Dark Souls 3 - April 2016 : You Died, You Died, You Died

I put some of my recent invasions on Youtube because I apparently did not have anything better to do with my mid-30s

http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLDz6pkTVAF3WWgYGLstA-UbokJwJpKA7i

just downloading this now... trying not to read the thread for spoilers

spoiler: it's good!

i'm wrapped up in a project right now but i hope to You Died many more times once mid-May hits

It IS good isn't it? it has reminded me how bad I am at the souls games though... or no, actually how bad I am at the *bosses* in souls games

Fine, you happy, sticklers?

I did more exploration of Spookytown Settlement. It kind of spoils you with two bonfires more or less right at the start, so I'm wary of going too deep into town, but I'm doing OK looking around and killing creepy things.The most awkward thing this game does is make you feel like you are cheesing when that's often what the enemies do - hide in ambush, shoot/attack from a distance, etc. Like I said, I keep coming across places that seem designed for you to stick around and pick enemies off at range. Or, for example, aggro enemies chased me to the arena where the ice dog was, but they didn't follow me in. I felt kind of silly attacking the blue knight with glowing eyes from in there (where he cornered me), so I eventually just went out and finished him myself.

A couple of questions. It appears leveling up weapons here is different than in the first game. I've got my claymore up to +3, but I think to get it further I need ... titanite slabs? Is that right? And then the gem infusions, is that like enhancements in the first game? I like the claymore, but I'm considering at least one alternative with a faster moveset, at the least as a backup.

Also, rolling (as usual) seems a pretty important component of battle; even early on there have been several enemies (like those lothric knights) that seem to resist the standard circle-and-slash method of battle. As a knight I am relatively heavy and (I think) kind of fat rolling. Should I start focusing a few more stats on ... vitality? To bring my weight down? I don't really know what levels mean in this game, but I'm hovering around 27 right now. Been putting souls into vigor, endurance and strength, mainly, but was thinking of dumping points into dexterity, too, not necessarily for the fabled "quality" build, but just to give me a couple of other weapon options, like the lothric sword or the uchikatana.

You definitely want to keep your equip load under 70% in this game, so either unequip some things or raise your vitality to just enough.

Weapon upgrades:

http://darksouls3.wikidot.com/reinforcement

I'm not sure what I really have equipped besides my sword, shield and armor, nothing heavy at least...

The claymore is a lot heavier than your starting sword, that probably tipped it. Also if you have multiple weapons equipped etc.

Does upping vitality one or two points make much of a difference for weight capacity?

Okay, leveled up my dexterity a couple of points so that I could use the lothric knight sword. what it has in more speed and lighter weight it lacks in sledgehammer power, like the claymore. think I will switch back to the claymore for now and maybe just work on upping endurance and vitality. not sure I really need to level strength or dexterity any higher than they are now, which I think is 18.

I like the fast travel in this a lot, makes me more likely to take risks, since I know it's pretty easy to pop back and forth. Also, kinda curious that this game has two overpowered enemies so early in the game, the sword master ninja and the blue Lothric knight with glowing red eyes. Both are super easy to avoid, but the fact that they're there at all seems like an invitation.

Fast travel right out of the gate kinda ruined this series a little bit imo. Ruins the sense of familiarity with the world and how things fit together. Also eliminates that dangerous feeling of being lost in the depths or wherever else and miles away from a safe haven.

agreed but tbf dark souls is the exception, everything else (demon's, bloodborne, etc) has fast travel from early on

Yeah, but it’s also the best game of the series. Not saying because of it, but at least partially.

And Demon’s was the only precursor and had that central hub that you would just transport to different worlds from, kind of a different thing, so not like there was a heavy precedent.

There was that thread recently where several people mentioned how they could mentally walking through the Dark Souls map. Probably nobody doing that with 2 or 3.

The original Dark Souls map is really well thought out, but I don't miss it too much, since each area in DS3 is still dense and flows impressively. Like, even that first part, it might not ultimately connect the same way to Undead Settlement (which is where I'm at now) the way the first game connected to, say, the Depths and Blighttown, but you still get a pretty good sense of the layout, and there are lots of precipices and balconies that let you pear toward new destinations. And even if the map is not the same, the character design in this one is really creepy and cool.

DS3 is really good! Superior in a lot of ways to DS1. But I can mentally map out that first one and can’t remotely do that with DS3 even though I’ve played it more recently. That sense of geography was a really cool thing that I was sad to see get left behind.

I can with 3, just because you have to for proper invading (except for the poison swamp, because f that place). But I agree, it's definitely not as elegant as 1. Although it is cool that you can at least see most of the areas in the distance.

Man, there is so much to explore and find in Undead Settlement, it's hard to believe this is just the (more or less) second area. I found ... not a guide but an outline somewhere online that lists stuff to keep an eye out for in each area but not exactly where to find it, which is a nice relatively spoiler-free way to know when to keep exploring. I haven't fought the boss yet (though I know where the arena is), haven't fought the blue ice monster yet, killed the fire monster, made friends with the lady in the sewers, found Onion Knight, even got a ride to Mound of Bodies Land in a cage (to no discernible benefit yet). Made friends with the arrow-shooting giant only after I took all that loot while he shot at me. (That's where I got the white birch to belatedly befriend him, Angela's Ashes or whatever, a few other goodies.) Some enemies are getting stronger, but so far nothing so bad I avoid it. I finally replaced some of my knight gear with lighter stuff to get my load below 70%, but I also have found a couple of cool rings that make things easier, like the one that regenerates stamina faster. In the first Dark Souls I almost always wore that magic shimmering green shield that did much the same thing. Stamina seems to be key when you've got a powerful weapon.

Key lessons learned from the first game: kiting enemies and, when needed, simply running past them. No doubt will come in handy whenever I get around to playing Bloodborne.

bloodborne is, in some ways, Undead Settlement: The Game

Beat the tree on the third try, first time to figure out what to do, second death because I was sloppy, third time was the charm. Then I beat the frost monster (which is really fast and kind of an asshole, like the titanite demons from the first game), and explored (finished?) the Road the Perdition or whatever it is called. Met those two knights chilling by the fire. All the weird dialogue and creepy giggling makes me think any and all of them might try to kill me later. Except Onion Knight, he's a bro.

I hate that tree.

The next area is the first big pvp zone, if you were playing online. Native environment of the hornet ring + chaos dagger + parry spammer twink.

I poked my head in and it looked a bit like daylight Darkroot Forest, which (iirc) was a popular DS1 invasion spot.

If one were playing online and got invaded, does that mean you have to deal with native PvE enemies in addition to PvP enemies?

Yep, they don't just start ignoring you. :) Although note that in this game you're much more likely to get invaded if you've already summoned help.

Cleared out the swamp, killed my first black Knight. those crucified guys and crabs might be the first common enemies that are real trouble. Killed those two NPC tag team baddies pretty easily, somehow. I think I've got another area and a boss next.

I still think playing these games totally blind would be a fool's errand. You would miss so much. Secrets and items etc. Even learning about leveling, and weapons, and infusing and so much else, it's still all so inscrutable that even hints don't help so much. You still have to do the work, baddies don't beat themselves. ( Except when they fall off cliffs or whatever; I saw a clip of a guy luring a black Knight into the open to aggro out a ton of enemies!)

This is a pretty good depiction of what playing DS3 in 2019 can be like and why I still do it
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zBNTJDQVTb8

I watched that entire thing and lol I spent the whole time wondering what he was getting at. And then I finished it and ... I still don't get it. He's saying it's been a while since there was a new game from From (not including Sekiro, I guess)? But that soon there will be a new game? And that will be cool? He still seems to be having fun playing this one, even if I'm not sure what his complaints are, exactly. Anyway, I liked DS1 a lot and I like this one a lot, too.

He's basically saying that some of us have been playing the same game for three years, and continue to do so since it provides a unique multi-player experience that you can't get anywhere else. Even though it's definitely changed/declined since there are very few people genuinely playing through the game at this point. But it's still better than anything else, until the next big From game comes out.

Aren't there a lot of multiplayer online games? Or are those all just shooters?

Speaking of Dark Souls, I totally chipped in for the Kickstarter for the the hardback of this: https://kotaku.com/a-closer-look-at-dark-souls-most-difficult-player-creat-1840512938

Seems a fun bit of esoterica to have on the shelf.

was thinking i might do a DS run through this Christmas, either DS3 plus expansion, which I've completed, or DS1, which I still haven't. I *loved* Sekiro, thought was amazing*, but there's no wider connected space for invasions etc. W

*well, mainly amazing, but I couldn't complete one of the storylines because i didn't listen to someone whispering at the right time, which was incredibly vexing, and difficult to know about if you didn't look it up on the internet.

Aren't there a lot of multiplayer online games?

Sure, but not like this. They're all specifically set up to be competitive multi-player games, with things like 'balance' and preset characters. Boring! In these games the multiplayer feels like this side feature that almost shouldn't be happening, which makes it a lot more exciting.

I don't know of another game that lets me take the character that I built, go into someone else's world while they're playing through the game on their own, and engage in this meta-game where you can hinder or help. And after you've played the main game and it's old news, it's a whole new level of thrills to play against humans (with the odds stacked against you, because that's how invasions work) and use the level, whatever tricks and psychology you can figure out, etc.

I do like how there are multiple levels to these games. You can play them offline, unkindled (or whatever they call it in DSIII, embered?), you can play it kindled and get different benefits (different stats/abilities/storylines, summoning NPC phantoms), you can play it online and open yourself to help but also invaders (who all have to be overpowered assholes, right? Because why else would they invade?), you can change your equipment, stats, etc., all of which change not just gameplay but often story. It is pretty neat. But yeah, the reason I don't play online, even if I had PS Whatever, is because I just assume that's where hardcore gamers ready themselves to gank you at a moment's notice, which doesn't sound fun to an engaged but (erm) casual player like me. Novel, sure, but fun? I'll save that for watching others do it in youtube clips or whatever.

One think I don't get about said videos is that the players are often carrying a huge pile of souls, often in the tens of thousands, if not more. Is this because they've been playing so long there is nothing more they need to spend the souls on? Or is it sort of a humblebrag? Or is it a taunt, like, try to take me on, I am so good I carry a balance of 199,283 souls and I am not worried about losing them. Or do you not lose them if you die to an invasion?

Souls just don't matter after a point. If I have an invasion build that's designed for a certain level range, I'm not going to upgrade anymore so the only thing that souls are used for is refilling consumable items (bombs, arrows, charms, etc). And souls are easy come, easy go.

(who all have to be overpowered assholes, right? Because why else would they invade?)

This is what I'm trying to explain. While sure, there are some invaders who get off on easy kills or never losing, the game is designed so that the invader is at a disadvantage.

1) Invaders have half the estus of hosts
2) Invaders have 30% less max health
3) The matchmaking is weighted so that you're much more likely to be invaded if you've already summoned white phantoms to help you. Solo embered hosts only get invaded if there are no groups in the area (or the host as willingly used the dried finger item).
4) Hosts can still summon blue spirits to help after they've been invaded (and whites).

So most of the people invading in DS3 do it because it's a challenge, the odds are against you. The real overpowered gankers are the hosts who summon their overleveled friends (using a password), sit around at the bonfire or having already cleared all the enemies out, and wait for invaders to kill in a 3v1 or 4v1 (and they usually disconnect if they start to lose). It's extra satisfying to win in that scenario because it's so difficult.

I dunno, it seems to me that with players good enough to beat the game blind, or with voice only commands, or with bongos, or at level 1 with bare fists or with no hits or whatever, whatever disadvantage they are at as invaders seems kind of moot. It'd be like playing a pro ball player in HORSE, and starting with HORS already, and them playing in stiff, heavy dress shoes with one hand or something. They're still going to kick my ass.

Still ... fun to watch! And the beauty of these games is that that online aspect is entirely optional.

1v1, totally. But if you summoned 2 or 3 people to help? That takes some doing even if they're all new players, because you can't attack them all at once no matter how good you are.

Also I think the whole challenge/speed run thing is a totally different skill set than pvp. Both fun, but one doesn't really translate to the other.

I was super sloppy fighting the Crystal Sage (or whatever), but once I realized my shield was doing nothing and went two handed, and after a long break and a couple of drinks, it wasn't so bad. It looks like there are a couple of options now, Farron Keep (another swamp?) and Cathedral of the Deep, which seems to be guarded by some real PIA enemies.

One of my favorite areas in the game, and one of my least favorite by far

Lol, there are lots of options, it seems, and there are suddenly a bunch of fires in quick succession. But I did explore some bits sort of piecemeal. Found these lizard things that gave me massive blood loss, found some more crystal lizards, killed a crystal ice monster that I think must have been backed into a corner and easily killed, found these skeleton things that barfed on me. Craziness. Oh, also found an old coot who tricked me into getting sucked into that painting from the first game again. At first I was worried I'd be trapped, but all the warnings (and another bonfire) hinted and allowed me to get the fuck out of there.

One of my favorite areas in the game, and one of my least favorite by far

OK, so the evil winter wonderland in the painting was, predictably, part of the DLC. I suspect I am indeed supposed to wait before taking it on. Which means ... onward to somewhere else! I think my only options remain the swamp or barfing skeletons, so I guess barfing skeletons it is.

which way round? i loved cathedral of the deep as an area but i thought the boss was *rubbish*, whereas i hated farron keep/swamp, but the boss is *amazing*.

Same

Swamp was poisoning me, at least early on. But I don't think I've come across the right moss yet, which is why I'm going the other way first.

Cathedral of the Deep section seems to be ramping up difficulty, at least in terms of speed and number of enemies.

Ha, Cathedral of the Deep is (so far) paradoxically mostly rooftops, but I've made some progress, found a shortcut back to the Cleansing bonfire, and ... came across an angry giant, which seems to be saying "take a break." Maybe I can tell him that other giant is my bud and it will chill out.

Also, so many ambushes.

Oh, one more thing. I was looking over all my weapons (I've been using the Claymore, up to +3 right now), and pretty much everything I have scales at an E or D level, which is nothing special (as much as I can even understand that system). The one exception is the giant butcher knife, which requires a bit more strength than I have but scales at an A, which is significantly better than anything I have. I like the Claymore, but is it worth putting in stats for the butcher knife?

hold out for the deli slicer

The scaling on the butcher knife makes it tempting but it's not that great imo. Use what you like, generally the scaling improves as you level it up.

And since you're playing offline, honestly anything will work. But the claymore has a more versatile moveset and the butcher knife is kinda one dimensional.

Deacons of the Deep: done. First try! I bet they could have made that match tougher, in a more interesting way. Now farting around the Farron Swamp, which is OK, though I did lose a bunch of souls by being stupid in a rush to re-fight the big swamp monster. Made friends with the sleepy wolf, think I'm about to fight a stray demon in the distance.

I haven't played 2, but there definitely seem to be choices 3 made to make things a little easier for players, from more bonfires to a slight potency downshift of bullshit like poison. I'm sure there is bullshit to come, though.