brexit negging when yr mandate is is trash: or further chronicles of a garbage-fire

Should've included may out of respect

car crash fallon on marr. "with our friends in the DUP..."

earlier on Toby Young got schooled on the impossibility of a hard Brexit now by Gideon. TY is such a loathsome little shit he even makes Gideon seem like a human being.

i was slightly concerned for myself by enjoying GO's commentary on election night :/

A real 'kicker conspiracy' night for Osborne.

Peter Hyman (you'd be forgiven for thinking 'who?')

“If you think the Tory majority was only small and May fought a terrible campaign, this should have been an election that Labour won. It is like a football match where you are 5-0 down, you claw it back to 5-4 and claim you won the cup. Well we haven’t won the cup. We have done better than expected, but we are not in power. None of the policies that people want from that manifesto are going to be implemented.”

corbyn amazing on marr (mostly because not being asked stupid questions about nuclear immolation)

http://mailchi.mp/survation/post-election-poll-for-the-mail-on-sunday-1118541

One week is a long time:

65% of all EU Referendum voters stating a view believe Theresa May not be PM when EU negotiations are complete - 45% of Leave voters and 67% of remain voters.
Boris Johnson most popular choice for next leader of Conservative party
Public opinion little changed on EU Referendum voting intention
Public believe Brexit negotiations should not be delayed by 65% to 25%
Only 36% of public agree PM is “strong and stable leader”
Only 33% of public approve of Theresa May’s DUP deal

Please can we have Boris Johnson as leader of the Conservative Party.

"I've got youth on my side!"

OMFG XD XD XD

LOL:

Paul Mason‏Verified account @paulmasonnews 36m36 minutes ago

Lord Heseltine - ditch Brexit or Corbyn becomes PM.

Never Forget Gideon's hateful propaganda about benefits scroungers while dressed in a high viz and all the other crimes. But it is hard not to feel his gleeful enthusiasm for May's painful death.

The thing about young people is they become old people.

That doesn't seem to be bearing out though - a lot of the voters in or approaching middle age appear to still be stubbornly voting Labour. Their biggest share of the vote came from people aged 35-45 which is the time where all received wisdom would be expecting Toryism to be kicking in. Obviously a lot of those people came of age during the New Labour era but they haven't switched to the Tories even now - although it's worth remembering how politically and socially toxic the idea of voting Tory was back then.

More to the point the Baby Boomers are a unique generation with unique advantages that subsequent generations haven't experienced. It makes a big difference.

I didn't see huge improvements in Corbyn's performance - I think the extra polish just came with time in the job. Then again he has never quite been in those General election settings before so not sure there are points of comparison.

Maybe, although Corbyn was really quite bad on TV in the early days of his leadership - the energy didn't really come through, he'd get visibly tetchy with interviewers etc. This time round he was able to laugh those dumb questions off, bat others away, answer comprehensively and generally come across as a human being. That sort of stuff comes with proper preparation and training, with the exception of the human being bit which you can't fake, but you maybe need to work to bring out in a hostile interview situation. Then again I didn't anticipate quite how uniquely dreadful May would turn out to be on TV, and even at her most media trained she was worse than Corbyn ever was.

None of the policies that people want from that manifesto are going to be implemented.

still incandescent when i see these lying bastards write shit like this, NONE OF THOSE POLICIES WOULD HAVE BEEN ON THE MANIFESTO IF YOU HAD YOUR WAY DIE DIE DIE

^^^p much jonathan pie's shtick ;)

i mean it :/

I love that Corbyn has a "made" aura about him now and is talking about how only Labour can offer the stability the country needs.

JC back to being favourite to be next PM at 10/3 as well!

https://www.oddschecker.com/politics/british-politics

Lol remember tho leftards that labour actually lost and u shd all be sad

As well as boosting the Labour vote, the manifesto prevented the expected collapse in their vote in core constituencies. We don't really know what would have happened under another leader but they would be more likely to have taken a Tim Farron-esque approach to Brexit, or at least a Milibandish one which would have played right into May's hands.

The Corbyn approach to Brexit was still a bit of a fudge but the genius of the campaign was about making the election about everything *except* Brexit, neutralising May's biggest electoral advantage.

though it seems to be missing Boris Johnson altogether from that, despite having him being fav to be next Tory leader, bah

wow, no, this is william hill today!

11/10 Jeremy Corbyn
5/2 Boris Johnson
9/2 David Davis
10/1 Amber Rudd
10/1 Phillip Hammond
10/1 Yvette Cooper

brb just putting £100 on owen smith

the fudge works because i'd guess the majority of the electorate aren't that bothered about the details of Brexit - sure there's a strong "kill all immigrants" wing but it's not the majority by a long stretch and there's a solid element of continuing support for Brexit which is largely "the referendum shd be final, just get on with it". in those circs as long as Corbyn keeps saying "don't worry we're Brexiting" then enough voters will be fine with that. of course the papers will get pissy about individual concessions as they are made, but that applies equally to whoever's running the negotiations in the end.

The odds I saw had George Osborne as third-favourite despite no longer even being in Parliament. Those look more realistic but I just don't see most of those people winning a Tory leadership contest. I don't think Johnson will get past his own party - too many enemies - ditto Davies. Rudd's majority is too small. Philip Hammond is too boring and a Remainer, although the boring bit might help right now.

Andrew Neil is completely shitting on some hapless Tory whip right now, it's been a long time since I've seen scenes like this. I've just realised how long they've carried this aura of arrogance and unassailability for, a decade at least.

time for the Quiet Man to appear back out of the shadows

i know alastair campbell is a cunt but he fucking destroyed the tories on bbc, yesterday, i think, saw the clip via twitter. the blood is most certainly in the water.

Agree there was techiness with interviewers and the like but the moments he really got through to people were all campaigns: for the leadership, then the leadership challenge and now the GE. I do agree it has been better.

Its gonna be interesting to see how he does back in parliament. It should be easier for him as he has pretty killed off any challenges and only out of work Blairites will keep going on about how he didn't win.

Young (Labour) becoming old (Tory) really comes with -- as one twitter thread (that I recall mark s posting) comes with 'strong and tsable' material conditions - pensions, a paid mortgage and so on (its not as facile as that but its amazing how some people don't know how hard these things are won when you don't need to save for them, there is way more to this ofc). That isn't really happening for anyone over 30 now unless something radically changes and Labour are the only ones offering that.

Tory Remainers hugely emboldened right now as well, which is going to make soft Brexit more likely. Anna Soubry is going "the people have spoken, they've rejected a hard Brexit".

I don't see any way in which this can continue for very long without collapsing. The LibDems at least feared electoral wipeout from breaking the coalition. Even if the DUP do form a formal coalition, I'm guessing their voters will continue to vote for them whatever happens, they have very little risk from walking away. w

yup open season on tories rn and they're just about to tear themselves apart over europe. this was all just simmering under the surface, and cameron managed to just about keep a lid on it with his majority victory but that lid wasn't that tightly sealed...

doesn't apply so much to neil, maybe, as he's way up the chain, but there's bound to be a lot of pent-up hate at e.g. the tabs for the entire boss layer -- the venom that comes out in these kinds of times is not faked, like they actually have dacre in their head as they're writing, and this allows them to switch it that much closer

i know alastair campbell is a cunt but he fucking destroyed the tories on bbc

For all his many flaws he hates the Tories more than pretty much anything else in the world. I'm quite happy for him to go on TV delivering savagings for as long as he keeps away from frontline politics.

the fudge works because i'd guess the majority of the electorate aren't that bothered about the details of Brexit - sure there's a strong "kill all immigrants" wing but it's not the majority by a long stretch and there's a solid element of continuing support for Brexit which is largely "the referendum shd be final, just get on with it". in those circs as long as Corbyn keeps saying "don't worry we're Brexiting" then enough voters will be fine with that. of course the papers will get pissy about individual concessions as they are made, but that applies equally to whoever's running the negotiations in the end.

― There's got to be a Corbyn after (Noodle Vague), Sunday, 11 June 2017 Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

otm. Its just a basic recognition we can't undo the referendum and as I was watching this the results basically went: -10% UKIP and +5% Tory +5% Labour through the night...I mean it was simply the right call.

yeah i am back to thinking brexit will never actually happen. even if you had a government of genii with a huge mandate and majority, it would still be a herculean task. as it stands it's just not actually possible. it's quite amusing to see the way the word "brexit" is used, like as a compound word for so many decisions and problems that are yet to come. "we will deliver brexit" etc - what does that mean? why is "deliver" the word being used? it's classic civil servant stuff - hijacking the meaning of a verb to attach it to a noun that has no meaning at all.

here's the campbell interview: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p0LDvLthbw0

i love the feeling of boundaries being pushed back that's in the air right now, and he really taps into that. the days of reckoning have arrived for these cunts.

sorry, many xposts

i love the feeling of boundaries being pushed back that's in the air right now...
― Bein' Sean Bean (LocalGarda), Sunday, 11 June 2017 09:42 (twenty-nine seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

we made a grown man eat a book

we made a grown man eat a book

anything is possible now!

He actually didn't really, which is kind of better

did giles coren really say he'd eat his children if JC become pm?

squad goals either way, teach him to diss sub-editors #theabsolutegrudge

My god, the sight of the giant Muppet waving goodbye to May is brutal.

stage 1: force a guy to eat his book live on air
stage 2: pic.twitter.com/wf054QsUx2

— Jonathan (@demarionunn) June 11, 2017

My god, the sight of the giant Muppet waving goodbye to May is brutal.

what is this?

When u peer pressure ur lame friend into smoking and they don't even inhale. Fkn woeful display https://t.co/pAMzvMXa55

— cera palmer (@TytoPollens) June 10, 2017

;-)

In the Campbell interview there's footage of a guy dressed as Elmo just waving at May as she's walking past.

"I'm sorry Theresa May, you can pray to god in that church right now, but you. Have. Had. It."

that tickled me

Always like when Campbell attacks Tories but its just bollocks re: Labour. I know JC will say "my door is always open" but now its more about allowing the membership to get greater democratic control and looking at selecting people who are actually representative of the country to stand as Labout MPs in a potential autumn election - and less about Yvette Cooper being a shadow cabinet member.

Although I'd like to see how Ed Milliband would do in a shadow Cabinet post..

maybe if the centrists just care deeply about Labour he could appeal to that and show them his mandate again

and then if they really can't deal with democratic socialist policies in a democratic socialist party they can just quietly slink off to the Lib Dems

"I'm sorry Theresa May, you can pray to god in that church right now, but you. Have. Had. It."

yeah it was nice he managed to get a good dig in at religion too.

FWIW I don't think Yvette Cooper would make a bad Shadow Cabinet minister because she has shown she can work with the leadership in some capacity (eg chairing the refugee taskforce) and hasn't joined in the constant carping you associate with people like Phillips, Dugher, Hunt etc. No guarantee she'll be asked, mind.

There's a salient point to be made about the dangers of ruling via a small closed circle and it's affected virtually every PM in my adult lifetime. But the people you bring in from outside have to show that they're worthy of that trust - maybe some of them will now.

ha! ok thread on what the Tories should do:

If the Tories were smart, they would put Davis in as PM & run a minority govt without a DUP deal—dare the DUP to vote them down & get Corbyn

— Edmund Griffiths (@EdmundGriffiths) June 10, 2017