Built to Spill: 'Perfect' vs. 'Keep it Like a Secret'

Specifically that puppet thing eating the corn or whatever.

the first one -- Ultimate Alternative Wavers -- also has some good stuff, esp. "Nowhere Nothin' Fuckup," which is sort of a tribute to/cover of the Velvet Underground's "Oh Sweet Nuthin'"

They're all great. I can only think of a handful of other bands that have released three albums in a row that sound almost nothing like one another yet are each awesome in their own right.

I once was at a strip club where the strippers had to play their own music on the jukebox. One girl stripped to Silent Lucidity by Queensryche, so anything's possible.

'randy described eternity' was the outstanding highlight of the show i saw last week.
the show reminded me that although the less sprawling, pop song-structured songs in the band's catalogue are very fine indeed, the band is in a league of its own when it comes to the longer, more layered, drawn out, melodic guitar assaults.

thus, 'perfect from now on' is not only the band's crowning achievement, but also one of the top 5 records of the 90s.

I'm kind of amazed that there isn't more outright anti-BtS contrarianism on this thread. you won't be getting it from me, though; I love both of these records, and it really just comes down to which I'm in the mood to hear at any given time.

"Kicked It In the Sun" was pretty amazing when I saw them live a couple years back, though.

"perfecr" wins easy.
if anything,it should be "perfect" vs. "wrong with love"

Why aren't they coming to DC/Baltimore?

I love both of these records, but prefer Keep It Like a Secret because it is more concise (excepting Broken Chairs, which you can pretty much wander off at the end of). Temporarily Blind is one of my favorite songs ever written. Carry the Zero is pretty far up there too.

Perfect From Now On is a little too sprawling for me, even though that sprawl kinda enables them to reach the psychedelic peaks that make the record so good.

If there's a word for you
It doesn't mean anything

Is one of their best lines though.

that's a very good line, yes!

i also really like

"we're special in other ways
ways our mothers appreciate"

UGH where is my keep it like a secret CD?????

some fucking bitch stole my Perfect From Now On copy at college. i like harrassed her about it and she never fucking returned it.

morning btw.

that's tragic, surmounter :(

my BTS records are all pretty much sacred cows. even the one(s) i don't listen to much anymore

"there's nothing wrong with love" is best

"I wanna see it untame itself and break its owner"

i was hoping this thread would be on top cuz i'm putting Keep It Like A Secret on now and that is exciting

it's been years since i played either one i think, but remember beeing very let down by 'keep it like a secret' back when. there was simply nothing on it that grabbed my attention, whereas 'perfect from now on' had had a great impact on me as it was *the* album that first got me into indie rock back in '97.

What saxomophone said.

Perfect From Now On is one of those rare(ish) albums that is more than the sum of its parts... it's not just a collection of great songs, there's a kind of transcendant thematic cohesion (dude).

I never really got into TNWWL. Always seemed a little immature - lyrically, vocally, structurally. I think they'd definitely matured as songwriters by Perfect. Mind you Perfect is the one I heard first, and if one's a late adopter it's always harder to go back and evaluate the earlier stuff.

"I never really got into TNWWL. Always seemed a little immature "

and thats what makes it a more simple and fun to listen to,(sometimes, depends on mood),compared to the seriousness of "perfect".

also,"car" and "stab" might be their best songs ever.

am i the only one who think that "secret"'s production is kinda annoying?

i kinda like it, however simplistic and like sophomore-year-of-college it may sound

<i>am i the only one who think that "secret"'s production is kinda annoying?</i>
No you are not. I prefer Perfect...

Call me a knucklehead, but I usually go for the live album above all else -- my favorite version of Car, my favorite versions of any of the songs off Keep It Like A Secret. It's possible I'm wrong on this one, but I think the 20 minutes of Cortez the Killer are all worthwhile.

afghan whigs are one of the only rock bands of their time to successfully ingest r&b into their songwriting, they're v special to me, hope you like them flappy

Afghan Whigs, I have left more than one of their shows thinking it the best I have ever seen to the extent that if I never saw another show by anyone I would be satisfied.

exactly. best show i've ever seen in my life is still the 2012 bowery ballroom reunion show

I also recommend In Spades which is much better than I ever expected from their "reunion"

saw the Afghan Whigs on the Black Love tour, was unbelievably great

also I think Black Love > Gentlemen

it's not really a weird bill at all! considering they probably have a ton of mutual fans imo

Built to Spill has always been great live but you have to like solos. I love guitar solos.

same

didn't know there was this much consensus on black love. it's my fav whigs record (and prob the best introduction to them, it took me a while to completely get into gentlemen)

the production and sequencing is just a little more satisfying to me, Gentlemen (and Congreagation) both excellent obv

black love and 1965 are my absolute favorites but there's not much distance in quality between any of them post-up in it

I hope someone makes that Black Love noir one day

I've never been able to get into 1965 for some reason

Probably seen BtS six or seven times, and I'd say they crushed it at about four of those, one of which was probably a top 10 concert of all time for me. Best part of the show is usually the closer ("Broken Chairs" or something fittingly epic) where they give themselves the freedom to jam without restraint, but there's always this sense they could turn any song into a Perfect From Now On-scale monster if they wanted to.

1965 is the sexiest album

ah that's prob why I don't like it

i'm personally glad i've never seen the whigs perform "omerta" live bc the sexual energy would be overpowering

I don't like Built to Spills jammy solos, I think they're vampy/noodly/predictable, but ymmv. I do like when BTS goes into cover song mode. Same with the Whigs, for that matter, but the former is usually more faithful and the latter brilliantly twists totally inspired picks into spooky/sexy/sleazy Whigs mode.

I used to be one of those fans who listened for the songs and tolerated the solos, but eventually the jams became a real attraction for me... a lot of them are pretty damn dramatic. Doug Martsch admitted to me a few years ago that the jams are more for them than the audience, a way to keep themselves interested, but you can kinda tell that's where his heart is at and where he puts in the most passion.

They're one of those bands fascinated by the unattainable ideal of perfection, and the idea that there really is a perfect way to play each of these songs and the drive to get as close to that ideal as they can. Pretty satisfying seeing a band that cares that much about their craft, even if the jams aren't your thing

Doug also rocks Lace Sensors in his Strat so he's automatically a better guitarist than most

i too love guitar solos

as much as keep it like a secret is my fav bts album there's nothing on it that quite achieves what, say, the first few seconds of "velvet waltz" do

i checked my old posts on this thread and got really self-conscious about my opinion not really changing much over so many years, but i still think ^^^^^

Doug Martsch admitted to me a few years ago that the jams are more for them than the audience, a way to keep themselves interested, but you can kinda tell that's where his heart is at and where he puts in the most passion.

yeah, i agree with this and on the days when PFNO really connects with me it's because it was the album where they best balanced the hooks with the jams.

that's what kim thayil said about the soundgarden songs they would routinely stretch out for 'noise jams' on, oddly enough since there did not seem to be much flexibility to how they did them

Well, per that, I generally like guitar solos, too, but I've never heard any BTS solo stuff that terribly impressed me, compared to, say, the epic solo on Temple of the Dog's "Reach Down." But then, as much as I respect Mike McCready as a guitar player, there are lots of times I wish he would just chill out. Doug's playing imo is best used in service of hooks, not soloing.

I'm always confused when people bring up guitar solos when talking about Built to Spill. I don't think of them as a guitar solo band at all, but the way people talk you'd think Doug Martsch was up there shredding in the mixolydian mode like Yngwie or something.

I mean, of course they're a guitar band, and they do play extended jams, but those jams don't typically involve guitar solos in the classic sense. They usually involve layered, pre-written parts, and little variations within the parameters of those parts, maybe some leaning on the wah pedal for atmosphere, but not the sort of improvisational up-and-down-the-fretboard action you usually think of as a rock guitar solo. At least on the two albums this thread is about, which are the ones I know best.

yeah, exactly. they vamp and rearrange, but not a lot of solos per se.

and it's awesome

we're talking indie rock

we've defined soloing down

Motion denied on the grounds that J Mascis exists

Mixolydian is beneath a man of Yngwie's talent, Phrygian or bust

imo, perfect from now on could have been such a better record with a little brevity. then again, the whole thing was recorded three times (they were unhappy with first takes, and second time around the master tapes melted). the songs are so strong, but sonically it's a fucking racket.

there's nothing wrong with love and keep it like a secret are stone cold gems, though.

wonder how they are live as just a three piece, now, since interweaving guitarplay was fundamental to their sound. then again, jason from helvetia is playing bass, and he is a badass musician.

go and listen to duster if you haven't already, he was the drummer in them. wonderful slowcore, some of the best guitar tones i've ever heard on record. label mates of BTS back in the day.

Ha, I had no idea Nelson and Plouf were no longer in the band.

Wait, Brett Nelson and Brett Netson are two different people?! WTF, BTS? TS: bands with two members name Brett vs. bands with two members named Chad.

sonically it's a fucking racket

This is certainly an opinion about PFNO.

wonder how they are live as just a three piece
best BTS show i've seen (in 1998-ish?) was with a three-piece lineup ... was cool to see Martsch figure out how to play those intricate parts effectively.

Keep it like a secret and there’s nothing wrong with love are both stunningly brilliant but perfect from now on has this ineffable quality/innigkeit about it that makes it forever my favorite bts

yeah, i agree!

we can all at least agree that TNWWL has the only actually funny hidden/joke track of the period

look for the record with ME on the cover

Cause baby you know I’m a REBEL
I’m a RAMBLER...
(Waxes poetic on axe)

we can all at least agree that TNWWL has the only actually funny hidden/joke track of the period

― Simon H., Wednesday, January 31, 2018 11:07 AM (twenty minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

look for the record with ME on the cover

― tylerw, Wednesday, January 31, 2018 11:10 AM (seventeen minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

lmao it really is actually funny

re: concerns about the three-piece lineup & how doug could manage to make up for missing guitars... this arrangement of Else from a couple years ago is really beautiful

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B4JxIYuVwKw

That is nice! You know what would make it better? Second guitarist.

Lol yea but still, good version. There was a sweet pro shot video of a full show from 1999 at some theater in Boulder that’s disappeared off YouTube for some reason unfortunately. Amazing version of Else with lap steel

we can all at least agree that TNWWL has the only actually funny hidden/joke track of the period

― Simon H., Wednesday, January 31, 2018 11:07 AM (twenty minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

look for the record with ME on the cover

― tylerw, Wednesday, January 31, 2018 11:10 AM (seventeen minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

lmao it really is actually funny

― flamenco drop (BradNelson), Wednesday, January 31, 2018 1:28 PM (yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

This and Sebadoh showtape 91

this seems like the more recently active Built to Spill thread so I'll bump this one... BTS sign to Sub Pop! tour dates! new album!

Pacific Northwest rock band Built to Spill have singed with Sub Pop, the Seattle-based label announced today (October 7). In celebration of the news, Built to Spill have shared a string of North American tour dates kicking off in Seattle on December 16 and wrapping up in San Francisco in February of next year. They’ll be joined by Dinosaur Jr., Team Dresch, Prism Bitch, and more on select dates. Find their full schedule below.

In addition to the tour announcement, Sub Pop revealed that Built to Spill—comprised of Doug Martsch, Melanie Radford, and Teresa Esguerra—are currently working on their debut album for the label. The LP is due out next year, and will mark the band’s follow-up to 2015’s Untethered Moon. Last year, the group issued Built to Spill Plays the Songs of Daniel Johnston.

said dates:

12-16 Seattle, WA - The Showbox at the Market =
12-17 Portland, OR - Revolution Hall =
12-18 Olympia, WA - Capitol Theatre =
12-19 Tacoma, WA - Spanish Ballroom at Elks Temple =
01-26 Seattle, WA - The Crocodile ^ !
01-27 Seattle, WA - The Crocodile ^ !
01-29 Portland, OR - Wonder Ballroom ^ !
01-30 Portland, OR - Wonder Ballroom ^ $
01-31 Eugene, OR - Sessions Music Hall ^ ! $
02-02 Sacramento, CA - Harlows ^ $
02-03 Santa Ana, CA - The Observatory ^ $
02-04 Las Vegas, NV - Brooklyn Bowl ^ #
02-05 Pioneertown, CA - Pappy & Harriet's (Outdoors) ^ $
02-07 San Diego, CA - Belly Up ^ $
02-08 Los Angeles, CA - Echoplex ^ $
02-09 Los Angeles, CA - Echoplex ^ $
02-10 Santa Cruz, CA - Rio Theatre ^ $
02-11 San Francisco, CA - The Fillmore ^ $
02-12 San Francisco, CA - The Fillmore ^ $

= w/ Team Dresch
^ w/ Prism Bitch
# w/ Dinosaur Jr.
! w/ Oh, Rose
$ w/ Itchy Kitty

Doug has been in a sort of strange - maybe transitional, it seems now - zone recently, playing backyards and tiny venues in Portland and elsewhere in the Northwest. It's cool that he has switched up the lineup to include two women, though I generally would rather see BTS as a quartet.

I saw a pretty great trio show back in the 90s (and also a terrible one!). He's definitely a cool player, I like the idea of him doing a little more heavy lifting. Glad he's still at it!