the vinyl version I have of this record is perfectly fine
― Neil S, Sunday, 12 August 2018 14:26 (five years ago) link
how has this thread been around for eight years without one of the most unbelievable verses DB ever wrote in it
got 2 tickets for a midnight executionwe'll hitchhike our way from odessa to houston and when they turn on the chairsomething's added to the airforever
― she carries a torch. two torches, actually (Joan Crawford Loves Chachi), Sunday, 12 August 2018 14:27 (five years ago) link
honestly, i thought we had a whole dedicated to that song! but i'm looking now, and don't see one.
― Karl Malone, Sunday, 12 August 2018 14:39 (five years ago) link
a whole thread, i meant.
but yeah, those words will always give me goosebumps. s&j was my intro to silver jews
― Karl Malone, Sunday, 12 August 2018 14:44 (five years ago) link
Huh — I always thought it was, “
― empire bro-lesque (morrisp), Sunday, 12 August 2018 14:50 (five years ago) link
...“We hitchhike away from a desolate Houston”
― empire bro-lesque (morrisp), Sunday, 12 August 2018 14:51 (five years ago) link
FTR, I think my favorite song on the album is “Like Like The The The Death” — both musically and lyrically (notwithstanding the bum line, “Nobody cares about a dead hooker”)
― empire bro-lesque (morrisp), Sunday, 12 August 2018 16:05 (five years ago) link
― circa1916, Sunday, 12 August 2018 22:28 (five years ago) link
Here comes the coda
Not much water coming over the hillNot much, not much, not muchNot much water coming over the hillNot much, not much, not much
Is there a coda thread? I know Ned has talked eloquently and correctly about New Order's Regret, and that's the greatest thing. But SM's work here is immense. Love this album. Don't think I've seen this thread until today.
― kraudive, Sunday, 12 August 2018 22:34 (five years ago) link
The bird of VirginiaAre flying within yaAnd like background singersThey all come in threesAnd like background singersThey all come in threes
― Heez, Friday, 24 April 2020 03:26 (four years ago) link
I would've been a "We Are Real" voter because it would fit better on his slightly better album Natural Bridge
― Heez, Friday, 24 April 2020 03:28 (four years ago) link
from the op:
During a brief pause in conversation, the delicate sound of ringing guitar from a song called "Self-Ignition" escaped through a studio door. Berman described the song as a future B-side, explaining that the band had run through the track too quickly for it to make the final cut for the album. "We've never sounded tight like this," Berman said. "There's hard-rocking songs where we've never had that level of intensity before. They're really charged songs."
did this ever become a song?
― let me be your friend on the other end! (Karl Malone), Friday, 24 April 2020 04:33 (four years ago) link
Yeah:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W90V4D1P9VY
― I eat fast foods (morrisp), Friday, 24 April 2020 04:39 (four years ago) link
(It was indeed a B-side, to “Send In The Clouds”)
― I eat fast foods (morrisp), Friday, 24 April 2020 04:41 (four years ago) link
oh nice, thanks! i know absolutely zero silver jews b-sides
― let me be your friend on the other end! (Karl Malone), Friday, 24 April 2020 04:43 (four years ago) link
22 years old today. What a beast of a record.
― Jersey Al (Albert R. Broccoli), Wednesday, 21 October 2020 00:11 (three years ago) link
I've got two tickets to a midnight executionWe'll hitchhike our way from Odessa to HoustonAnd when they turn on the chairSomething's added to the airWhen they turn on the chairSomething's added to the air forever
― treeship., Wednesday, 21 October 2020 00:32 (three years ago) link
So many strange and fantastic moments on this record. RIP.
My life at home everydayDrinking coke in a kitchen with a dog that doesn’t know it’s name
― Heez, Wednesday, 21 October 2020 01:16 (three years ago) link
One of my dumbest opinions is that i don’t really fully fuck with this album (despite the openers being 2 of my lifetime favs) bc there’s too much steve malkmis on it and when I put silver jews on its cus I’m in the mood to hear DB
― flopson, Wednesday, 21 October 2020 06:15 (three years ago) link
Here's something that's always mystified me: in Buckingham Rabbit, the last line of every stanza is repeated two times, except for "I can track a single bee to the hive." Why?
― J. Sam, Tuesday, 3 November 2020 15:37 (three years ago) link
I want to make a cocktail called a shattered dog on the rocks
― Heez, Tuesday, 3 November 2020 17:22 (three years ago) link
Haha same. For maximum authenticity you would need to blow your rent money on the whiskey you use to make the drink
― J. Sam, Tuesday, 3 November 2020 17:37 (three years ago) link
― J. Sam, Tuesday, November 3, 2020 10:37 AM (two hours ago) bookmarkflaglink
he's tracking a single bee, not two bees
― glengarry gary beers (voodoo chili), Tuesday, 3 November 2020 17:39 (three years ago) link
xps I love the Malk presence on this record; to continue with the cocktail theme, he's like the soda to Berman's straight whiskey, adds lightness/sweetness/delicacy/bubbliness.
― american primitive stylophone (zchyrs), Tuesday, 3 November 2020 17:43 (three years ago) link
I had p much the exact experience as flopson with this record for a long time too, but ive come to appreciate the malkmus presence over the years
― turn the jawhatthefuckever on (One Eye Open), Tuesday, 3 November 2020 17:53 (three years ago) link
I thought I was alone in not digging Malkmus much here! The high points *are* rather high but I nowadays get more excited about the prospect of listening to pretty much any other long-player as a whole album, with the exception of perhaps Tanglewood Numbers.
― Nag! Nag! Nag!, Tuesday, 3 November 2020 22:43 (three years ago) link
I adore everything Berman did but American Water yeah
― kraudive, Tuesday, 3 November 2020 23:32 (three years ago) link
hey there riders on the storm HOLD THE WORLD TO ITS WORD
― reggie (qualmsley), Tuesday, 3 November 2020 23:42 (three years ago) link
― glengarry gary beers (voodoo chili), Tuesday, November 3, 2020 12:39 PM (yesterday) bookmarkflaglink
damn.
― J. Sam, Wednesday, 4 November 2020 14:01 (three years ago) link
the malkmus songs on american water are v good, but they wouldn’t be the best songs on any pavement album and they’re also like, kinda funky? in a way that i just don’t think jibes with dave’s songs
― flopson, Thursday, 5 November 2020 06:02 (three years ago) link
They are funky - and the gtr work at the end of “Blue Arrangements” is sort of the heart of the album for me. This should not be taken as a slight at Berman, but Malk’s presence is core to the SJs sound for me.
― Tim Simms (morrisp), Thursday, 5 November 2020 07:05 (three years ago) link
I like this one even more than the last two Pavement records--feel like the SJ's w/SM are just a "different" kind of band. I think there are less stinkers for sure on this one. Like on Tanglewood, everything on Side 2 but How Can I love you but you won't lie die down doesn't really work for me. Whereas Side 2 of American Water is all hits. Same with Lookout Mountain, there's def. a drop off on side two.
I dunno I think they brought out the best of each other when they worked together, and I love their harmonizing.
― a (waterface), Thursday, 5 November 2020 13:26 (three years ago) link
they hit fagen/becker peaks
― reggie (qualmsley), Thursday, 5 November 2020 13:52 (three years ago) link
tbh i think what threw me off about it for so long might just have been SMs vocals, the incongruity of hearing another voice from another well-known band popping up. Silver Jews are one of those bands that feel like an island unto themselves, off in their own sui generis soundworld. Periodically hearing the voice from "Range Life" just felt so strange and spellbreaking
― turn the jawhatthefuckever on (One Eye Open), Thursday, 5 November 2020 14:14 (three years ago) link
But Malkmus’s voice (and guitar) is all over the early records...
― Tim Simms (morrisp), Thursday, 5 November 2020 14:44 (three years ago) link
yeah maybe this is a thing where if your first SJ was Starlite Walker, or the early stuff, that's one way. but if your first intro was the Natural Bridge, or anything *after* American Water, you might vibe on the band different. he was there at the start. . .
― a (waterface), Thursday, 5 November 2020 14:47 (three years ago) link
Yeah theres something to that. I cant remember what my first one was, but I know I'd heard pavement first so that was definitely a thing in my head when absorbing SJ for the first time. SMs guitar always made perfect sense, but hearing a voice other than DBs on threw me off for a long time. Even the songs where Carrie sings felt weird to me the first times i heard them, the cognitive dissonance of being in David Berman's head and suddenly then hearing someone other than him.
― turn the jawhatthefuckever on (One Eye Open), Thursday, 5 November 2020 15:02 (three years ago) link
Keep in mind that Malkmus & Nastanovich were pissed & hurt when Berman went off and made a record without them. They felt like he had “broke up the band.” That’s how much of a unit they were (at least to those guys).
― Tim Simms (morrisp), Thursday, 5 November 2020 15:20 (three years ago) link
(You may find that unfair, as they had another successful band, but regardless...)
― Tim Simms (morrisp), Thursday, 5 November 2020 15:21 (three years ago) link
def something to that.
i love DCB more than just about anything and Silver Jews was his thing, but for me SM's presence on Starlite Walker and American Water is, as morrisp says, core to the sound.
and i hopped on board w/ Starlite Walker. i can see how if you did so later, SM might feel intrusive on the older stuff.
― alpine static, Thursday, 5 November 2020 15:27 (three years ago) link
yeah i know the history, and i love all of american water now, but i dunno i also think that regardless of SMs key importance to the DNA of that sound, at the end of the day the platonic ideal of SJ was just not a duet/bg vox kind of band, in my mind. Its like hearing Eno sing on Remain in Light, for me - it works in the context of how the band and there sound are operating, but theres also always a part of my brain that goes "oh huh - that guys here too, i guess". Its interesting - especially with songwriter type stuff theres definitely something about hearing multiple voices on a song that changes the alchemy of it for a listener (beyond just "this story is being told by two people" or "this part carries special emphasis because someone is singing along with the lead"). I'll have to think about it.
― turn the jawhatthefuckever on (One Eye Open), Thursday, 5 November 2020 15:35 (three years ago) link
Just to counter some of the anachronistic revisionism ITT, from a 1994 interview with DCB & BN:
BN: Pavement is mainly Steve’s songwriting. It’s the principal reason for the band existing. Whereas Silver Jews there’s a totally different guy serving the same role. It’s a totally different thing, and Steven is really good friends with David and he’s a really good guitar player. He really enjoys David’s writing, and having the freedom to just jam on guitar and his responsibilities in Silver Jews are absolutely minimal. It’s totally great for him to relax. For me, the best two times I’ve ever been on stage have been the two nights we played the Drag City Invitational. There was an intense pressure, and I felt that I was an extremely important part of the band. In Pavement, my role has always been soley live, and pretty much to add spirit and enthusiasm; musically, it’s no where near as important as when I’m in the Silver Jews. I have far greater input in Silver Jews. With the new album, we had 12 sheets of paper with lyrics on them and we basically wrote songs around those words.DCB: Exactly. Yeah, now, for the last couple years it’s been mostly songs that either I’ve written beforehand or Steve and I sat down for a little bit and worked something out more clearly. Because none of that stuff we recorded in the house, which came out on records, was… we were just recording for our own pleasure, you know. We all worked really hard jobs and it was really tense living where we did, and it was fun for us at night to just howl. Afterwards, it became songwriting.CB: So how did Pavement work out of all this? Were the Silver Jews playing together first?DCB: Well, we played a lot together in college, but we didn’t call ourselves the Silver Jews. Steve went home and brought up Pavement, just after he graduated from college.CB: So kind of?DCB: Well, in a way, technically, on a time-line, yes, first. But, Pavement’s always been what Steve does and that’s him. Pavement is Steve. Silver Jews as at least until recently, three friends getting together and making music.CB: So you sort of play the role that Steve does in Pavement in the Silver Jews, you’re more the-DCB: Well, on this record especially. I wrote all the songs. Steve is good to have around because he’s a complete song stylist and I can bring even a really lame song out and he can polish anything up with what he does. He can make anything into gold. Now, he likes to take more of a backseat, and it’s good for me because I’ve gotten to the point where I have a vision of what I want things to be like whereas before I didn’t. I knew what I wanted this record to be like. I knew exactly what I wanted…
DCB: Exactly. Yeah, now, for the last couple years it’s been mostly songs that either I’ve written beforehand or Steve and I sat down for a little bit and worked something out more clearly. Because none of that stuff we recorded in the house, which came out on records, was… we were just recording for our own pleasure, you know. We all worked really hard jobs and it was really tense living where we did, and it was fun for us at night to just howl. Afterwards, it became songwriting.
CB: So how did Pavement work out of all this? Were the Silver Jews playing together first?
DCB: Well, we played a lot together in college, but we didn’t call ourselves the Silver Jews. Steve went home and brought up Pavement, just after he graduated from college.
CB: So kind of?
DCB: Well, in a way, technically, on a time-line, yes, first. But, Pavement’s always been what Steve does and that’s him. Pavement is Steve. Silver Jews as at least until recently, three friends getting together and making music.
CB: So you sort of play the role that Steve does in Pavement in the Silver Jews, you’re more the-
DCB: Well, on this record especially. I wrote all the songs. Steve is good to have around because he’s a complete song stylist and I can bring even a really lame song out and he can polish anything up with what he does. He can make anything into gold. Now, he likes to take more of a backseat, and it’s good for me because I’ve gotten to the point where I have a vision of what I want things to be like whereas before I didn’t. I knew what I wanted this record to be like. I knew exactly what I wanted…
https://tomsugden.github.io/cordsuit//articles/cool-beans-interview.html
― Jersey Al (Albert R. Broccoli), Thursday, 5 November 2020 16:30 (three years ago) link
i'm pretty sure i heard American Water before i spent much time (if any) with Pavement.
Silver Jews-style Malkmus is still my favorite
― @oneposter(✔️) (Karl Malone), Thursday, 5 November 2020 16:35 (three years ago) link
guys i get sm's role in the history of silver jews, v familiar with the stories of these bands. it took me a while to get into the presence of vox by someone other than the primary songwriter /= revisionist history
― turn the jawhatthefuckever on (One Eye Open), Thursday, 5 November 2020 16:51 (three years ago) link
This to me is the <3 of American Water
Steve is good to have around because he’s a complete song stylist and I can bring even a really lame song out and he can polish anything up with what he does. He can make anything into gold.
― a (waterface), Thursday, 5 November 2020 17:17 (three years ago) link
who’s BN?
― flopson, Thursday, 5 November 2020 23:25 (three years ago) link
bob nastanovich, i think
― @oneposter(✔️) (Karl Malone), Thursday, 5 November 2020 23:28 (three years ago) link
Fwiw it’s strictly a voice thing for me; i love Steve’s guitar all over American water. the solo on random rules is perfect. even like the goofy wah pedal on People
― flopson, Thursday, 5 November 2020 23:32 (three years ago) link
that quotes interesting.. it’s so hard for me to imagine Dave writing federal dust tho. the whole vocal melody and rhythm of it is so Steve. Blue arrangements too
― flopson, Thursday, 5 November 2020 23:34 (three years ago) link