Is the West Experiencing a Left-Wing Drift? (the international left politics activism, news, and strategy thread)

People respond more to the alarmed tone, the body language, and the carefully chosen implications that she presents a grave danger, than to any specific facts being communicated. They are consuming impressions, not facts. Even having a 'foreign-sounding' name is going to resonate badly, if the proper framework is built around it.

There's not a lot she can do to halt all that shit hurled in her direction. The best she will be able to do is craft an extremely strong counter-message, so simple and direct it is hard to obscure under the mud flung her way, and practice her camera presence to create a strong positive image to override the negative image being pasted onto her. She seems to understand this and is doing pretty well at it so far.

I would say so. To hat-tip to another ilxor,

*clutches at heart* _team_ pic.twitter.com/LAxew0Jlv7

— justin jacoby smith (@hoosteen) December 18, 2018

the right wing attacks ocasio cortez for being too idealistic and supporting policies most americans like, such as universal healthcare. doesn't have the sting of a seth rich imo

yeah that's a good comparison imo

she's also a young high achieving striver who could've milked her rise to prominence as some horatio alger myth but instead she gets there and shes like "it turns out america kinda sucks, lets do LOTS OF THINGS differently" like she's ungrateful!!!!

i think it's hard to smear someone like her. we'll see what she's like in congress, but right now it seems she is taking the bernie approach of never straying from the basic message. her positions are easily identifiable, unlike hillary's, which was why she could serve as a blank slate for the right to project their paranoia.

not that the right won't project their paranoia on her but i don't think it will stick the same way. i think she'll have more ability to control her own story. or i hope so because we need a hard left turn away from all kinds of nonsense.

the fact that she has yet toe ven take office and yet has seem to have done more to shift the direction of potential future public policy than anyone currently in congress is the greatest endorsement of the inherent appeal of left-spectrum policies (when plainly communicated) I can recall

i mean, not more than bernie or warren

more than anyone in the house yeah

I meant to say *almost* anyone there lol

imo, the greatest weakness of the moderate-left somewhat-progressively-minded politicians of the past three decades has been their habit of vague and generalized rhetoric on behalf of mind-numbingly complex legislation and difference-splitting policies. the more complex the legislation, the more easily it was subverted and manipulated by the wealthy and their lobbyists. they were charmed by a plausible line of rationalizations, when they needed to be resolute for clear, strong, and obvious public benefits.

but, you, the choir, have already heard this sermon I have no doubt.

I think more, honestly. it's the age factor.

As someone pointed out on the Current Affairs podcast, AOC is hard to attack because she does what Trump does: she never gets defensive. Every attempt made to slander her has been met with a "hell yeah I'm socialist" or whatever.

^^^

a fun AOC factoid

This also means @Ocasio2018 will have roughly 8 (!) hours per day more than her colleagues to spend on legislation, at hearings, reading, writing, doing press, meeting with constituents, etc. Her colleagues schedule is more like the following: /1 https://t.co/Y4jqzohzep

— Ryan Grim (@ryangrim) December 18, 2018

It'd be a bold move if she actually avoids getting roped into call time

maybe this should all go in Democratic (Party) Direction idk

My old org often bandied around the idea of blockading one of the call time buildings but we figured ultimately it was too obscure a target to resonate with most people

Kinda wish we'd done it

Call time is for raising money for the DCCC and stuff like that, right? So is she raising money from small donors still, or is she just not pitching in? I mean, she could probably win that fight, but it's not really the same story.

aiui the DCCC plops you down and gives you a list

what is aiui pls

as i understand it

yah

is this the day I became more online than hoos, surely not

a new one to me!!

Tabletmag is targeting DSA again, this time calling out one of the co-chairs of my chapter by name and getting weird about it:

https://www.tabletmag.com/scroll/277482/the-stars-of-the-new-american-left-israel-hating-women

A glimpse:

I haven’t even had time to read it all yet but I’m freaking the fuck out about this truly insane article on Tablet pic.twitter.com/kOb2SwtKvb

— Olivia Katbi Smith🌹أوليفيا كاتبي (@livkittykat) December 19, 2018

lol tablet isn't targeting DSA. tablet is targeting the DNC by trying to tie them to DSA.

When the delegates to the Democratic National Convention assemble less than two years from now, will the showdown between centrists and progressives that everyone expects actually occur? Will a few zealots of anti-Zionism take their place among the progressives? Will they push their way to the microphone, and will they send mad orations beaming outward to the American public, calling for the elimination of an entire country? And will the mad orations lead to grisly chants and an occasional outbreak of medieval superstition, hither and yon? In short, will the same miserable battle that has torn apart large portions of the European left spread to America, not just on a miniature scale (which has already happened), but full blast, with national consequences? This is not a silly question.

lol this *is* a deeply silly question wtf

but the point is that tablet thinks kingfish's friend is bad PR for the dems. it's not a hit job. except for a few snide remarks (like the Gaza sentence) it's mostly just her words printed verbatim. i do think she realizes that bc she says it's essentially a "meet this young person" profile - yes but the political utility is not aimed at DSA at all. the author would probably be happy if DSA became more and more powerful and took over the Democratic Party.

mad orations mad orations mad orations

lol tablet isn't targeting DSA. tablet is targeting the DNC by trying to tie them to DSA.

― Mordy, Wednesday, December 19, 2018 11:51 PM (yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I understand that this isn't just a semantic distinction you're making, but the fact that the target they want to shame is the DNC doesn't negate that they're surfacing a relatively obscure person and making them an object of derision

Will they push their way to the microphone

this will depend on where the microphone is located. if it is in the hand of a FOX news correspondent looking for controversy anywhere it can be found, then it is possible very little pushing would be required. on the podium? not a chance. the podium mic will be well-guarded from impromptu takeovers.

xp i just think ppl might be missing the context which is that tablet doesn't really care about DSA they only care about trolling liberal Jewish American Dem voters. and my impression is tho she's relatively obscure she is a leader in a political movement which means using her as a way of establishing the beliefs of DSA is - while maybe incomplete - not unfair.

That's a fair point

If Paul Berman 'frets about the left' embracing what he believes are positions that are dangerously untethered from facts and reality, and likely to do untold harm, while pursuing chimerical benefits, then Paul Berman ought to spend less time characterizing those positions in unflattering terms and maybe spend more time placing those positions in relation to the facts and reality he sees as necessary to their correction. Unless his goal is to discredit people and ideas without disclosing any of the ideas he considers more credible.

Aimless, if you mean that he should spend his time explaining what is wrong with anti-Zionism and BDS instead of just bemoaning its influence I think such topics have been exhaustively covered on Tablet such that they're the context that any article can be read in and presumably he doesn't feel like he needs to return to that well in order to make his argument (that anti-Zionism is on the rise in the Democratic Party). Or do I misunderstand you?

It seems to me that the very term Anti-Zionism is inherently propagandistic and misleading, unless you believe that Zionism automatically requires and supports all of the policies of the State of Israel which are being criticized from the left. Calling opponents of those policies "anti-Zionist" is similar to calling proponents of abortion rights "anti-life". The term is polarizing and unhelpful. And the tenor of that article was polarizing and unhelpful.

if i learned one thing from reading a bunch of pro-iraq war screeds way back in the day it is that paul berman never knows what he's talking about

xp aimless are you referring to the 3 part berman piece of the piece that was linked to here? re: anti-Zionism i think you're a little confused. ppl of whom the term is being used here (people who support BDS) often very happily refer to themselves as anti-Zionist. these pieces are not like AIPAC hit jobs on liberal Zionists like Beinart where you'd be right conflating critical of Likud policies w/ anti-Zionism is propaganda. these pieces aren't about democrats who are critical of israel (tho they are) but specifically leftists who support 1SS.

often very happily refer to themselves as anti-Zionist

Self-identified anti-Zionists are in no danger of taking over the Democratic party. Berman can stop fretting.

is that bc you don't think DSA and the left are ascendent in the party or bc you don't think anti-Zionism is prevalent in those circles or what

it's because they are more than several steps removed from positions of power within the Democratic apparatus

also I know you know this but the DSA, the left and anti-Zionists are not interchangeable terms. it's more like a Venn diagram where anti-zionists are the v small intersection in the middle

yes i'm aware and i am not concerned that the dem party is about to become anti-zionist. but it's enough of an issue on the horizon that conservative jews have fodder to troll liberal jews with. ok fine right-wingers always wield nationalism against left-wingers what else is new. i do think tho that the left wing of the party, mostly due to moderate failures in office and electorally, is ascendent and that likely in the near future the party will at the very least be split on the issue of Israel. there are no anti-Zionist POTUS nomination hopefuls afaik. Sanders probably comes the closest and is a for sure liberal Zionist. but yeah a lot can happen in between now and then and i do believe anti-Zionist sentiment is more marginal than it appears. the anti-Zionist left + the right are both motivated to make it seem more impressive for their own reasons.

xp- I think even morbs would quickly concede that anti-Zionism is not "ascendant in the party" and he more than anyone else on ilx would make that admission ruefully. As Οὖτις points out, conflating 'the left', 'DSA', and self-identified 'anti-Zionists' as interchangeable terms is wildly inaccurate.

i'd be curious to hear other opinions on that question tbh inc morbs but i don't think you can have it both ways. if these incoming elected democrats are worth news coverage (and they got tons) then a position many of them share that is currently anathema in the dem party is worthy of coverage too. tho i agree handwriting at this point isn't justified (but of course these articles are concern trolling).

a position many of them share that is currently anathema in the dem party is worthy of coverage too

The mainstream DC news media doesn't think this way. Israel was not the marquee issue in the midterm elections and isn't likely to be in the 2020 election, either. The out-of-the-mainstream foreign policy positions of a few Congressional reps is very small potatoes.

seeing as how we have a non-existent foreign policy at the moment, Israel's pretty far down the list of any foreign policy issues that are gonna be brought before POTUS candidates - things like dealing w Russia, Brexit, NATO, China, N. Korea, Iran deal, Paris climate accord, etc. are all gonna take precedent. that's a long list.

(and Israel's involved on a few of those fronts but you get the idea)