HBO's adaptation of Game of Thrones - Thread 2. There are a lot of nerds.

It reiterates that they had an agreement.

It also makes her showing up when Jon was punching Ramsay a little more logical than via a puff of smoke.

Yeah, but the problem is exactly that they never clarified what kind of agreement they had. So it just brings to mind a poorly handled plotpoint.

If they hadn't done that frederik would be complaining about the logistics of Sansa's movements this very moment

If the vale turning up was unexpected, why not mention it to Jon? They were scraping th barrel for hope, and she had some.

How exactly would you stop an opposing army from doing whatever it wanted without actually battling it. Send out a constable?

Or they assumed grown ups could figure it out on their own? Xp

They were scraping th barrel for hope, and she had some.

― inside, skeletons are always inside, that's obvious. (dowd), Thursday, June 23, 2016 12:21 PM (34 seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

So "hope" would have helped him win?

Did you miss all those times I mentioned Jon's knowledge of the Vale could have played a part in their battle strategy and negotiations with Ramsay?

Wonder how different the nitpicking will be to future generations when the show and possibly the book is all complete.

How exactly would you stop an opposing army from doing whatever it wanted without actually battling it. Send out a constable?

Put out an orange sign that says NO OVERNIGHT ARMIES HERE

frederik considering that these are all plot points that are evidently left open and that the preview suggests the next episode will address in some way yr obsessive demand for answers right now is v confusing to me

I'm baffled by how Frederik apparently knows the geography of Winterfell like the back of his hand.

Lol. I know the answer. It's because it's crap writing. But somehow that explanation upsets other ilxors.

The intro to the show is a map of Westeros, longneck...

Do they show the exact position of the battle and how an army would necessarily approach it though? Is there a google maps of westeros somewhere on the internet?

Hope wouldn't have hurt him, and that's my problem. And yes, morale can win battles. Again, I'm arguing something I don't care about only because people insist it's not an issue, and I want to know why. Why not tell Jon about the offer of an army from littlefinger? And I don't think there's a coherent explanation within the text. I'm happy with an outside explanation (which I think is right) that they did it for the vandal style swoop at the end.

Vandal = gandalf, but doesn't it always?

Is there a google maps of westeros somewhere on the internet?

― human and working on getting beer (longneck), 23. juni 2016 19:46 (25 seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Yeah, kinda. A bunch of them, actually.

is it on their net site, Serial style? And have they added enough peasants? If so, maybe one of the google map peasants told LF where the battle was? Or maybe he just followed the noise and the crows?

Sansa called LF from the payphone at the Best Buy parking lot

The problem is not finding the battle. The problem is finding Sansa. Who should, logically, be on the other side of the battle from where Littlefinger would be coming.

It's pretty fun that you're baffled by knowledge of geography in a famously detailed fantasy series running thousands of pages long, though.

the thread getting clogged up with ppl who have apparently paid no attention and like deej calling other ppl dumb because he doesn't have a clue himself...i am the real victim here.

― Roberto Spiralli, Thursday, June 23, 2016 6:37 AM (4 hours ago)

they went around winterfell...

Spiralli otm.

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-vwC9srXnGHY/T9aIK4GI9VI/AAAAAAAABB4/u_gbZIG0Dqo/s200/sticker,375x360.png

The Ask the Maester guy has a *crazy* knowledge of Westeros etc. geography, there must be maps out there.

I think the nitpicking stems in part relative to the books, which are hyper-detailed to an obsessive degree. So when the show leaves huge, or even moderate, details out, it really invites head scratching. But then, as I've noted before, one of the most fascinating aspects of the whole project (and why I still follow it) is to see how an adaptation of books that have not been written plays out.

But even from the beginning, even before I began to nitpick stupid hobby details, I've had issues with the show's soapiness, which undercuts its drama. At times it's played out as camp, at times it's been unearned pathos, other times it's been really effective. But unlike a show like "The Walking Dead," which has been all shades of shitty under different show runners, with no end in sight, GoT has been erratic under steady leadership, with the direct involvement of the author, who helpfully provided or at least confirmed the arc of his unwritten narrative. Makes poor decisions or uneven episodes/seasons less explicable, except in the most obvious the-books-are-not-the-show sense. And even then, the books and show are bad/uneven/frustrating for opposite reasons: the books are stuffed with details that bog down the forward narrative flow, the show flies by but loses a lot of the details the books are famed for. Different animals, both kinda lame.

there must be maps out there.

http://quartermaester.info/

the show's soapiness, which undercuts its drama

for you maybe.

I have lots or problems with the show, contra Fredrick I don't think it's always well written, I just think certain criticisms make folks seem like the comic book store guy from simpsons

http://0.media.dorkly.cvcdn.com/55/41/e1ec0016ccb150a6a24dd210938a140d.jpg

certain criticisms make folks seem like they couldn't have possibly passed English Lit in highschool.

I was going to make a joke post along the lines of "Good episode but have we talked about why Sansa didn't tell Jon about the Arryn army?" but I see you guys are on top of that well done.

Bingo. Why is it so difficult to imagine LF going straight to camp and meeting up with Sansa there? Because there are maps on the internet?

why Sansa didn't tell Jon about the Arryn army?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EPHUZenprKc

I get that it's meant as an insult, but this is a medieval fantasy story with dragons and ice zombies, famous for it's scope and detail. I don't really feel bad for acting like Comic Book Guy around it. It's a nerdy thing, and nerding about it is actually a pretty fun thing. Nerding about the details on the maps, the long history of the show, the parallels with European history. Most of the time it really enriches the experience. This thing with Littlefinger was just crap, though, and I hope and expect that GRRM goes in a completely different direction.

i think it's p obvious to anyone here who watches the show/read the books that it's poorly written because grrm is not really a v good writer. but it's not poorly written because we don't know the logistics of lf moving around winterfell

Man, even Rob Bricken has a better handle on this than Fred does. That's . . . man oh man. Sad!

http://io9.gizmodo.com/why-didn-t-sansa-tell-jon-snow-about-littlefinger-s-arm-1782494488

that gizmodo dude is otm because guys i already answered this --- sansa didn't tell jon because she wasn't sure they were coming, and they showed up at the last minute because that's what LF wanted

yeah and now Jon and Sansa have an army of ten wildings and Davos and a twelve year old girl and littlefinger has the best army in the north, with minimal casualties.

do we know that the 12 year old girl survived?

All this debate is actually getting me more excited for the finale.

And unlike Stannis, who ALSO saved Jon from getting a good old-fashioned ass-whuppin', LF isn't about to charge off and get himself killed.

Littlefinger does not command the armies of the Vale. Robin Arryn does.

He's the puppet master. What's the difference?

well, the only difference is that robin could do something rash that foils lf's plan

Sure, but as far as things are going at the moment, I'm not sure what point Fred is getting at.

That the Vale army has no loyalty to Littlefinger. He can't just use it whatever way he likes.

Oh, however will he find a way to manipulate the powerful 12-year-old Lord of the Vale into getting what he wants?

As far as criticisms coming from folk who wouldn't pass highschool English goes, I have a degree in English and my criticism is strwightforward: sansa's actions do not match her characters motivation, which is in contradiction to everything about the show (which is about motives, aims, ambitions to some extent). If people want to say she 'just didn't' that's fine, if they want to say she didn't to help the show dramatically, that's fine. Bu if they want to claim that it matches her motivations they need to explain why.

He's the puppet master. What's the difference?

― Evan, Friday, 24 June 2016 02:57 (10 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2otVBGcG1kw