"Smells Like Teen Spirit" - Classic Or Dud?

Ghrol makes this song what it is

I don't know where this BS line started that Grohl was inspired by the Gap Band's "Early in the Morning, but given that "Teen Spirit" already bears a passing minor key resemblance to "More Than a Feeling," check out the drum fill leading in to the final chorus, around 2:45:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ufQUxoidxkM

It came from Grohl himself in an interview he did with Pharrell where he cited Funk licks/beats/rolls he used on Nevermind.

Faking the funk! J'accuse!

Yeah, he's full of shit, lol.

That album is exceptionally not funky, and drum intro to Teen Spirit sounds nothing like the Gap Band. But it does sound like that bit in More Than a Feeling, which the rest of the song sounds like, too. Possibly mature Grohl is guilty of a little revisionism.

Stubblefield...Ferrone...Grohl

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dZCrdSC2-1I

Opened this up and was reminded of "Teen Sprite" from a few years ago. The original link above was taken down, and it's a little harder to find now--it's on YouTube under the name "Nirvirna." It's probably impossible to erase anything permanently, someone will always be around to re-post, but if you've never heard it, there does seem to be some effort to do so.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tX24A6sSR8s

I agree I don't hear it on "Early In The Morning" but 100% hear it on the opening of "Burn Rubber On Me" fwiw

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tmcncGirAU4

I don't hear it, it lacks that bass drum syncopation, which the Boston fill has.

xpost A few years ago there were a whole bunch of major key versions of minor key songs posted. I seem to recall the major key Losing My Religion was pretty good.

this will always be the definitive version for me

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VRdc0OxUmYg

Oh.

I remember Tom Scholz being sore about the similarities. I heard a radio interview before a Boston concert in the mid-'90s and he and/or Delp bitching about doing "The Nirvana Song" onstage.

xp (Fun fact: the tires screeching before the drum intro is sampled for the instrumental chorus of NWA's "Straight Outta Compton")

I don’t hear any fill at 2:45 in the Boston song?

Agree with Steve it totally sounds like the opening of the gap band jam and it’s used In exactly the same way

I think he meant 3:45

Yeah, sorry. Toward the end.

Dave Grohl got me reeling
When ripped off "More Than Feeling"

AMANDA

The drums definitely enter "Teen Spirit" the same sort of way they enter those Gap Band tracks, but come on, there is no way Grohl was thinking Gap Band, Cameo and Chic when he was recording "Nevermind." At, what, age 22? With his punk background? Nah. But old man Grohl now, friend to everyone, lover of all music, sure. He probably wanted to seem hip to Pharrell.

Reminds me of some making of "Murmur" thing I read years ago (I don't think it was Niimi's book) where they were talking about the supposedly "anything goes" recording, trying everything, including sliding in James Brown samples. Come on, no they weren't.

I read the early circa 2000 posts above. So much hate for this song/band!

Like, show us on the doll where the Anarchy cheerleader touched you...

my god I remember that pixies talking point it was used all the time as if it was the last word on nirvana as a band. they sound nothing alike! not even on SLTS except for some of the basic dynamics. it seems like people were just repeating something cobain said once as an excuse to flex their indie cred (and it worked in that it made me feel totally basic for liking nirvana more). the best legacy of the pixies reunion is that it totally killed the mystique that made them such a trump card in these games

anyway isn't everyone who does the quiet/loud thing just ripping off haydn?

fwiw as a 15 year old when Smells Like Teen Spirit came out, I saw the video on MTV in the school common room, knew nothing about them, and thought "I like this it sounds a bit like a heavier version of the Pixies".

I didn't have a lot of other points of reference for indie rock/punk stuff at the time mind you. I'd bought Doolittle a few months prior to this and was listening to it constantly.

I can hear it if I squint but they seem very different to me probably because my introduction to nirvana was more like "this is like a better version of nickelback". discovering the pixies later was on was like getting inducted into the cool kids gang. but nirvana was for everyone

this song is OK

there's a pretty clear line from "gigantic" to a lot of nirvana, not much else though

ok I was wrong they're not nothing alike and I guess I hear a lot of kim deal in nirvana's bass parts too (and those of so many other bands since then)

getting into 80s-90s alt/indie rock all at once after the fact makes it harder to know how the parts fit together than if you grew up with it

I have no interest in Nirvana, but this was a great song on a great album and that should be the final word, and no they don’t sound like the Pixies

nobody said they were a one-to-one match, that’s not how influence works

Besides a few of the other hallmarks - the screaming, the stark dynamics - I find it odd that the most blatant Pixies identifier is ... 8th note bass lines? That's really it, isn't it, the bass? Whether it's "Teen Spirit" or Sugar's "A Good Idea," if you want to sound like the Pixies, you play ... a straight forward bass part. But there have to be antecedents to something so simple, right?

speaking of antecedents whenever i hear that driving downbeat snare drum pattern (like in the gap band song) i think motown

The drums definitely enter "Teen Spirit" the same sort of way they enter those Gap Band tracks, but come on, there is no way Grohl was thinking Gap Band, Cameo and Chic when he was recording "Nevermind." At, what, age 22? With his punk background? Nah. But old man Grohl now, friend to everyone, lover of all music, sure. He probably wanted to seem hip to Pharrell.

Reminds me of some making of "Murmur" thing I read years ago (I don't think it was Niimi's book) where they were talking about the supposedly "anything goes" recording, trying everything, including sliding in James Brown samples. Come on, no they weren't.

― Josh in Chicago, Monday, November 13, 2023 7:48 PM (yesterday) bookmarkflaglink

Why is there “no way”? That stuff was on radio. It was a big sound at the time. He may have even done it subconsciously and looked back and been like oh damn that’s where I got that. Idk, the Boston thing is similar but it’s *kurt* who was inspired by Boston

yeah I don't see why Gap Band, etc. wouldn't have been on Grohl's musical diet. I still remember 30 years ago when it astounded some people to learn that "More Than a Feeling" inspired (in part) SLTS -- was he too punk for it or something?

IME drummers have always been drum nerds who like weird drum music, so the Grohl/Gap connection sounds v plausible

I mean, nothing is impossible. "Nevermind" was recorded in, what, 1991? When "Early in the Morning" was a hit he was 13, and by his own account a full-on punk rocker. So sure, it's *possible*, he just seems like a dude that listened to Boston on purpose but maybe only heard the Gap Band in passing; definitely he and Kurt heard the Boston song a million times whether they wanted to or not. I do think he might have heard "(Not Just) Knee Deep" by way of De La, though; it has a similar drum intro. But none of these funky examples feature the bass drum syncopation that the Boston and Nirvana songs have, and "Teen Spirt" already sounds a bit like "More Than a Feeling."

Here's a clip of Grohl playing a vintage TCB/Junkyard Band-style bounce-beat on RDGLDGRN studio sessions:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4FuatudrCjA

(time stamp 1m28s)

Definitely Grohl, like a lot of DC punk dudes (like MacKaye and Rollins), was apparently into go-go:

"As I was walking down the street, a car drives by, and go-go's blaring out of it. That's how you know that you're in Washington, D.C., because it doesn't even really stretch to Baltimore, or Richmond. It is Washington, D.C. Now, New Orleans has jazz, right? Chicago's got the blues. D.C. (has) go-go music, which is like a funk-based music that was started in the early '70s, pioneered by this guy Chuck Brown. It sort of evolved into this huge local scene. When I was a kid, growing up (in Washington, D.C.), you'd get three or four go-go bands to play together: Trouble Funk, Junk Yard, Rare Essence — put 'em all together, you had a good, like, 30,000 people. You know, that doesn't happen anywhere else. I was always really proud that wherever — when I started touring as a young musician, I'd go to Europe and I'd say to people, 'have you heard go-go?' They'd say, 'what's go-go music?' And I'd play 'em Trouble Funk."

Tbf, the clip of him talking about the Gap Band, it's not really laid out as an influence on "Teen Spirit" specifically, just the album generally, which is more plausible (to me). He calls it the "disco flam." The doc does insert a clip of "Teen Spirit," but those big snare flams are all over the record, for sure.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dZCrdSC2-1I

Most of these references rested somewhere within their collective patchwork after 15+ years of active and passive listening. At the very least these "unusual" choices were indirectly influencing the arrangements. Seems weird that Grohl would be bullshitting even if he just meant it was something he realized later. Just the same, Cobain did not actively cite Boston. In fact he probably would have thrown away the song pretty quickly if he was aware early enough.

I could believe that Grohl only realized later where those influences came from, that makes the most sense.

Wasn't the story that Cobain almost tossed the song because it sounded too close to the Pixies? That may have been BS as well, just like Bob Mould claiming he didn't notice the similarities between "A Good Idea" and "Debaser" until much later. Sure, Bob; the song works better as an homage than it does as a false modesty stumble into brilliance.

For sure Cobain knew "More Than a Feeling," so it would be surprising to me if he didn't notice the (admittedly fleeting) resemblance. "Teen Spirit" bears more of a resemblance to the Pixies than it does Boston, but it only barely sounds like Pixies, either.

This is my fave "Teen Spirit" clip:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oeb5LdAyLC8

My college radio station was chosen to debut SLTS to the world and while the 12" was delivered in a white label, Kurt drew what the proposed artwork concept for Nevermind would be on a mailer:

https://www.instagram.com/p/CzKB3pjysa2/

Glad they didn’t go w the “H!tl3r Baby” concept.

For sure Cobain knew "More Than a Feeling," so it would be surprising to me if he didn't notice the (admittedly fleeting) resemblance. "Teen Spirit" bears more of a resemblance to the Pixies than it does Boston, but it only barely sounds like Pixies, either.

they lampshaded the resemblance at reading '92

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R3XIGon2RjY