― NoTimeBeforeTime (Barry Bruner), Thursday, 13 July 2006 18:23 (seventeen years ago) link
genius.
― Machibuse '80 (ex machina), Thursday, 13 July 2006 18:25 (seventeen years ago) link
xpost
― Jessie the Monster (scarymonsterrr), Thursday, 13 July 2006 18:26 (seventeen years ago) link
The problem is that the rope-a-dope has been going on for decades, and I'm getting the feeling from the Israeli media that people from across the political spectrum are getting tired of hearing "we're missing an oppurtunity for negotiation" every time Hamas or Hezbollah threatens to destroy the Zionist enemy.
― NoTimeBeforeTime (Barry Bruner), Thursday, 13 July 2006 18:28 (seventeen years ago) link
― Jessie the Monster (scarymonsterrr), Thursday, 13 July 2006 18:28 (seventeen years ago) link
Are you serious? How about just last week, when the UN condemned Israeli actions in Gaza and then decided to form a committee to investigate what was going on there? Um, aren't you supposed to investigate before jumping to conclusions?
I'm not defending innappropriate military actions against the civilians in Beirut or anywhere else, but believe me, Juan Cole will blather on and on about collective punishment on the part of the IDF but won't use the term to describe anything Hamas or Hezbollah does.
― NoTimeBeforeTime (Barry Bruner), Thursday, 13 July 2006 18:33 (seventeen years ago) link
― NoTimeBeforeTime (Barry Bruner), Thursday, 13 July 2006 18:35 (seventeen years ago) link
― Jessie the Monster (scarymonsterrr), Thursday, 13 July 2006 18:37 (seventeen years ago) link
― NoTimeBeforeTime (Barry Bruner), Thursday, 13 July 2006 18:41 (seventeen years ago) link
― Jessie the Monster (scarymonsterrr), Thursday, 13 July 2006 18:45 (seventeen years ago) link
― Jessie the Monster (scarymonsterrr), Thursday, 13 July 2006 18:47 (seventeen years ago) link
http://www.canada.com/topics/news/world/story.html?id=1fe460c8-896b-4305-9e22-5687da508fff&k=69689
― NoTimeBeforeTime (Barry Bruner), Thursday, 13 July 2006 19:00 (seventeen years ago) link
― NoTimeBeforeTime (Barry Bruner), Thursday, 13 July 2006 19:06 (seventeen years ago) link
― Abbadavid Berman (Hurting), Thursday, 13 July 2006 20:32 (seventeen years ago) link
It will take several days to mount a full invasion of Lebanon. We would not expect major operations before the weekend at the earliest. If the rocket attacks are taking place, however, Israel might send several brigades to the Litani River almost immediately in order to move the rockets out of range of Haifa. Therefore, we would expect a rapid operation in the next 24-48 hours followed by a larger force later.
At this point, the only thing that can prevent this would be a major intervention by Syria with real guarantees that it would restrain Hezbollah and indications such operations are under way. Syria is the key to a peaceful resolution. Syria must calculate the relative risks, and we expect them to be unwilling to act decisively.
Therefore:
1. Israel cannot tolerate an insurgency on its northern frontier; if there is one, it wants it farther north.
2. It cannot tolerate attacks on Haifa.
3. It cannot endure a crisis of confidence in its military
4. Hezbollah cannot back off of its engagement with Israel.
5. Syria can stop this, but the cost to it stopping it is higher than the cost of letting it go on.
It would appear Israel will invade Lebanon. The global response will be noisy. There will be no substantial international action against Israel. Beirut's tourism and transportation industry, as well as its financial sectors, are very much at risk.
― Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 13 July 2006 20:33 (seventeen years ago) link
there's no justification for the rocket attacks, but again unless there's something i'm missing, why would anyone in their right mind settle in this part of israel knowing the history?
― hstencil (hstencil), Thursday, 13 July 2006 20:40 (seventeen years ago) link
It's more that if anything it will push the Lebanese government back towards the Syrians.
― DV (dirtyvicar), Thursday, 13 July 2006 20:44 (seventeen years ago) link
― DV (dirtyvicar), Thursday, 13 July 2006 20:45 (seventeen years ago) link
― Abbadavid Berman (Hurting), Thursday, 13 July 2006 20:47 (seventeen years ago) link
or the Lebanese people back to the pro-syrian parties.
Another thought is that syria starts bussing over veterans of Iraq if it (or Assad) feels threatened). Israel should be very reticent about invading southern lebanon it's going to be a lot worse than last time. Terrorist/Geurilla tactics have been taken to another level since the IDF last marched through Lebanon.
― Ed (dali), Thursday, 13 July 2006 20:59 (seventeen years ago) link
no, it isn't.
― hstencil (hstencil), Thursday, 13 July 2006 21:10 (seventeen years ago) link
― Abbadavid Berman (Hurting), Thursday, 13 July 2006 21:13 (seventeen years ago) link
ihttp://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/maps/is-map.gif
― Abbadavid Berman (Hurting), Thursday, 13 July 2006 21:14 (seventeen years ago) link
israel is a young country, despite the thousands of years of oppression of the jewish people. i don't see it being quite comparable to the hundreds of years and years of institutional racism and slavery that conjured up the new orleans' milieu. people choose to move to israel. and yeah some people choose to move to new orleans, but a lot of the victims of katrina were people who had never been anywhere else in their lives, and had no way to escape - not to mention a government that would actually evacuate them like the israelis did with gaza.
xpost - i'm not talking about haifa, since afaik that's a new development with the hezbollah's new missle.
― hstencil (hstencil), Thursday, 13 July 2006 21:19 (seventeen years ago) link
Hezbollah having the Katyusha rocket is not a new development at all though. Is there some other *new* missile that I missed in the reports?
― Abbadavid Berman (Hurting), Thursday, 13 July 2006 21:26 (seventeen years ago) link
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thunder_1
― Abbadavid Berman (Hurting), Thursday, 13 July 2006 21:28 (seventeen years ago) link
The fog of war begins to set in, I guess.
― Abbadavid Berman (Hurting), Thursday, 13 July 2006 21:30 (seventeen years ago) link
most of which, to be fair, did not take place in the Middle East nor was it instigated by Muslims. Prior to this whole horrible-misapplication-of-a-colonialist/zionist-fuckup Jews had it pretty good in the Middle East, at least compared to how they were treated in Europe.
― Shakey Mo Collier (Shakey Mo Collier), Thursday, 13 July 2006 21:30 (seventeen years ago) link
― Shakey Mo Collier (Shakey Mo Collier), Thursday, 13 July 2006 21:32 (seventeen years ago) link
― starke (starke), Thursday, 13 July 2006 21:50 (seventeen years ago) link
― Abbadavid Berman (Hurting), Thursday, 13 July 2006 21:52 (seventeen years ago) link
― starke (starke), Thursday, 13 July 2006 21:52 (seventeen years ago) link
― Shakey Mo Collier (Shakey Mo Collier), Thursday, 13 July 2006 21:57 (seventeen years ago) link
― hstencil (hstencil), Thursday, 13 July 2006 21:57 (seventeen years ago) link
― Shakey Mo Collier (Shakey Mo Collier), Thursday, 13 July 2006 22:00 (seventeen years ago) link
Not for want of trying.
― Abbadavid Berman (Hurting), Thursday, 13 July 2006 22:01 (seventeen years ago) link
― gear (gear), Thursday, 13 July 2006 22:03 (seventeen years ago) link
the epic of human history in one sentence!!!
― the fuckablity of late picasso (vahid), Thursday, 13 July 2006 22:03 (seventeen years ago) link
― starke (starke), Thursday, 13 July 2006 22:04 (seventeen years ago) link
Hezbollah's rocket attack on the port city of Haifa was its deepest such strike into northern Israel yet. No injuries were reported in Haifa, home to 270,000 residents and a major oil refinery 30 miles south of the border. Still, the Israeli ambassador to the United States, Daniel Ayalon, called the attack "a major, major escalation."
"Those who fire into such a densely populated area will pay a heavy price," said David Baker, an official in the Israeli prime minister's office.
and how is beirut not densely populated again?!??
― hstencil (hstencil), Thursday, 13 July 2006 22:04 (seventeen years ago) link
― Abbadavid Berman (Hurting), Thursday, 13 July 2006 22:05 (seventeen years ago) link
being Prime Minister of England vs. 6 million dead
― Shakey Mo Collier (Shakey Mo Collier), Thursday, 13 July 2006 22:08 (seventeen years ago) link
― Abbadavid Berman (Hurting), Thursday, 13 July 2006 22:09 (seventeen years ago) link
― hstencil (hstencil), Thursday, 13 July 2006 22:09 (seventeen years ago) link
― starke (starke), Thursday, 13 July 2006 22:10 (seventeen years ago) link
― hstencil (hstencil), Thursday, 13 July 2006 22:11 (seventeen years ago) link
― Abbadavid Berman (Hurting), Thursday, 13 July 2006 22:14 (seventeen years ago) link
What's the endgame for the Israeli government? Because it sure look like they want to create the next generation of suicide bombers, hezbollah recruits and generally a whole lot of people who think they're cunts. Cos they're acting like them.
Hurting - is there anything where you might conceivably concede that the Israeli government have acted in a slightly regrettable way?
x- post - Letting in party with armed wing vs having entire government as political wing of army in a militarised state C/D?
― Dave B (daveb), Thursday, 13 July 2006 22:14 (seventeen years ago) link
Uh, try reading like half my fucking posts on this thread.
― Abbadavid Berman (Hurting), Thursday, 13 July 2006 22:15 (seventeen years ago) link
― hstencil (hstencil), Thursday, 13 July 2006 22:18 (seventeen years ago) link