Chameleons : Classic or Dud

Yeah I keep turning over so many different fills and breaks of his in my mind. Just would NOT have been the same, indeed.

Ouch. That is indeed unsettling news.

LIstening to soul in isolation on this, fantastic, thanks Ned.

http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLSfxjgIYjeGYUBs4NLlFEaMaKp5C6FPpC

You're welcome of course. I'll have a piece running in the Quietus tomorrow.

RIP :(

Way too young. A remarkable drummer in terms of what he didn't do, powerful without overpowering.

One of my favourite little bits of JL is that minute and a bit outro of On The Beach where the drums smashing through at the end of each bar, wave after wave onto the shore

Terrible news. I also thought of "Soul in Isolation" first, now it's time to reckon with "In Shreds," "Nathan's Phase"... jeez.

Giving a listen to the Live in Toronto album from the Strange Times tour now. They played San Diego that tour, and had I been just a bit more aware or on top of things, I suppose I could have gone or tried to go, but I was still very much a top 40 kid, wouldn't've known. Though I did see the reunion tour of course, I really can't complain.

FUCK

Man, what sad news. A lot of the Chameleons sound comes down to how powerful his drum parts were

My Quietus memorial is live:

http://thequietus.com/articles/21990-rip-the-chameleons-john-lever

Well said, Ned

great piece ned

Thanks kindly.

Another farewell to him, from Black Swan Lane's Jack Sobel

http://blackswanlane.com/goodbye-john/

https://scontent.fbed1-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/20663881_10156145323592137_7011716937297355767_n.jpg?oh=7f94036b7bb4faeeb7aca0c2f0a6dad3&oe=5A346751

oh my gosh, that is both brilliant and hideous

found amidst table of wizard of oz collectible plates and figurines at yard sale in illinois, so nutty. old lady next to me was like "is that suppose to be one of them oompa loompas...or ?"

LOL. Can just imagine the Mrs' face when comes home with that.

bump

Touring now, going to see Mark and the latest band in Boston on Sat night.

Who sang the first track on Tony Fletcher?

Mark sings everything. Except for the toast on WCIA.

I hadn't realized that those Dreams In Celluloid recordings were non-studio album tracks. Started to realise when I heard "Everyday I'm Crucified". Cant forget a lyric like "I think I know how Christ felt when they killed him on that hill, pissed off!"

"Denims And Curls" sounds like a Morrissey song.

Another song on the EP sounds like a full-on "wake up sheeple" thing. Didn't notice until several plays that he was doing a sheep "baaaaa".

Tony Fletcher (the person and the music recording) are both essential to life.

https://www.discogs.com/The-Chameleons-Free-Trade-Hall-Rehearsal/release/387186

Listening to that album for the first time in ages. The mix still leaves a lot to be desired, but it's just about impossible not to marvel at how good they were. Any 'Mad Jack' is bound to be good, but man they rip through it here. Probably my favorite recording of the tune.

Holy shit, I forgot they do 'In Answer' on here as well. This song is absolutely gorgeous. Always has been.👍🏻

Yeah, there's a dearth of great live recordings from the "Strange Times" tour.

I don't think I will ever tire of hearing them move from the brute, maniacal charge in the first section to the sound of souls exiting in the second half of 'A Person Isn't Safe Anywhere These Days.'

Would still argue that's one of their absolute best; and one of the most "zeitgeist-esque" songs of the era.

Mark relaying the situation in one summed up and terrifying question after the outburst:

"`Have you killed her?`, someone said." is one of the darkest and most intense moments in recorded music, I'd reckon. Makes me scared to visit northern England for sure.

But also somehow one of the most profound and beautiful codas I've ever heard.

xpost -- At least there's Live in Toronto. I know I have one other bootleg kicking around.

I used to have a boot from the Philly show but lost it years ago. I recall it being better than "Toronto".

https://www.brooklynvegan.com/the-mission-uk-the-chameleons-touring-in-2022-with-theatre-of-hate/

i used to love the Mission UK, they are so bad. just another U2.

hmm, dave not involved with the chams. those dudes have been through it. has anyone heard any of his stuff post-reunion? last i knew, he was in a band called coconut dogfuck but i never checked it out. he strikes me as a very misunderstood person, just in general.

glad to see mark has reconciled with reg to the point that they can share a stage again. wonder who's going to be on drums - i didn't see any details in the link.

in any case, yes the mish are quite boring.

is there a rundown of the beef between Mark and Dave somewhere?

well, mark's book was about two-thirds about exactly that, so lol not really.

it stems from mark and dave both having gigantic egos and was really ignited by mark pressing up unreleased chameleons recordings and selling them without asking all of the other members of the group (though he did give them a part of the profits) [citation needed].

i think that sums up the genesis of their beef, but there is a lot more.
how they ever got back together for the reunion boggles my mind.

The unreleased stuff, that's what came out on Imaginary Records - "Dali's Picture", "Here Today", those albums, right?

not the imaginary stuff; that was after they had somewhat come to an agreement. the initial conflict was over the glass pyramid stuff, i.e. the tony fletcher ep. from what i understand, the band agreed when they went their separate ways in 1988 that those recordings were "not finished" and therefore would not be releasing them.

basically summarizing from mark's book. as one-sided as his story is, it is pretty illuminating as to why those guys have such a strained relationship. considering they split on even worse terms after the initial reunion, i wonder how this new incarnation came to be.

all of this just makes me sad thinking of jon sitting back there pounding away at "soul in isolation."
you know he'd be involved in this new tour if he was still alive.

Yeah that's why I can't be bothered with this. Having seen Mark solo throughout the 90s, even with John on drums at points, he was absolutely essential there, but no guitarists could even approach the perfect flow of Reg and Dave together -- when I saw the 2001/2002 shows it all made SENSE, it has to be the quartet or nothing when it comes to Chameleons songs. I did see Mark solo with a backing band later in the 2000s and it was a solid enough show, but when he started doing that ChameleonsVox approach I was out, and now that John's gone, I'm sorry, but the band has definitively ended, no matter what label is being used. I'd think that even if Dave was on board.

I'd think that even if Dave was on board.

― Ned Raggett, Saturday, October 9, 2021 8:55 AM

inclined to agree here.

at this point, the innerband conflicts are becoming their most known legacy; and half of the band playing as "THE CHAMELEONS" doesn't seem like the kind of thing one does to extend the olive branch.

though i doubt most folks seeing them on this kind of bill really care. i do genuinely believe that mark feels like he is "giving the fans what they want."

Have seen chameleons vox a couple of times not really sure what to expect, but hearing Mark singing those songs right there in front of ne, it was impossible for me not to get swept away

see that's the thing: he is an outstanding performer. i saw him play one of his post-reunion pre-chamsvox pick up band gigs and it was fucking awesome. he played a bit acoustic before the proper set and he was taking requests for the sun and the moon songs, for fucks sake.

like i said, the guy seems to genuinely love his fans as much as they love him. and he has a gigantic ego, so he loves the attention it brings.

also i didn't mean that ego thing in a demeaning way. don't get me wrong or whatever.

Anyone seen them on the current tour? I'm thinking of going next week. Doubt I'd stay for the Mission but eight or so Chameleons songs still seems worth it.

I saw them in June if that counts as 'the current tour'. Very enjoyable! Mark was on excellent form - charming and combative.

ah thanks, that seals it

Saw 'em a few weeks ago, had a really good time! The Mission were fun too.

Playing the US in August

Sweet. Still kicking myself for missing them last year, was utterly shocked how cheap it was and how small the venue was. Straight up injustice.