clearly more of a murder-suicide deal
― hi i’m darren and i’m a bouncer from bendigo (bizarro gazzara), Thursday, 30 November 2017 18:28 (six years ago) link
First, you pass the law, so it is a done deal. Then you sell it to the public by claiming that it will bring them amazing future benefits. Because the future cannot be inspected to verify or falsify the claims, the media will dutifully report your claims, since these are the only reportable facts in sight. People will take sides on the veracity of the claims, according to their tribal identity.
By the time the future arrives and the claims can be verified or falsified, not only will the public be accustomed to the law, but the falsity of claims made years earlier in support of what is now a settled matter will not be considered news and will not be discussed in the media.
As a basic strategy it sure seems like it could work.
― A is for (Aimless), Thursday, 30 November 2017 18:32 (six years ago) link
Gotta try this thing of referring to "a few" of something and then immediately clarifying that I mean just two in the next sentence.
― nashwan, Thursday, 30 November 2017 18:36 (six years ago) link
Just like with every recent war or tax cut, it's not like the GOP are going to have to clean it up. They screw up get out of power, then the Democrats cut the ugly no win legislation to duct tape a fix and then get blamed for causing the problem in the first place and two years later the GOP are back in power.
― earlnash, Thursday, 30 November 2017 18:41 (six years ago) link
this pattern is woefully well established
― Οὖτις, Thursday, 30 November 2017 18:56 (six years ago) link
last Dem fix for the war effort was a duct taped roll of $700 billion gifted to hater in chief
― AdamVania (Adam Bruneau), Thursday, 30 November 2017 19:00 (six years ago) link
huh, that's odd
In the latest POLITICO/Morning Consult tracking poll out this week, just 36 percent of voters overall said they support the GOP plan. Among Republican voters, support dropped to 59 percent from 66 percent, suggesting Democrats are having some success with their attacks that the bill is strongly tilted to corporations and the wealthy.
― Οὖτις, Thursday, 30 November 2017 19:40 (six years ago) link
(the drop in GOP support, that is)
― Οὖτις, Thursday, 30 November 2017 19:41 (six years ago) link
it will make no difference
― global tetrahedron, Thursday, 30 November 2017 20:10 (six years ago) link
I don't think so either, it's just weird
― Οὖτις, Thursday, 30 November 2017 20:16 (six years ago) link
Their plan is that everyone gets a taxcut in the first year, and then everything except tax cuts for the richest is phased out. So in 2018, people get money, get excited and vote for GOP in midterms, then after that they're screwed.
― Frederik B, Thursday, 30 November 2017 20:28 (six years ago) link
Phases out in 2026 right?
― dan selzer, Thursday, 30 November 2017 20:33 (six years ago) link
the stuff for individuals phases out; corporate changes are permanent
― curmudgeon, Thursday, 30 November 2017 20:47 (six years ago) link
this thread makes me look forward to dying
― cosmic brain dildo (Sparkle Motion), Thursday, 30 November 2017 20:48 (six years ago) link
right, I meant the individual stuff, comment before seemed to imply it would be right after 2018
― dan selzer, Thursday, 30 November 2017 20:51 (six years ago) link
it's not this simple
― Οὖτις, Thursday, 30 November 2017 21:00 (six years ago) link
my taxes - like those of others in NY, etc. - will go up without the state/local tax deduction, for example.
other people in other states will get screwed in different ways, since their overall rate might be lowered but that won't necessarily make up for the loss from various deductions
― Οὖτις, Thursday, 30 November 2017 21:01 (six years ago) link
the monstrosity lumbers on
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/energy-environment/wp/2017/11/30/trump-to-cut-bears-ears-national-monument-by-85-percent-grand-staircase-escalante-by-half-documents-show/?utm_term=.f9a96416146b
― Οὖτις, Thursday, 30 November 2017 21:07 (six years ago) link
also, surprise!
Breaking: Congress’ nonpartisan tax analysts have concluded the Senate Republicans’ tax plan would add $1 trillion to the deficit over 10 years, contradicting White House promises the bill would pay for itself and complicating GOP leaders’ efforts to find the support they need to pass the bill through a closely divided Senate.
Republicans’ massive tax overhaul steamed toward passage in the Senate Thursday, picking up key support from Sen. John McCain (R-Ariz.) as the number of holdouts narrowed.
A few issues remained unresolved, most critically a “trigger” sought by Sen. Bob Corker (R-Tenn.) to raise taxes if growth estimates aren’t met. But GOP leaders projected optimism about passing the $1.5 trillion legislation through the Senate on Thursday evening or Friday, a major step forward as President Trump and GOP leaders seek to overhaul the U.S. tax code for the first time in three decades.
― Οὖτις, Thursday, 30 November 2017 21:10 (six years ago) link
― hi i’m darren and i’m a bouncer from bendigo (bizarro gazzara), Thursday, 30 November 2017 21:50 (six years ago) link
In the latest POLITICO/Morning Consult tracking poll out this week, just 36 percent of voters overall said they support the GOP plan.
So it's almost twice as popular as ACA repeal! No wonder it's passing.
― Guayaquil (eephus!), Thursday, 30 November 2017 22:25 (six years ago) link
i'd be eternally honored xpost
― cosmic brain dildo (Sparkle Motion), Thursday, 30 November 2017 22:27 (six years ago) link
I just glanced at the first part of that WaPo url, read "Trump to cut bears' ears," and just figured, huh, well yeah, he would do that...
― the young, low level volunteer named (Dan Peterson), Thursday, 30 November 2017 22:52 (six years ago) link
Is there a Bear Palin?
― nashwan, Thursday, 30 November 2017 23:28 (six years ago) link
https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/economy/2017/11/30/c2118302-d5e7-11e7-a986-d0a9770d9a3e_story.htmlThe Republican plan for a massive tax overhaul slammed into late-stage drama on Thursday as party leaders scrambled to prevent several members from derailing the entire effort.The tension played out during a tense 62-minute standoff on the Senate floor, as Sens. Bob Corker (R-Tenn.), Jeff Flake (R-Ariz.), and Sen. Ron Johnson (R-Wisc.) refused to vote with their colleagues until they had assurances that more changes could be made to the bill.Corker and Flake had just been informed that their proposed “trigger,” a mechanism to raise taxes if economic growth came in slower than projected, would not be allowed by the Senate’s parliamentarian....The competing demands sent GOP leaders scrambling. They control just 52 votes in the 100-seat chamber, and they can’t afford to lose three Republicans if they want the bill to pass. After Corker, Flake, and Johnson agreed to let the debate proceed, GOP leaders conceded that numerous changes were now under consideration.
― 𝔠𝔞𝔢𝔨 (caek), Thursday, 30 November 2017 23:32 (six years ago) link
dragging out the inevitable, most likely
― Οὖτις, Thursday, 30 November 2017 23:35 (six years ago) link
for sure but it is amazing how bad they are at this
― 𝔠𝔞𝔢𝔨 (caek), Thursday, 30 November 2017 23:46 (six years ago) link
you mean governing?
― cosmic brain dildo (Sparkle Motion), Thursday, 30 November 2017 23:50 (six years ago) link
being humans
― Οὖτις, Thursday, 30 November 2017 23:58 (six years ago) link
Chuck Todd said they have to prove they're good at governing, see.
― morning wood truancy (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Thursday, 30 November 2017 23:59 (six years ago) link
read that post in the voice of Edward G. Robinson
― Οὖτις, Friday, 1 December 2017 00:00 (six years ago) link
It's a bad idea for Senate Dems -- not all of them -- to insist that this thing will Blow Up the Deficit. We know what's coming. When the deficit blows up, Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid, and the tired wretched bodies of the poor are next -- if any rubble is left standing when this excrescence is signed.
― morning wood truancy (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Friday, 1 December 2017 00:00 (six years ago) link
yeah the deficit stuff is all basically a weak dodge, the better argument is "the rich get all your money, you get nothing"
― Οὖτις, Friday, 1 December 2017 00:02 (six years ago) link
Being humans? They’re not even good at being boring white guys in suits
― El Tomboto, Friday, 1 December 2017 00:03 (six years ago) link
I really don't get why dems are constantly wringing their hands over the deficit. They got burned by that line of thinking repeatedly under Obama, and it looks like they still haven't learned anything.
― Moodles, Friday, 1 December 2017 00:11 (six years ago) link
Donors
― El Tomboto, Friday, 1 December 2017 00:13 (six years ago) link
Deficits dont matter
― Οὖτις, Friday, 1 December 2017 00:13 (six years ago) link
we poors are still really bad at class warfare you know.
― correlated noise of conformity (Hunt3r), Friday, 1 December 2017 00:36 (six years ago) link
― Οὖτις, Thursday, November 30, 2017 7:13 PM
Cheney's only truth.
― morning wood truancy (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Friday, 1 December 2017 00:37 (six years ago) link
(and to those making this policy, 99.5% of us are poors) xp
― correlated noise of conformity (Hunt3r), Friday, 1 December 2017 00:37 (six years ago) link
Badass comment by defense attorney after his undocumented client is acquitted in murder case Trump and Sessions used to drum up xenophobia. pic.twitter.com/UXr7GoKe80— David Menschel (@davidminpdx) December 1, 2017
― 𝔠𝔞𝔢𝔨 (caek), Friday, 1 December 2017 01:31 (six years ago) link
Matt Gonzalez rules
― reggae mike love (polyphonic), Friday, 1 December 2017 01:48 (six years ago) link
The National Tree Lighting ceremony was beautiful this evening - but hard not to notice the empty seats. #Christmas #DMV #USA pic.twitter.com/oKMrnnBekG— Steve Rudin ABC7 (@SteveRudinABC7) November 30, 2017
― 𝔠𝔞𝔢𝔨 (caek), Friday, 1 December 2017 01:50 (six years ago) link
US politics december 2017: the may themselves soon avail themselves
― reggie (qualmsley), Friday, 1 December 2017 02:02 (six years ago) link
there's a new Labour video kicking around that just nails the right tone and message re class war
― Simon H., Friday, 1 December 2017 02:04 (six years ago) link
When bankers like Morgan Stanley say we’re a threat, they’re right.The next Labour Government is a threat to a damaging and failed system that’s rigged for the few. pic.twitter.com/v1ujMkngdv— Jeremy Corbyn (@jeremycorbyn) November 30, 2017
― Simon H., Friday, 1 December 2017 02:05 (six years ago) link
Can you brits loan the Democratic party here some Corbynism of the above variety? We're a bit short right now. We'll pay you back after November 2018, we swear.
― A is for (Aimless), Friday, 1 December 2017 02:35 (six years ago) link
Oh shit didnt even realize that was Gonzalez!
I wanted him to be mayor so bad.
Xp
― Οὖτις, Friday, 1 December 2017 02:39 (six years ago) link
Tax bill vote cancelled for now
― Οὖτις, Friday, 1 December 2017 02:43 (six years ago) link