

I am going to see MADGE YR tonight for his acoustic Questions & Answers thing

I bought the ticket before I realized it was a Q&A show

i hate audience Q&As normally, like in a skeleton leaving my body way

can anyone confirm that this will be a fun evening?

ican confirm for myself that it was great!

Hurrah!

Somehow, despite adoring the Island Years comp, I'd never heard Artificial Life until just now. Wow

this song has the best outro of the 70s my god

veg, did you ask him anything?

I didnt get a chance - it was pretty competitive to get Midge’s attention! i was a bit intimidated by everyone leaping out of their seats yelling his name lol

I wanted to ask if he had a favorite story about Phil Lynott

But he gave good lengthy interesting answers to pretty much all the questions. Talked about when Steve Strange rode a camel to a nightclub, and the story behind how he could have joined the Sex Pistols, Band Aid eyc

There was a young kid maybe 10 or so in the front with his Mum, and he got up & asked Midge about the Dancing W Tears In My Eyes video: the kid wanted to know if Midge thought that could ever happen. I almost got a little teary - at the same age I was petrified of nuclear war & could havd done with some reassurance from Midge myself <3

that = nuclear armageddon/end of days etc

What was Midge's reply to that question?

He told the kid that he hoped it wouldnt ever happen. Then he gave a bit of backstory about the song/video, inspired by reading “on the beach” & that they got in a lot of trouble over the video bc parents said it scared their kids. He also said that the future looked more promising to him because it would be in the hands of concerned people like him (the boy)

paraphrasing obv

I wanted to ask if he had a favorite story about Phil Lynott

Would have asked him if he'd ever met John Foxx, and if so, what did they talk about

Remember reading in Smash Hits of all places that Foxx came to one of the early Midge-era (Ure-era?) Ultravox gigs.

"Free Bird!"

Choosing one over the other is pure folly; both iterations of Ultravox were/are pure greatness and some of the very best music ever produced. Also, John Foxx and Midge Ure are two of the prettiest men to have ever existed and I've had big old celebrity crushes on both since I was a young teenager.

hey veg - it was i that asked the sex pistols question at yoshis! (chaki)

This was the Sacramento show at Harlow’s - popular question I guess! But ace that you saw him at Yoshi’s!

I'd go with these. Happy birthday, Midge!

“passing strangers” slams

I'd go with these🕸. Happy birthday, Midge!

New Steven Wilson mix of "Rage In Eden" is pretty juicy.

yeah it's awesome, shame the total album wasn't done though because I guess multitracks were missing but there are a lot of great bonus tracks included in this package. Rage and Systems of Romance are my favorite UV albums; I'd love to hear Wilson do that one as well.

I really like Cathedral Oceans, which I picked up without knowing that John Foxx had any connection to Ultravox.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=00oXLPmXTF0

Steven Wilson does it again. His mix of "Quartet" is a joy even though the album itself is pretty ho-hum.