figured I'd break my post into two to avoid being so long, but basically Pavement created their sound and stayed with it til they quit, whereas Trux were continually re-shaping theirs as they moved along, which for me makes for a more varied and interesting body of work.― whitehallunity, Saturday, May 19, 2018 11:23 AM(yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
― whitehallunity, Saturday, May 19, 2018 11:23 AM(yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
This is u&k but I think merits even a little more elaboration. There's a familiar indie metatrope about projects which, initially mired in abrasive outsider/underground aesthetics--entirely listener-unfriendly--manage to pull themselves out of the muck & murk and embrace pop structure. This is a decent if generalized description of RTX's first four albums, but it could also apply to Ariel Pink, or Sonic Youth, or any number of classic indie bands: that's why it's a metatrope. Another metatrope is the band who plays with a specific genre and its well-established tropes but manage to throw in enough anomalous, quirky elements that no one could ever confuse their music for the real thing. Again, this is an okay summation of Trux circa Cats & Dogs/Thank You , where the residual scuzzy noise, spaced out vocals, and lo-fi sound marks the albums as distinctive, 'artistic' takes on Southern rock.
But usually bands and artists who go down this road, once they develop their singular signature modes of offkilter genre deconstruction, they tend to run with it and then run it into the ground. What they don't do--oftentimes because they don't have the real chops to do this--is actually work out a convincing 'straight' version of the genre they're fucking with, the way Trux manage, to an extent, with Sweet Sixteen and then wholly with Pound for Pound . Another thing they don't usually do is stumble upon an entirely distinct, secondary mode of quirky genre dislocation such as the batshit spectrum-analyzer plastique of Accelerator & the first side of Veterans . The higher impression one gets from all of this is not just of a bizarro version of rock but of a finely-calibrated tug of war between rock and bizarro elements that feel like the product of a lot of higher-level thinking about what rock is, and what it can mean.
― bedraggled vorticist (Drugs A. Money), Sunday, 20 May 2018 08:14 (five years ago) link
great post, and 100% otm
― Paul Ponzi, Sunday, 20 May 2018 09:51 (five years ago) link
more like Royal Sux
― alpine static, Sunday, 20 May 2018 10:07 (five years ago) link
big 4:
Slayer = Royal TruxMetallica = PavementMegadeth = ?Anthrax = ?
I'm kinda thinking Anthrax might be Sebadoh, which would make the Folk Implosion SOD.
― earlnash, Sunday, 20 May 2018 12:17 (five years ago) link
Royal Trux, IME, had in common with Beefheart a dissuasively-high difficulty level that served as an initial barrier of entry, but both bands ultimately rewarded my perseverance in spades and continue to do so. I went obsessively all-in with Pavement for a long stretch but it turns out that they just didn't hold my attention in the long run. Like there just didn't seem to be that many depths to plumb. Still love a lot of their stuff, though, particularly Wowee Zowee.
― Now I know my ABCs. Next time won't you scream at me? (Old Lunch), Sunday, 20 May 2018 13:01 (five years ago) link
megadeath = jesus lizard
― reggie (qualmsley), Sunday, 20 May 2018 13:14 (five years ago) link
Jesus lizerd
― Οὖτις, Sunday, 20 May 2018 13:18 (five years ago) link
i've made my peace with the fact that royal trux are a joke that i don't get. it amazing how their music totally reminds me of being around really annoying people who are really high though. i totally want to get away from them. so, just as a spot-on approximation of junkie annoyance and whining they are successful to me.
also, vocally they both just remind me of muppets in a weird way and that's a personal reason why i can't really take listening to them for very long. constipated muppets.
Come will always be my number one '90s Stones-loving junk-inspired indie rock band of all time. They had the best vocalists too. and amazing songs.
― scott seward, Sunday, 20 May 2018 13:49 (five years ago) link
The 'Westing' collection plus the first 3 albums are absolutly classic in my book. Pretty varied and awesome.
I love the Royal Trux sound, but those four PAVEMENT albums have too many great songs.
― nicky lo-fi, Sunday, 20 May 2018 14:47 (five years ago) link
"including solo careers" tips this over to Trux for me, I like NMH's solo stuff way more than Malkmus, and RTX/BB vs. Spiral Stairs is a blowout
― sleeve, Sunday, 20 May 2018 15:41 (five years ago) link
"it amazing how their music totally reminds me of being around really annoying people who are really high though. i totally want to get away from them. so, just as a spot-on approximation of junkie annoyance and whining they are successful to me."
oh shit you might have just ruined RT for me
― two cool rock chicks pounding la croix (circa1916), Sunday, 20 May 2018 17:51 (five years ago) link
Verbena's Souls for Sale is my "number one '90s Stones-loving junk-inspired indie rock band"
― campreverb, Sunday, 20 May 2018 17:59 (five years ago) link
Accelerator is the best album
― brimstead, Monday, 21 May 2018 01:59 (five years ago) link
Uhh..is that a kazoo on “another year?”And uh maybe they could take the time to tune the guitars before rolling the tape on “yellow kid?”
― cal (calstars), Monday, 21 May 2018 02:05 (five years ago) link
Not even going to bring up “banana question”Sorry Brim, not to rank on you. I guess I had to be there
― cal (calstars), Monday, 21 May 2018 02:06 (five years ago) link
For my money, if I want to hear don't-give-a-fuck, splay-footed, ersatz, atonal Stones jams I'd probably listen to U.S. Maple.
― o. nate, Monday, 21 May 2018 02:20 (five years ago) link
fuck, imagine Jennifer Herrema singing for us maple.. with U.S. Maple
― braunld (Lowell N. Behold'n), Monday, 21 May 2018 04:33 (five years ago) link
brimstead is very close to correct. Maybe not the best but probably top ten.
― Now I know my ABCs. Next time won't you scream at me? (Old Lunch), Monday, 21 May 2018 04:35 (five years ago) link
US Maple was great but they did their own thing (which, DGAF as it may have sounded, was revealed to be tight and calculated as hell if you ever saw them live) and Trux did theirs.
― Now I know my ABCs. Next time won't you scream at me? (Old Lunch), Monday, 21 May 2018 04:37 (five years ago) link
Another metatrope is the band who plays with a specific genre and its well-established tropes but manage to throw in enough anomalous, quirky elements that no one could ever confuse their music for the real thing. Again, this is an okay summation of Trux circa Cats & Dogs/Thank You , where the residual scuzzy noise, spaced out vocals, and lo-fi sound marks the albums as distinctive, 'artistic' takes on Southern rock.
The thing I actually liked most about RTX around this time was that I didn't think that they were playing with a specific genre. I don't think "Southern rock" encapsulates it. I mean, it was rock music for sure but that can mean many things and I think it did mean many things in their music. Like Richard Meltzer would have said something like "Rock is an eclectic form" - well sure, it was at one time. It was before most rock bands started identifying themselves with some particular strain, some particular sub-genre. Trux were one of the only bands around at the time, I felt, who were open to all kinds of things and also knew their records and could hit on all sorts of things. I saw them play a song from Pet Sounds once.
― timellison, Monday, 21 May 2018 07:06 (five years ago) link
US Maple was great but they did their own thing (which, DGAF as it may have sounded, was revealed to be tight and calculated as hell if you ever saw them live)
this is otm, I don't think there's a single note out of place on any U.S. Maple record
― she carries a torch. two torches, actually (Joan Crawford Loves Chachi), Monday, 21 May 2018 10:37 (five years ago) link
neither one of these bands is remotely on US Maple's level
― The Desus & Mero Chain (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Monday, 21 May 2018 11:36 (five years ago) link
plus Skin Graft was it's whole own world and doesn't even belong in this convo, rtx and pavement were very conventional rock bands at the end of the day
― The Desus & Mero Chain (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Monday, 21 May 2018 11:38 (five years ago) link
this is my kinda '90s indie rock record. for the record.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RzoCfZtE3v0
― scott seward, Monday, 21 May 2018 12:33 (five years ago) link
Would add the Grifters' One Sock Missing to the relatively-conventional 90s Stones-scuzz indie rock convo
US Maple, esp by the end of the 90s were in a completely different realm - including other Skin Graft people
― Master of Treacle, Monday, 21 May 2018 13:37 (five years ago) link
i don't think i've ever listened to a us maple album.
come were and are my fave american 90s indie rock band. i like every song they recorded. which is unheard of!
― scott seward, Monday, 21 May 2018 14:12 (five years ago) link
I feel like Pavement had a more focused approach when composing and cared more about their music than Royal Trux.
I also think this counts as making their brand of slacker indie wrong.
― ✖✖✖ (Moka), Monday, 21 May 2018 14:34 (five years ago) link
pavement records sound sooooooo good to me. those guitars. like way better to me than most similar stuff. i don't know how they did it. its the reason i still listen to them.
― scott seward, Monday, 21 May 2018 14:37 (five years ago) link
Yeah, the “haunt you down” / “Fillmore Jive” tone is nice and warm
― calstars, Monday, 21 May 2018 14:42 (five years ago) link
lot of weird opinions itt
― Οὖτις, Monday, 21 May 2018 15:20 (five years ago) link
i love both these bands but will not be voting in this poll because it seems weird to compare them. other than being contemporaries and briefly being on the same label, they don't have much in common in terms of sound or approach or goals or aesthetic. it's like doing liz phair vs. silkworm or something.
― na (NA), Monday, 21 May 2018 15:31 (five years ago) link
otm
― tylerw, Monday, 21 May 2018 15:32 (five years ago) link
it feels like the purpose of this thread is to make old people feel cool for voting for royal trux over pavement. which is a purpose i support. i pick royal trux.
― na (NA), Monday, 21 May 2018 15:33 (five years ago) link
thank you poll, I had not listened to Royal Trux since the 90s & now I have & I like it.
― droit au butt (Euler), Monday, 21 May 2018 15:37 (five years ago) link
what's a good place to start w/ trux? ive been intrigued by them but haven't really gone in
pavement's okay, i could take em or leave em tbh
― marcos, Monday, 21 May 2018 15:43 (five years ago) link
these guys here are pros but I've been playing Cats & Dogs
― droit au butt (Euler), Monday, 21 May 2018 15:46 (five years ago) link
marcos get Veterans of Disorder or Accelerator
― Οὖτις, Monday, 21 May 2018 15:47 (five years ago) link
― na (NA), Monday, May 21, 2018 10:33 AM (twenty minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
lol
― The Desus & Mero Chain (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Monday, 21 May 2018 15:54 (five years ago) link
cats & dogs isn't my personal favorite but it makes sense as a midpoint where you can listen to it and then if you want them to be noisier and weirder, you can listen to the earlier albums, or if you want them to be more cohesive you can listen to the later albums (which is not a diss, i generally prefer the "rock" albums)
― na (NA), Monday, 21 May 2018 15:54 (five years ago) link
^^That’s what I always say (you stole my wise counsel)!
― i’m still stanning (morrisp), Monday, 21 May 2018 16:01 (five years ago) link
(NB - probably no one has ever actually asked me so I’ve never actually said it)
― i’m still stanning (morrisp), Monday, 21 May 2018 16:02 (five years ago) link
Funny Malkmus should mention MGMT as a band who shouldn't be citing them as an influence, as when I first heard Time To Pretend I thought it sounded like a super poppy Royal Trux, even down to thinking their vocalist sounded like Jennifer (who ended up singing with them anyway)
― PaulTMA, Monday, 21 May 2018 16:07 (five years ago) link
I personally believe Trux has no “peers,” in the same way that Kubrick doesn’t or someone else very singular in their field. (Maybe that’s BS, but I’m stickin to it.)
― i’m still stanning (morrisp), Monday, 21 May 2018 16:10 (five years ago) link
By contrast, Pavement had “peers,” they just happened to be the very best at what they did.
― i’m still stanning (morrisp), Monday, 21 May 2018 16:12 (five years ago) link
― Οὖτις, Monday, May 21, 2018 11:47 AM (twenty-four minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
thank u
― marcos, Monday, 21 May 2018 16:13 (five years ago) link
I'm skeptical of anyone voting Trux. Trux were really more of a project, or a concept, albeit a concept brilliantly realized. Although they made it sound effortless, it seemed like they were definitely trying to be this or that on every record.
This was true if Pavement on the first 3 EPs, but from Slanted on they were, like, a real Band with their own voice and style, not working from a blueprint. It was a band you could grow with, identity with, who presented a more expansive ethos you could kinda lose yourself in.
IDK sorry this is just how I feel etc
― salt sugar fat, that's where it's at (rip van wanko), Monday, 21 May 2018 16:25 (five years ago) link
start there imho!
― salt sugar fat, that's where it's at (rip van wanko), Monday, 21 May 2018 16:26 (five years ago) link
ok lol
― marcos, Monday, 21 May 2018 16:32 (five years ago) link
haha
don't start there though, for real
― Οὖτις, Monday, 21 May 2018 16:33 (five years ago) link
(not to slag it off, it's a great record, but when I first heard it I was put off by the super-fussy bass playing all over everything)
― Οὖτις, Monday, 21 May 2018 16:34 (five years ago) link
Royal Trux obviously the best answer Wtf
― Slippage (Ross), Sunday, 10 June 2018 07:38 (five years ago) link