xp welp, brb, skipping ahead to that Famke Janssen joint
― a 47-year-old chainsaw artist from South Carolina (Phil D.), Thursday, 1 September 2016 01:54 (seven years ago) link
well they ruined The Borg. "I, Borg" may have worked story-wise but it's a bit too close to being a Full House episode.
― AdamVania (Adam Bruneau), Thursday, 1 September 2016 05:40 (seven years ago) link
Cause & Effect is really good but for real twilight zone brainfuckery try Parallels, Remember Me, Frame of Mind...
― all olly murs' lemurs (ledge), Thursday, 1 September 2016 08:05 (seven years ago) link
Frame of Mind is awesome!
― write sed fread (Leee), Thursday, 1 September 2016 17:27 (seven years ago) link
i need to see this full house episode where danny comes to terms with adopting a child soldier whose army kidnapped uncle joey and turned him into a killing machine.
― Philip Nunez, Thursday, 1 September 2016 17:55 (seven years ago) link
S3E17 iirc
― dr. mercurio arboria (mh 😏), Thursday, 1 September 2016 17:56 (seven years ago) link
Here, this is suitably annoying, you guys enjoy. Dudes who work on the American Libertarian magazine _Reason_ decided to make a "funny:"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jgRlzFIgm1E
― Sentient animated cat gif (kingfish), Friday, 9 September 2016 16:49 (seven years ago) link
"I, Borg" may have worked story-wise but it's a bit too close to being a Full House episode.
I was thinking more "Small Wonder" but yes otm
― Οὖτις, Friday, 9 September 2016 16:50 (seven years ago) link
The drawback of (TNG's) utopian premise was that it did away with most of the interpersonal conflicts that are the bread and butter of episodic television dramas, including the original series. Picard and his crew were all human carbon copies of Spock—even-keeled, rational, and almost impossibly ethical. (Spock himself says so of Picard in “Unification,” the one “Next Generation” episode in which he appears.) That left little room for identification. You could aspire to be more like Picard, the very model of compassion and culture, but you could never truly understand his moral universe. He was nothing like us twenty-first-century humans. He was too alien.
http://www.newyorker.com/tech/elements/the-enduring-lessons-of-star-trek
― The Hon. J. Piedmont Mumblethunder (Dr Morbius), Friday, 9 September 2016 19:34 (seven years ago) link
That is why it's great SF! Not interested in future worlds where the people behave exactly like us.
― dancing jarman by derek (ledge), Friday, 9 September 2016 19:49 (seven years ago) link
uh ppl are still very horny in star trek. completely relatable.
― dr. mercurio arboria (mh 😏), Friday, 9 September 2016 19:51 (seven years ago) link
couldn't relate to all those starchy TNG stiffs
― The Hon. J. Piedmont Mumblethunder (Dr Morbius), Friday, 9 September 2016 19:51 (seven years ago) link
lotta conventional wisdom in that piece and telling that its example of tng is darmok, ie the literal peak, and not any of the 28395329423 episodes about relationships in the workplace. despite being constantly maligned the first couple seasons (w roddenberry's draconian anti-conflict rules in place) are much closer to the advanced cerebral ideal that piece describes than the later, more dramatic, "better" stuff.
― le Histoire du Edgy Miley (difficult listening hour), Friday, 9 September 2016 19:52 (seven years ago) link
also
Tellingly, the original series was at its best when its cast engaged in good, old-fashioned time travel. “The City on the Edge of Forever,”
augh
― le Histoire du Edgy Miley (difficult listening hour), Friday, 9 September 2016 19:53 (seven years ago) link
so so many tng episodes entirely about crew members' (very human, very 90s) feelings. maybe a little metaphorical quantum reverse flux in the warp dampeners to be resolved along with their inner turmoil. nothing wrong w this but it shouldn't get a reputation as the brainy conceptual one.
― le Histoire du Edgy Miley (difficult listening hour), Friday, 9 September 2016 19:58 (seven years ago) link
with some minor exceptions that piece is mostly otm imo. It's strange that it doesn't address my biggest complaint about TNG, which is that it *looks* worse than TOS. The muted colors and bland design add to the air of uniformity and stiffness, which is a huge contrast to the deliberately bright and vibrant and odd TOS.
― Οὖτις, Friday, 9 September 2016 20:09 (seven years ago) link
it does seem a little unfair to criticize TNG for not having anything similar to the Kirk-Spock-McCoy troika (which is what all that "interpersonal conflict" is really a reference to - none of the other TOS crewmembers ever argued about anything! OK maybe Scotty occasionally). The trio's perfectly formed dramatic motor was some real lightning-in-a-bottle type stuff that would be impossible to replicate imo.
― Οὖτις, Friday, 9 September 2016 20:17 (seven years ago) link
well there were guest character conflicts too
― The Hon. J. Piedmont Mumblethunder (Dr Morbius), Friday, 9 September 2016 20:33 (seven years ago) link
there's plenty of that in TNG
― Οὖτις, Friday, 9 September 2016 20:33 (seven years ago) link
the "guest-character-upsets-crew-dynamic" is a regularly used plot device - Q, Lore, Troi's mom, Worf's family etc.
― Οὖτις, Friday, 9 September 2016 20:35 (seven years ago) link
I've never liked the clunky design of TOS (especially when compared to 2001, which TNG looks a lot closer to) But almost anyone who has seen both can draw the bridges from memory.
Not so with ds9, voyager, enterprise.
― Philip Nunez, Friday, 9 September 2016 22:13 (seven years ago) link
jeez, the original series budget was not in the same galaxy as Kubrick's. or TNG
― The Hon. J. Piedmont Mumblethunder (Dr Morbius), Saturday, 10 September 2016 00:59 (seven years ago) link
It's strange that it doesn't address my biggest complaint about TNG, which is that it *looks* worse than TOS. The muted colors and bland design add to the air of uniformity and stiffness, which is a huge contrast to the deliberately bright and vibrant and odd TOS.
Like TOS, they shot every TNG episode on film, but the flat lighting and dull colors of TNG make me think they lit it for video. I think someone in production didn't know what the fuck they were doing. The PC-case-gray ship interior doesn't help. The TNG remasters enhance the colors but can't fix it all.
― Einstein, Kazanga, Sitar (abanana), Saturday, 10 September 2016 01:46 (seven years ago) link
What color should it have been? Presumably the TNG movies were more professionally lit but those don't strike me as more flattering or iconic representations of the ship or crew.
― Philip Nunez, Saturday, 10 September 2016 02:08 (seven years ago) link
best tng was the ep where everyone de-evolves into primitive animal versions of themselves. data's cat turns into an iguana.
― Rob Boss (latebloomer), Saturday, 10 September 2016 02:26 (seven years ago) link
lol going to find and watch that one now. the comments on imdb are mostly rumination into whether Brannon Braga has any idea how evolutionary things work. judging by his work since then, the answer is probably still no
― dr. mercurio arboria (mh 😏), Saturday, 10 September 2016 02:35 (seven years ago) link
I love the voyager episode that does more or less the same except that people are EVOLVING into herptiles ('threshold')
― I wish you could see my home. It's... it's so... exciting (Jon not Jon), Saturday, 10 September 2016 02:48 (seven years ago) link
Yeah the one where Paris and Janeway as lizards breed?!?
― dr. mercurio arboria (mh 😏), Saturday, 10 September 2016 02:52 (seven years ago) link
So fucked up
― I wish you could see my home. It's... it's so... exciting (Jon not Jon), Saturday, 10 September 2016 03:09 (seven years ago) link
I would describe them as giant river salamanders
― I wish you could see my home. It's... it's so... exciting (Jon not Jon), Saturday, 10 September 2016 03:10 (seven years ago) link
otm
― dr. mercurio arboria (mh 😏), Saturday, 10 September 2016 03:25 (seven years ago) link
What color should it have been?
TNG also had a composer, Ron Jones, who got fired for making music that was "too distracting". After he was fired they just used a small bag of cues, a type of score more common in cheaply made shows. So yeah, I believe TNG had big production blunders.
― Einstein, Kazanga, Sitar (abanana), Saturday, 10 September 2016 05:09 (seven years ago) link
TNG is clearly not flat-out iconically beautiful like the original Trek but I still think it looks great, especially the remasters, and it's dated really well compared to other late 80s/early 90s shows - try watching it against an episode of LA Law or Seaquest or Quantum Leap, if you want to look at what "bland" really is. There are well-directed, iconic moments in every episode, even the shittiest ones. The set design makes some bad colour choices but it's super memorable. And the actors, in spite or their varying abilities and styles, are all fascinating to watch. Very few things in TOS match Picard's best moments in TNG.
Obviously ditching Ron Jones was a mistake. I don't get the "conflict" thing though - there are plenty of disagreements on the show. And the characters never struck me as blandly-too-perfect.
― Chuck_Tatum, Saturday, 10 September 2016 13:35 (seven years ago) link
Like TOS, they shot every TNG episode on film, but the flat lighting and dull colors of TNG make me think they lit it for video. I think someone in production didn't know what the fuck they were doing.
Ha! Just last night my wife, who is watching these episodes for the first time like I am, saw "11001001" and said, "The lighting person on this show did not know what they were doing."
First Contact is the best looking of the TNG movies by a long, long way.
― a 47-year-old chainsaw artist from South Carolina (Phil D.), Saturday, 10 September 2016 16:57 (seven years ago) link
HI DERE
― The Wind Cries Miri (James Redd and the Blecchs), Sunday, 11 September 2016 19:50 (seven years ago) link
ok i tried color-correcting TNG; it did not workhttp://i.imgur.com/A4ltSOx.jpg
― Philip Nunez, Tuesday, 13 September 2016 18:13 (seven years ago) link
who knew the future would be so beige
― Οὖτις, Tuesday, 13 September 2016 19:15 (seven years ago) link
the future's so bright, you gotta wear beige
― Philip Nunez, Tuesday, 13 September 2016 22:13 (seven years ago) link
was close to making that v joke, but figured I would get shit for none of the costumes actually being beige
― Οὖτις, Tuesday, 13 September 2016 22:14 (seven years ago) link
eh, i still think it looks pretty cool. luxury UN!
― Nhex, Tuesday, 13 September 2016 22:22 (seven years ago) link
sometimes the future loops beige on itselfhttps://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/b/bd/St1-cast_publicity_shot.png
― Philip Nunez, Tuesday, 13 September 2016 22:26 (seven years ago) link
I put it to you that this is all accurate.
http://imgur.com/gallery/wpZ4w
― Ned Raggett, Monday, 17 October 2016 20:32 (seven years ago) link
i'm on the final season of TNG! the really good episodes are sort of few and far between now and they are kind of loosing the plot a bit.
it's kind of unfortunate how they handled The Borg imo. they were never as strong as those first couple of episodes, everything after they took over Picard is a little meh.
Data having dreams is an interesting idea but i feel like they are relying on the fish-eye-lens trick way too much. i loved seeing him struggle and asking Picard what to do, Picard telling him to use them as inspiration, and Data setting out to manically re-create his dream imagery through paintings. absolutely hated HATED Data stabbing Troi in "Phantasms". i was convinced that was a dream as well and it would turn into Inception a bit but no, they go full horror mode for it, and it's a bit too much to take. especially how everyone quickly brushes it off. if you had an android that was suddenly suffering from nightmares and hearing voices telling him to "Kill them" and then violently attacks a crew member wouldn't you do more than just confine him to quarters for a bit?
"Frame of Mind" from Season 6 was pretty entertaining, reminding me a bit of the Bjork video about the play where the play is about them writing the play etc. on the one hand i felt like they were leaning a bit hard on Riker going crazy for the latter half of season 6, but he's a convincing enough actor to pull it off.
"Ship in a Bottle" is a great holodeck episode. Moriarty from Sherlock Holmes LEAVE THE HOLODECK, something that should be literally impossible, and the episode is a great mystery that has a cool Inception-style payoff. sorry i keep referring to that movie lol
"Starship Mine" was probably the most impressive of the past 2 seasons, basically Die Hard In Space. what a great premise: the Enterprise is evacuated for a standard cleaning procedure and top staff gathered to a dull diplomatic meet-and-greet when Picard overhears an opportunity to go horse riding. upon going back to the ship to get his saddle, he discovers it is being infiltrated by terrorists, and one-by-one he has to take them out, reclaim his ship, etc. all while a giant fatal space laser is slowly sweeping the ship from front to back. SO GOOD.
― AdamVania (Adam Bruneau), Thursday, 20 October 2016 16:52 (seven years ago) link
ship in a bottle is the best tng ep
― ciderpress, Thursday, 20 October 2016 16:59 (seven years ago) link
YES i love the solution they come up with
― AdamVania (Adam Bruneau), Thursday, 20 October 2016 17:02 (seven years ago) link
picard breaking the fourth wall in his closing remarks is A+++
― ciderpress, Thursday, 20 October 2016 18:18 (seven years ago) link
It's a mean trick they pull (in Ship in a Bottle), and ridiculous that a self aware AI spontaneously generates and they basically go 'lol' and then shut it up in a cupboard and forget all about it. A bit like the stuff in Plato's Stepchildren that can give anyone godlike psychokinesis, but is never mentioned again. Or the gate in The City at the Edge of Forever - "many such journeys are possible!", nah mate we've had enough.
― quis gropes ipsos gropiuses? (ledge), Thursday, 20 October 2016 18:25 (seven years ago) link
watch Yesteryear in the animated series
― Einstein, Kazanga, Sitar (abanana), Friday, 21 October 2016 04:03 (seven years ago) link
Greatest Gen podcast still killin' it
― (rocketcat) 🚀🐱 👑🐟 (kingfish), Thursday, 27 October 2016 07:29 (seven years ago) link
It's a mean trick they pull (in Ship in a Bottle), and ridiculous that a self aware AI spontaneously generates and they basically go 'lol' and then shut it up in a cupboard and forget all about it.
Well, there's also the episode where the ship's computer gives birth to a sentient lifeform, and the other one where Wesley accidentally creates sentient life from his pet nanobots, so this sort of stuff seems to be happening every other day in TNG. Though I guess that raises the question why everyone is so in awe of Data being a sentient artificial life form, when a teenager can create the same literally out of his school science project.
― Tuomas, Thursday, 27 October 2016 09:52 (seven years ago) link