1 in 120 is displaced or asylum seeking. Christ
― Garden variety uncouth (Ross), Sunday, 1 July 2018 08:44 (five years ago) link
Color me skeptical when it comes to US intelligence services and reporting on other countries' movements
― Simon H., Sunday, July 1, 2018 2:25 AM (six hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
I mean I understand being skeptical but if there's any party for whom you should reserve even more skepticism than US intelligence services it's fucking North Korea
― cr.ht (crüt), Sunday, 1 July 2018 12:46 (five years ago) link
Whether it’s correct or not is almost immaterial. DPRK is under no obligation to stop its nuclear programme, aiui, just as the US is under no obligation to delay the opening of the $11bn base in Pyeongtaek or lift sanctions. The agreement reached, as far as I know, was for DPRK to halt test fires and the US to step back from military exercises deemed ‘provocative’ in the short term - with a pact to negotiate further de-escalation. That negotiation is likely to cover things like stopping work on some elements of the nuclear programme and declaring / opening up sites to international inspection in return for sanctions relief and other stuff, but that is all TBC.
Leaving Greenwald aside, the criticism I’ve seen of the leak / framing of the report from people like Tim Shorrock is the suspicion it has been put out there to make the second phase of discussion less likely - by framing DPRK as bad actors (which they are) and Trump as a rube (which he is), it is aiming to turn public opinion against the only viable route to an imperfect peace accord.
― Wag1 Shree Rajneesh (ShariVari), Sunday, 1 July 2018 13:02 (five years ago) link
You've really got it backward if you think whether or not it's correct is immaterial, while free speculation as to the motives of the leaks is the real story.
― Frederik B, Sunday, 1 July 2018 13:09 (five years ago) link
Neither story is particularly huge - DPRK continues to do what they have always done pending further discussion, some sources who don’t like the proposed negotiations leak stuff to the press. It doesn’t have a gigantic bearing on the discussions either way.
― Wag1 Shree Rajneesh (ShariVari), Sunday, 1 July 2018 13:15 (five years ago) link
No, you're right. But the story about DPRK continuing to work on their nuclear program is at least a story, since Trump lied about them doing so. And for some reason, there was a discussion in a lot of media I read whether or not he should be credited for that bluster. The intention behind the leaks is unknown, and is not even a story.
― Frederik B, Sunday, 1 July 2018 13:32 (five years ago) link
good mourning!
― morning wood truancy (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Sunday, 1 July 2018 13:34 (five years ago) link
we had a bit of confusion in Boston so some of us who intended to be trained for the civil disobedience action at South Bay Detention center ended up at a sign-making meeting instead. So ... it was arts-and-crafts activism for me this time!
The action itself went ok it seems. About twenty arrested ... all released by 3ish this morning. Onwards!
― never have i been a blue calm sea (collardio gelatinous), Sunday, 1 July 2018 14:58 (five years ago) link
so there was kind of a 'riot' in Portland
https://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2018/06/portland_police_revoke_permit.htm
also, eff Frederik
― the ignatius rock of ignorance (Dr Morbius), Sunday, 1 July 2018 15:10 (five years ago) link
got a 404 on that link?
"riot" = fascists beating protestors with flagpoles
― sleeve, Sunday, 1 July 2018 15:13 (five years ago) link
sorry
https://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2018/06/portland_police_revoke_permit.html
― the ignatius rock of ignorance (Dr Morbius), Sunday, 1 July 2018 15:21 (five years ago) link
paintballs filled with pepper spray? That's a new one to me. I admire your creativity, Portland Police.
― Josh in Chicago, Sunday, 1 July 2018 16:06 (five years ago) link
i know this isn't surprising at this point, but it's still startling to see them side-by-side
He didn’t even bother to delete the old one pic.twitter.com/A47TuOFfNS— Ryan Lizza (@RyanLizza) June 30, 2018
― Karl Malone, Sunday, 1 July 2018 16:43 (five years ago) link
It’s not though! It’s not remotely startling, covfefe. Can we make the July thread into less of a mess of dumbfoundedness at the “world burning down?” Duh, of course it is. To the extent our systems allow it to. Also if you talk about trump winning re-election please punch yourself in the genitalia Where are the 1987 Korea style protests demanding direct popular elections?
― El Tomboto, Sunday, 1 July 2018 17:00 (five years ago) link
wrt anyone using Iraq as a frame of reference for “this is the deep state trying to undermine the president’s peace plan” theories
Brief, remedial class on the drive to war in Iraq: The invasion was pushed by political appointees in the Bush admin who manipulated raw intelligence, previously discounted by analysts, and created a whole new intelligence office to out-hawk what they viewed as a "liberal" CIA.— Charles Davis (@charliearchy) July 1, 2018
"The agency, called the Office of Special Plans (OSP), was set up by the defence secretary, Donald Rumsfeld, to second-guess CIA information." https://t.co/HyZgVjygqH— Charles Davis (@charliearchy) July 1, 2018
Meanwhile, as McClatchy reported in 2002, anonymous "U.S. intelligence officials said evidence actually suggested that Saddam had been careful to keep al Qaida at arms' length to avoid giving Bush an excuse to invade Iraq." https://t.co/kS34X66Lfy— Charles Davis (@charliearchy) July 1, 2018
But some people believed the White House, seeing the CIA as a den of liberals determined to undermine an elected president's foreign policy.— Charles Davis (@charliearchy) July 1, 2018
― Nerdstrom Poindexter, Sunday, 1 July 2018 17:02 (five years ago) link
If the IC had been as bad and deceitful as Greenwald/Simon says, that Colin Powell presentation would have been a lot more impressive.
― Frederik B, Sunday, 1 July 2018 17:25 (five years ago) link
I wasn't trying to make a direct Iraq parallel fwiw - my distrust of / wariness towards US intelligence services is more general.
― Simon H., Sunday, 1 July 2018 17:53 (five years ago) link
We can tell. Your aptitude as a generalist is undisputed
― El Tomboto, Sunday, 1 July 2018 17:55 (five years ago) link
Do we have a July thread?
― The Harsh Tutelage of Michael McDonald (Raymond Cummings), Sunday, 1 July 2018 19:32 (five years ago) link
generalists are always pushing for wariness
― Evan, Sunday, 1 July 2018 19:35 (five years ago) link
is there no july thread because no one can decide on a title
― maura, Sunday, 1 July 2018 21:48 (five years ago) link
“Goodlatte 2: DPRK Nuke-a-Dupe”
― El Tomboto, Sunday, 1 July 2018 22:07 (five years ago) link
US Politics July 2018: Let's Eat Grandma
― a shomin-geki poster with some horror elements (WilliamC), Sunday, 1 July 2018 22:21 (five years ago) link
Among contenders upthread were "womp womp", "We Got Space Force" and "I REALLY DON'T CARE. DO U?" of which the latter is the most nihilistically apposite.
― an incoherent crustacean (MatthewK), Sunday, 1 July 2018 22:35 (five years ago) link
i really don't careforce 1
― illegal economic migration (Tracer Hand), Sunday, 1 July 2018 22:57 (five years ago) link
I'm down with the third option MatthewK presented
― El Tomboto, Sunday, 1 July 2018 22:58 (five years ago) link
Shall I
Option 3 for sure.
― grawlix (unperson), Sunday, 1 July 2018 23:13 (five years ago) link
marches lighter on millenials are marches heavier on voters, and so a good thing.
― Andrew Farrell, Monday, 2 July 2018 10:43 (five years ago) link
The new name has always been a surprise.
Just sayin.
― Mark G, Monday, 2 July 2018 10:48 (five years ago) link
US Politics, July 2018: FART
Surprise!!
― Mark G, Monday, 2 July 2018 10:49 (five years ago) link