Tinker, Tailor, Soldier, Spy (novel, miniseries, and forthcoming film to be directed by Tomas Alfredson)

hi lag∞n!

haay

watching again (movie) and rly its excellent

the little drummer girl is pretty good so far

ilm

This is my comfort movie

have u watched the mini series

Do we all love the BBC’s Smiley’s People? I love the BBC’s Smiley’s People. That and Tinker Tailor I’ll watch at least once per year.

its great but its a step below TTSS tbf

I know that TTSS is all about claustrophobic offices etc but it really is fun to see smiley hopping around Europe a bit.

Lagoon I’ve seen the miniseries but it came from the library. I’d probably rewatch that a ton too if it were available digitally.

i think its on youtube if thats not a major turnoff

Don't know if anyone on here can answer this, but is the movie version in any way comprehensible to people who have neither read the book nor seen the miniseries? It barely made sense to me, and I felt that was only helped by my familiarity with the story.

The movie was the first form I consumed this in and I found it comprehensible even though it was highly elliptical.

the bern episode of smiley's people is top 3 of the 12 IMO

ive seen the movie a few times, the miniseries twice and read the book and last night i knew what was happening but at two key stages i didnt know how smiley knew what he knew

but im no smiley tbf

The movie cuts a complicated plot down to the bone. Spy intrigue as impressionistic dream logic.

the answer is FLUCHT NACH VORN, toby is the man who spotted it

(it translates as smiley saying "fuck it, let's to it and be legends")

I just started reading Little Drummer Girl, hope it's good because it's much longer than I expected.

it's bad

women are a mystery to him in a bad way

(TV can sort this out possibly)

TV show is good so far although the dialogue feels weirdly modern and incongruous.

Also they keep deciding to go up to the Acropolis for no reason other than to go "look, we're at the Acropolis!"

isn't that the exact same reason everyone goes to the acropolis tho?

y'all brits can see the best stuff what you pillaged iirc

Spy intrigue as impressionistic dream logic.

This gets at exactly what I love about this movie. My platonic ideal of this kind of story has a rigidly coherent internal logic that is nevertheless inaccessible to the reader/viewer and only reveals itself in suggestion.

(There's a possible metaphysical suggestion as well in that kind of structure--in that solving a mystery probably does involve, at some point, a mysterious intuitive leap, spontaneously making sense out of nonsense, etc.)

watching again (movie) and rly its excellent

― lie back and think of englund (darraghmac), Sunday, November 4, 2018 1:41 PM (yesterday)

i watched it again last week, and it was better than I remembered. I liked the miniseries better, but the movie was more aesthetic, the way movies tend to be, esp. vs. 20th century TV.

Also, slightly off topic, I've always wondered whether the show MI-5/Spooks was paying homage to this when they introduced the character of Connie, who initially seemed modeled on Connie from TTSS

My favorite thing about Le Carre is that most of his books are told in flashback/retrospect, so there's this overwhelming fatalistic "nothing to be done about it now, just clean up the mess" vibe which is very appealing to me as a middle-aged man.

One aspect of TTSS I really enjoy is the distance between Ricki Tarr’s self-image as a master spy and the reality of him as a fuckup.

i feel like in the Le Carre world, many characters have that aspect

the miniseries is atmospheric but it does suffer in a non-charming way from bbc ca.1980 production values.

i think in some ways i prefer the movie. but although oldman is not ... miscast ... he's totally forgettable (i guess that's deliberate via acting)

https://electricliterature.com/ranking-every-john-le-carr%C3%A9-adaptation-82b1532d001f

ok but he gets the One Massive Big Thing he needs to get right (and that's what smiley spots and it's why he knows the things he knows that deems couldn't work out why he knows them)

(not least: if tarr had in fact been the tar-baby that karla sent to smoke out merlin, they'd have picked someone who was less of a fuckup)

it does suffer in a non-charming way from bbc ca.1980 production values

sir our friendship ends here

i kinda feel like the forgettable quality gets at the essence of Smiley and that type of figure in Le Carre's work. I mean, in terms of espionage, you want to be forgettable, you don't want the enemy to be able to read you, think you are significant, or remember much about you, in order to avoid capture.

https://cdn-images-1.medium.com/max/1600/1*luLXOCVtodcB3MvHRl359A.png

me and my pals goofin off

I was just thinking, WTF happened to Tomas Alfredson anyway? Then I remembered lol The Snowman

oof yeah that was a rough landing :(

I agree w/you on Tarr getting the info and he’s not a completely unresourceful amateur, but he winds up in way over his head and thoroughly unprepared for the enemy coming at him, which is at odds with the suavity and confidence he exhibits in the early going. All he can do at a certain point is escape and sneak back into England.

I think sarahell gets at that point a bit too, Ricki is a bit flashy and reckless when he should be a bit more low key.

bold who does it best:

PRIDEAUX: Ian Bannen vs Mark Strong (tie)
CONTROL: Alexander Knox vs John Hurt
SMILEY: Alec Guiness vs Gary Oldman
ALLELINE: Michael Aldridge vs Toby Jones
ESTERHASE: Bernad Hepton vs David Dencik
BLAND: Terrance Rigby vs Ciaran Hinds
HAYDON: Ian Richardson vs Colin Firth (tie)
CONNIE SACHS: Beryl Reid vs Kathy Burke
GUILLAM: Michael Jayston vs Benedict Cumberbatch
WESTERBY: Joss Ackland vs Stephen Graham
LACON: Anthony Bate vs Simon McBurney
TARR: Hywell Bennett vs Tom Hardy (tie)
IRINA: Susan Kodicek vs Katrina Vasilieva
MENDEL: George Sewell vs Roger Lloyd Pack

in the movie some of these roles had very little to do

I mean, it's up there with ranking best portrayals of "Henchman #3" in Die Hard movies

if there were a die hard tv series in which they were permitted to spread their wings yes

hepton is the main flaw in the TV SP i think

i don't really agree re hinds vs rigby but the character is such an unsketched nullity even in the book that it's mainly bcz i think i took against some character hinds played in something

sure! but like Bland's part in the movie was the equivalent of Henchman #3 in a Die Hard movie

lol i think it's the villain in lara croft: tomb raider – the cradle of life

xp

fuck that guy

GUILLAM: Michael Jayston vs Benedict Cumberbatch

but this, yes, yes, yes