is there a name or a phrase for or anything much written about that distinctly British CREEPY VIBE prevalent in TV shows and movies of the '60s/'70s? (e.g. The Prisoner, Sapphire and Steel, Baker-era

Happy days. I think I'm going to watch this again, perfect time of the year too. Must've been ten years. Marvellous series.

This is worth while imo, doc from BBC Radio4.

Theme song here. "The music was composed by Sidney Sager who used the Ambrosian Singers to chant in accordance with the megalithic rituals referred to in the story."

Children of the Stones an HTV rather than a BBC production.

This (different) BFI list tries to expand - or settle - the folk horror canon a little:

http://www.bfi.org.uk/news-opinion/news-bfi/features/where-begin-folk-horror

Timely thread revival, we've just been watching Sapphire and Steel this week. Never seen Children of the Stones, I'll have to see if I can find it.

Also reading some of those folk horror links makes me think Twin Peaks fits more easily there than anywhere else, genre-wise.

i always say twin peaks is the first time the US caught up in the folk horror arms race, TP is profoundly FH imo but in a deeply american way

I never really considered that idea but I think the noir elements are much stronger, particularly in the third season. Strange to think of folk horror noir.

X-Files had a fair amount of country settings.

Noir is an urban version of the unheimlich, I reckon

Yeah I mean Twin Peaks ultimately comes back to the woods and the trees. Not explicitly pagan, but I think you could make a good case for Weird elements in it.

Twin Peaks obv isn't like UK "folk horror" at all; it's American. I get the enthusiastic instigation to pass it off or file it under English 70s folk/horror/hauntology, or have it relate to it, but it's still miles away. I mean really, the only thing in common is "weird". Which is not enough to make a connection between the two imo. I love TP, love 70s freaky horrorhaunty English series even more, and they circle around each other in some ways, sometimes, but both are very much products of their country of origin; ie inherently different.

A lot of olden American folk horror is very close to the British folk horror feel though.

xp that's what i was saying. it is deeply american folk horror. pastoral uncanny if you like. it's not like uk folk horror!

Then I got you! :)

Disagree with Robert Adam Gilmour entirely. They are so far removed from each other aesthetically, roots-wise, storytelling-wise. Everything wise tbh.

The Vvitch feels kind of British to me and a lot of 1700s-1800s American ghost stories do too. Maybe I'm mostly thinking of writers from aristocracy who lived a lot like European aristocrats.

I guess the aristocratic stuff isn't really folk horror.

Sleepy Hollow is based on European legends.

Trying to think of more old American folk horror but blanking.

You're trying too hard. No harm in acknowledging UK and US ghost stories have different origins.

I can think of legends like bigfoot, Jersey Devil and stuff like that but not a lot of stories right now.

i'm with LBI here I think. wrote a far too lengthy thing upthread on where i think the US and UK traditions go post 19th century (so doesn't include the older stuff you mention, Robert).

I think that some of the creepy folk pastoral horror vibe is a response to a fear of nuclear war and in a wider sense of military science. the return to primitivism, or a resurgence of primitavist power that stone circles imply is - well one reading of it is - the implication of society having to start again from scratch.

that's very present in the last quatermass with its stone circles, decayed society, and movement of people trying to unlearn words because that's where the bad stuff started creeping in. you see a bit of it in penda's fen. as well, with the porton down references.

a related reading is of course that there was a strong stranding in 60s and 70s counterculture of being at one with nature, through crafting and cultivating, and not abusing it with technology.

in other words these are very late forms of romanticism.

there's also the whole chariots of the gods reading of alien or mystical power and knowledge present in the henges and circles and ley lines of britain.

teasing out these strands would require some time and care - does stone circle/science/alien stuff share the same influences as the malign pastoral folk of the wicker man to take one example.

I inclined to think a lot of folk-horror both romanticises feminism and nature cults, and abhors them.

Obv the circles of skyclad (or nearly so) druidic priestesses are motivated by the exploitation market, but a lot of the neopagan literature I came across in the early 90s (it was a short lived relationship, with a coed who bought candles in bulk) is very feminist, very pro- exposure, and deals endlessly with the historical oppression of witches.

I inclined to think a lot of folk-horror both romanticises feminism and nature cults, and abhors them.

Obv the circles of skyclad (or nearly so) druidic priestesses are motivated by the exploitation market, but a lot of the neopagan literature I came across in the early 90s (it was a short lived relationship, with a coed who bought candles in bulk) is very feminist, very pro- exposure, and deals endlessly with the historical oppression of witches.

again one of the reasons penda’s fen is so good is its play with this trope of innocence and sexual awakening through landscape. jocelyn brooke is also v representative in the image of a drawn sword and the dog at clambercrown but i’m back on my hobby horse again and off topic.

don't know if this ever got linked but there's some interesting stuff in this robert macfarlane piece:

https://www.theguardian.com/books/2015/apr/10/eeriness-english-countryside-robert-macfarlane

Fizzles pls ride horse freely itt

the BBC's film of A View from a Hill should still be on iPlayer for a couple of weeks. it's a good one imo, nicely told.

it has taken me 32 years to see penda's fen. obviously it is the best thing ever made

all the pep talks are the best pep talks in moving picture history

It is grand.

so elegant how the protagonist's initially self-denying radicalisation is slowly channeled into something positive and ultimately salvation

Shadows?

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0398561/
Anthology series of scary stories for children. 1975 - 1978.

i don't remember this but Talking Pictures TV is currently showing them.

i watched Robin Redbreast the other day, which was excellent. The subject matter, especially after the Wicker Man (three years later), is highly familiar now, and was in the water then, but execution, script and performances are all really good.

there’s enough opacity about the malign forces to ensure it’s distributed into a generalised sense of unease. (so much about these sorts of sensations feel analogous to a hangover - a hangover in the countryside - why are they looking at me like that? what if the phone line gets cut/network drops out? what does that pebble on the windowsill mean? *oh god a fucking *bird** etc).

particular shout out to central performances metropolitan scriptwriter character, recently split from her partner, and her obtuse, effective, and omniscient cottage housekeeper.

Bernard Hepton is particularly good in it.

Rob is an almost perfect cipher of stereotypical masculinity, with his karate and ss obsessions, not equalled until Pex turns up in Paradise Towers.

not equalled until Pex turns up in Paradise Towers

now that phrase surprised me

For me he's the best character - the Kangs are more than a bit disco dad, the Rezzies are the closest High Rise archetype, but Pex is tremendously well written. He does what he's supposed to do, against a behavioural code that never really existed but everyone of course remembers, and had a proper heroic journey. (The scene where he bends the light to impress Mel is her best scene imo.)

And Rob/Edgar is the same. He's studied the war because it's the right, manly thing to do of the time and is supposed to feel upset that he couldn't do his part (as the likes of Bernard Hepton presumably did). But despite this he's slightly more interested in the Germans to fulfil the 'girls love a bad boy' trope (and as a sidebar, giving a bit a lie to the punk/greaser 'shock the older generation' notion).

Karate was a desperately exotic and of its time way of keeping fit, which would attract the metropolitan woman to him because she would realise he wasn't just a country bumpkin but up with trends, like her.

I need to watch both again and compare! Pretty sure I have the Paradise Towers DVD.

not sure if this has been mentioned elsewhere but a Robert Holmes science fiction / dark scots island community radio series Aliens in the Mind, from 1977, with Peter Cushing and Vincent Price, is being repeated on Radio 4. Catch up here.

If you don't want to wait, or you're not in the UK, the whole thing is here: https://archive.org/details/rhaitm

tbf BBC radio is available globally for free on web or app, and listening to things on non-bootleg send the message that you would like to hear more things like that

otoh i couldn’t sleep last night and was able to listen to episode 2 - thx james! (of course, you’re right, sic - and radio 4 extra is their archive mining channel so probably lots of good stuff in there)

it has taken me 32 years to see penda's fen. obviously it is the best thing ever made

― imago, Monday, May 13, 2019 10:23 PM (one month ago)

Yeah. I loved it from the first time I saw it, but over time it has cemented itself as one of my all-time favourites. I still find new elements to think about whenever I watch it.

I listened to Aliens In The Mind just now (on BBC Sounds like a good citizen) and yeah it's good, a somewhat generic this thread thing but the performances pull it off. Loved the Boys Own vibe. Vincent Price not very convincing as a yank but that just adds to the charm.

I listened to /Aliens In The Mind/ just now (on BBC Sounds like a good citizen) and yeah it's good, a somewhat generic this thread thing but the performances pull it off. Loved the Boys Own vibe. Vincent Price not very convincing as a yank but that just adds to the charm.

i mean its not a masterpiece or anything obv but v enjoyable. as always with these things the soundscape is excellent too. actually that goes for penda’s fen as well. you wonder how much television also lost when it lost deep and inventive radio drama expertise.

Vincent Price not very convincing as a yank

Haven't listened to this yet, but - Vincent Price was American? Do you mean Cushing?

Learn something new every day! Don't I feel the fool now.

iirc he had a strong Mississippi accent when he started and sort of anglicised as he went on, so it did end up as a kind of unique, ultra-theatrical mid-Atlantic mishmash.

Yeah, I feel like maybe in this he's dropping the mid-Atlantic to seem more american? But I've shown my ineptitude at identifying accents already so shouldn't chance it.

i did know he was american but going to double down by saying his voice sounds quite wobbly, but maybe that’s just next to cushing.

Just spotted the Box of Delights chat upthread. My 4 year-old watched it at Christmas. Not sure if that was a good call or not but he seemed to enjoy it.

Am currently enjoying this highly entertaining romp through 'the flip side of British film and television', including many obscurities and oddities that are relevant to our interests here:

http://strangeattractor.co.uk/news/the-bodies-beneath/

Got that on my wishlist but haven't pulled the trigger yet.

The chapters on TV and PIFs in this are gold:

http://www.lulu.com/gb/en/shop/stephen-brotherstone-dave-lawrence/scarred-for-life-volume-one/paperback/product-23116461.html