katherine, i think your point is predicated on the idea of a listener who exists in this world but isn’t representative of the people posting itt (as far as i can tell).
many times i’ve been in stores, or bars, and asked what music was playing, only to find out like “oh this wilco? weird i thought i hated them. this song is cool tho.” same goes with streaming, whether it’s youtube or pandora or whatever. i don’t feel personally affronted if something comes on that i don’t enjoy; i simply don’t like it and just skip the track. for me it’s not really an ethical issue, and i think most people are fine liking the music they like and acepting that other people share their tastes in some respects but also listen to shit i couldn’t be bothered to listen to.
re: “beat the machines” i mean for me that’s just a joke. i’ll happily bow down to our cyborg overlords if they can start hipping me to shit as good as my friends do, or the fine people of ilm
so yeah, that’s a concept that exists. i’m just not sure that for me at least it’s particularly relevant to this discussion, which in any case i take to be a series of experiments that might yield interesting results on both sides — not some kind of take-down of the idea of the spotify algorithm or whatever
― budo jeru, Friday, 30 November 2018 01:30 (five years ago) link
"because there's so much stuff that i can tell (without listening to it, though if I couldn't tell I'd rapidly learn by listening) is bottom-feeding junk that i'm not going to waste my time on it"
The robots, at least, are neither dismissive nor smugly dismissive.
(There are no robots, of course. "humans vs algorithms" is really a question of whether you're willing to try music without the protective shielding of somebody assuring you that listening to it won't make you uncool. So in that sense, yes, I'm on the side of curiosity and human potential, which ironically here we've labeled "algorithms". I very much believe that "not famous yet" doesn't equal "bottom-feeding junk". I find the robots useful not because I've trained them to cater to the narrowing of my tastes, but because I've trained me to not want that.)
(Also, there are no robots.)
― glenn mcdonald, Friday, 30 November 2018 02:07 (five years ago) link
To add the maybe-obvious part, I also love recommendations by people. I'm not for algorithms and against people, I'm for people and algorithms, and against "vs".
― glenn mcdonald, Friday, 30 November 2018 12:13 (five years ago) link
i think your point is predicated on the idea of a listener who exists in this world but isn’t representative of the people posting itt (as far as i can tell).
possibly -- "fear of being revealed as uncool" is probably closer to what I meant. or rather, "fear of being revealed as basic," since most of the thinkpieces aren't panic that they'll end up hearing 2009 Eurovision semifinalists or obscure basement folk dubstep or 14-year-olds lipsyncing to 15-year-olds singing over bad chiptune covers of Deltarune, but that they'll end up hearing the contents of the next Coachella lineup.
anyway, sorry to further derail; I'd offer recommendations but no one's list so far overlaps with what I could recommend
― aloha darkness my old friend (katherine), Friday, 30 November 2018 14:48 (five years ago) link
i'm not saying The Stolen Moans are "bottom-feeding junk", I can't tell one way or another not having heard them...
OK, you know what, I listened to them. They're some weird fur supremacist group. I have no idea what to make of them and based on the 229 Youtube views for their video neither does anyone else. They probably deserve to be somebody's favorite group but they're not mine. The video was definitely more interesting than the song.
Anyway, I'm not talking about that, I'm talking about stuff like "Bohemian Rhapsody (Arranged for Piano, Strings, & Chorus by Rick Wakeman". When the only stuff I can identify on a list is stuff like this, it colors my opinion of the rest of the list.
People say I will listen to goddamn anything and it's not true. I will listen to goddamn anything as long as someone tells me they like them. Putting that extra step in there, a person "telling" a machine they like a song and then that machine telling me about it, doesn't work. That's a prejudice sure but part of harmonious human-machine interaction is acknowledging our irrational prejudices.
― dub pilates (rushomancy), Friday, 30 November 2018 14:55 (five years ago) link
Anyway, I'm not talking about that, I'm talking about stuff like "Bohemian Rhapsody (Arranged for Piano, Strings, & Chorus by Rick Wakeman".
if you manage to seed a recommendation engine and get that in return, I'm honestly impressed
― aloha darkness my old friend (katherine), Friday, 30 November 2018 15:01 (five years ago) link
so, back to business then? allen, what did you think of your human recommendations?
― budo jeru, Sunday, 2 December 2018 20:01 (five years ago) link
bump
― budo jeru, Thursday, 17 January 2019 00:07 (five years ago) link
im on streaming and almost never engage with algorithms but it’s not like im avoiding them either? idk
― flopson, Thursday, 17 January 2019 02:24 (five years ago) link
ah nevermomd didn’t even read what this thread was
― flopson, Thursday, 17 January 2019 02:26 (five years ago) link
Years ago, the first song I entered in Pandora was Pink Floyd "Set the Controls for the Heart of the Sun", hoping they'd follow it with songs of mystery and mood.
The next song Pandora played was Captain & Tenille "Love Will Keep Us Together"
― Hideous Lump, Thursday, 17 January 2019 03:23 (five years ago) link
i just looked up the pompeii version of that song on a porn-mode browser
up next is simon and garfunkel doing "the sound of silence"
frankly at this point i'll take daryl dragon over paul simon
― The Elvis of Nationalism and Amoral Patriotism (rushomancy), Thursday, 17 January 2019 03:33 (five years ago) link
that's youtube, btw
But doing so did help show your age.
― MarkoP, Thursday, 17 January 2019 15:59 (five years ago) link
The spotify playlist for "Set The Controls for the Heart of the Sun" is weird in that it picks songs with vaguely similar aspects, except not the aspects that make Set the Controls actually interesting
― silverfish, Thursday, 17 January 2019 18:20 (five years ago) link
ok, in keeping with the theme of the thread, my "set the controls" playlist, off the top of my head:
chico hamilton quintet - blue sandsom - pilgrimageoneida - people of the norththe slits - earthbeat/wedding songblues control & laraaji - awakening day
you decide
― The Elvis of Nationalism and Amoral Patriotism (rushomancy), Friday, 18 January 2019 02:48 (five years ago) link
^ will listen as soon as i get wifi in my house or i can make it to the coffee shop before work
― budo jeru, Friday, 18 January 2019 03:11 (five years ago) link
i also asked my floyd nerd friends and one of them recommended "om pax om" from the film "sign of aquarius", maybe that one as well
― The Elvis of Nationalism and Amoral Patriotism (rushomancy), Friday, 18 January 2019 04:12 (five years ago) link