No Irish, No Yanks, No Clogs - FIFA World Cup 2018

One thing England did look good at last night was being able to get back in numbers very quickly indeed, which made it harder for Colombia to get through on the break. They would probably have won in the 90 if they hadn't commmitted the utterly basic error of putting their shortest player on the post at setpieces.

I see you with that edit button, Matt, ruining my zing about what Trippier said in the bench-match interview.

I don't get why Southgate has twice brought Vardy on then not had him play on the shoulder of the last defender, Vardy-style, but instead have him play a roving striker role more suited to either Welbeck or Rashford IMO.

shorter defender on the back post makes sense to me, you're going to want your bigger players challenging for the initial ball

xp (Matt DC)

Noticed that too, whenever Columbia deigned to put the ball into the final third England had it well covered.

Also, I’m sure it’ll already have been said but winning that game on penalties has probably done a lot more for their confidence and belief than if they’d seen it out in the 90..

https://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football/world-cup/england-vs-colombia-penalty-shootout-video-watch-tactics-gareth-southgate-a8430156.html

This is an interesting article, in particular identifying Dier's spell as defensive midfielder as the part when England were shakiest.

is it fair to see that if james had been fit, we'd have seen a far different game from colombia? think that was a huge stroke of good fortune for england

seesay

I was wondering about Vardy pen pass up too. Not a good sign. Maybe he took a knock. Maybe Pickford should start taking some.

in depth discussion of England penalty strategy = sorry for being the Grinch, i'll accept i'm under-rating them and shut up

still puzzled as to why jamie vardy didn't take a penalty. he's leicester's regular penalty taker isn't he? unlike henderson, trippier, dier, rashford...

Doesn't play for Spurs so wasn't worth the risk

(plus has a groin injury apparently)

In the past 25 years they've produced precisely one player capable of playing the really decisive, instinctively incisive pass against teams that defend deep, and they treated him like a shitty utility player on the left because England managers are idiots.

Can we poll who this might be referring to? I'm unsure tbunfairttl

Scholes, innit?

Scholes?

Scholes?

Are English commentators worse in terms of gross bias or saying stupid nonsense than the commentators of other countries? I mean, I only have direct experience of US commentators (and even then only a game or two and years ago) but my impression was they were as bad. Oh and there was that Norwegian fellow about fifty years ago.

England still seem vapid in the middle to me, but it's a different kind of vapidity than we've had in the last 20 years or so - less melancholy and entitled, more workmanlike and unfussy. Neither makes for good football, particularly, but there isn't that heavy sense of loss that's hung around for what seems like ever.

ach even if it was just broadcasting to Engish people i can get behind home team bias but the tone of English bias is riddled with natural order of things greatest nation in the world why isn't this obvious to everybody else bullshit that i can't believe is played out exactly the same everywhere

and WE ARE THE KEEPERS OF CORINTHIAN HONESTY SEE HOW THESE FOREIGNERS CHEAT AND REFUSE TO BE REAL MEN which is ah god sorry yay they're in the quarter finals let's hope we can keep winning on pens

an audience which also includes scotland, wales and norn iron

Who love-to-hate watch England games mostly so they can complain about the inevitable bias. Unless maybe they too support England in these situations which apparently can be a thing too. Always funny to go thru this at every tournament tho - dreaming of the day the non-English Brits can praise the English commentators and pundits for exemplary even-handedness. Independence for every fragment of this embittered isle tho imho.

yeah if they didn't secretly enjoy it they'd watch their own coverage oh wait

ach even if it was just broadcasting to Engish people i can get behind home team bias but the tone of English bias is riddled with natural order of things greatest nation in the world why isn't this obvious to everybody else bullshit that i can't believe is played out exactly the same everywhere

― Neymar, Mr Nice Guy (Noodle Vague), Wednesday, 4 July 2018 10:57 (three minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I could believe that the English are worse than everyone else but I'm not sure about that, I mean it's not commentators but I have a clear memory of a Brazilian headline years ago that was "Brazil will win because God is Brazilian". Doesn't everywhere have its own pathology of (roughly) this kind? Not saying it makes it right, and more than happy to accept that it's particularly unpalatable for England (actually probably any bit of Great Britain) given our history, but I can't believe that's unique.

Apols for garble.

glad england won. but i did have the link to the youtube pizza hut advert from 1996 in my paste buffer, just in case.

I'm saying most places play this kind of thing out in their own way. Football commentators are very often excessive in their opinions and expression; I am not convinced English ones are uniquely offensive.

i get it. i'm not convinced they're *not* the most offensive but i'm theoretically English and also in a sour mood and i'm amplifying the sourness thru too much dwelling on a very limited set of idiots.

I'm Welsh and happy to support England in this.

Also not upset by former English players using "we" when co-commentating, unlike lots of chippy twats around here.

watching (bits of) far-left ENG twitter shouting "down with the england it is imperialist, tonight i support belgium!" has been an education

remember the Congo

yeah it's a terrible arena to play performative politics, my distaste is mainly aesthetic in a "you're making it hard to watch the football without shouting at the TV" way

but i have a kneejerk assumption that as soon as somebody piles in with "this is corrupt and terrible and what about the children" they're probably not really into football which is fine but y'know

I'm pretty sure that Italian football coverage is as bad as England's in this regard.

Almost all of the coverage this time has been based around the relative 'easiness' of England's route rather than a distorted perception of the team's quality. From distance it may not look any different though. 50/50 on whether they create more against Sweden or just revert to type.

[On a side-note, it makes me whenever a player attributes a win or a goal to God - Messi did it earlier in the tournament, saying "I knew we'd get through because I could feel God on our side" or somesuch; Mina was making hand signals after his goal last night which clearly meant "it wasn't me, it was God". I am always very pleased to see such people abandoned by their deity in favour of a team that God values more.}

The UK, and therefore England, is in a unique position, there is literally no comparison that can usefully be made with any other footballing nation.

I'm pretty much certain pundits and commentators are as bad, possibly even worse, all over the world but, people in Uruguay don't have to listen to Argentinian media coverage, for instance.

The obvious solution to this problem is to have a UK team for the BBC to support.

Remind me what the coverage was like during Wales games at the last semi-final?

Last tournament, even. Not with it today.

Like I remember anything at all about the coverage of a Welsh team.

the meltdowns and arguments amongst leftist twitter show how contentious anything involving english identity is in 2018

I've tried to forget it too xp

weren't the irish team looked upon fondly when they qualified and england didn't? something something, jackie charlton. 90? 94?

Yeah, lots of condescending 'Irish eyes are smiling' stuff, plus the automatic assumption that everyone in the UK would be supporting Ireland etc. Admittedly there are hundreds of thousands of Irish people in this country who would have been watching the BBC, but the same is also true that the vast majority of people watching England on either the BBC or ITV are supporting them.

Was there entirely separate Scottish coverage back in 1998 or am I imagining that?

We got separate Welsh coverage for the Euros which was about as great as you'd imagine it to be.

So long since Scotland qualified for anything I'm not sure I can remember. Definitely separate commentary and match summarizers - not sure about different pundits?

Probably different pundits too.

Yeah, think we got Kevin Ratcliffe and Barry Horne

this is currently my fav disgusted tweet about england

U lot enthusiastically jumping on "it's coming home"... meanwhile, Brexit, the Windrush scandal and hostile environment policies expose how the English conception of "home" is based on racialised violence and exclusion 👌🏼

— kerem (@KeremBrulee) July 4, 2018