Prince RIP

Prince also outsold Bowie and Brown worldwide.

xpost

Another difference is that both Bowie and James Brown went through long stretches of audience indifference/dropping out/losing interest, but Prince was never, even at his worst, less than compelling. He always sold out his shows and could pack an arena at will. Even when he was bad he was never terrible, never at less than the peak of his powers, as a singer, bandleader, performer. He had no decline. And absolutely no one expected him to be gone this early.

There are (or were) whole generations (at least in the US) who only knew Brown as "the guy in the hot tub skit" or "the 'Living in America' guy."

Hmm, when was the last major music death of an artist who had no real decline, in their health, as a performer ... ? Grant McLennan, for sure, but I don't know if he counts as major to most.

Prince was never, even at his worst, less than compelling...Even when he was bad he was never terrible, never at less than the peak of his powers, as a singer, bandleader, performer. He had no decline.

Dude, come on. There is a fucking ton of dross in his catalog. The great stuff is undeniable, but the sheer volume of dull-to-dire stuff is just as breathtaking in its way.

i think he means as a live act?

xp yeah growing up in the North West of England i'd genuinely never heard of Brown until Living In America. shit even Bowie wasn't that well known there, i'd never heard 'Heroes' for example until i was 16 and saw an advert for the CHANGES Best Of compilation. no-one in my school liked any music at all so i guess it isn't typical.

Oh I agree about Prince's high visibility. And, say, Springsteen and Madonna will generate equal if not greater tributes, reflections, etc. What I think sets the tone of stuff around Prince apart a little -- even in the tributes from other musicians -- is the almost supernatural sense of his talent.

Yeah, like Springsteen can play a pretty decent solo, but nobody's going to go on at length about him as a guitarist.

i think he means as a live act?

OK, that makes a little more sense. I never got to see James Brown live until the early '90s, and it wasn't depressing, exactly, but it wasn't 1969, either.

New village voice is worth having for beautiful full page Kyle baker interior illo and a great pc about 'prince's women' by porochista khakpour. Cover illo is just ok though.

You mean this?

"He had no decline"

i mean, he was still great, without a doubt, still an amazing musician, maybe even a better musician and singer actually, but comparing a prince show from the 80s to one in the last decade, its no contest which decade had the better tours (or bands, or stage design, concepts, ideas, etc etc).

thanks for posting that d'angelo cover, real chills and teared up a little when D did

Prince didn't get to make albums up to when he was 56, retire for 10 years then come back when he found he didn't have long left, and so on.

(I'm also glad that Bowie didn't die during that time off, making that song for Ricky Gervais the last thing he did).

On whether he had a decline or not... I'd reshape it from is, 'when did Prince stop being the centre of the zeitgeist?' to 'when did Prince cease having the capacity to surprise me?' and the answer to the latter is he never did. Even at his worst, and by heavens I was there through all the worst, I was impressed and could be surprised by some part of his work. I mean, and this an example everyone is going to get, he released Black Sweat at the age of 46. And here he was one of the more virtuoso, gifted musicians who has ever lived and with this genius he exercised restraint? Even if there was nothing else, that's enough to surprise and delight me.

Singles Jukebox did a series of eulogies/appreciations over the weekend btw and most if not all of them are CRUCIAL
http://www.thesinglesjukebox.com/?p=20895

i kinda stopped listening. i heard some stuff here and there but i think the last album i bought was batman. i definitely liked some of those early 90's singles. and i'm sure i missed lots of good moments. but i am not a completist even when i really love an artist or band. i always wished him well. he was prince! what ever prince wanted to do was fine by me.

I found a blog that had Lovesexy broken into its component tracks, plus the B-sides to the singles, and when I listened to it that way it was a much stronger album than I remembered it being. I think the annoyance factor of its being one 45-minute thing hurt it for me. (Although I originally owned it on cassette, so who knows.)

man that D'Angelo performance, fuck

if there was one area Prince showed no signs of decline in it was his chops as a performer. his material might not have been up to snuff, but his voice, guitar playing etc. remained undiminished.

I actually made my own tracked version of lovesexy by downloading a .cue file written by someone on a Prince forum, then using it to split a lossless file taken from the single track cd

man, how have I never heard the "Irresistible Bitch" B-side before now, my god

lots of these 1999-era B-sides are amazing. "Horny Toad"!!!

Been going through the discography this week (like with Bowie, I was mostly only familiar w the hits), and having a lot of fun. About his live performances, just watched him doing Billy Cobham's Stratus from a few years ago, basically flawless. He was one of those guys who justified the cliche "could do it in his sleep". It's kind of funny we live in a world where people still have the gall to revere musicians like Eric Clapton when Prince was there, so clearly the elephant in any room where he stood. Hard to argue why he shouldn't go down as the best musician of not just his generation, but the whole modern era (ie, 20th Century and after).

"if there was one area Prince showed no signs of decline in it was his chops as a performer. his material might not have been up to snuff, but his voice, guitar playing etc. remained undiminished."

yeah i dont think that while my guitar solo could have come in the 80s. technically he got better and better. though i think he ended up sounding a bit more like his influences as he got older, and a bit less like the prince sound most people associate with him. if theres a big celeb tribute to him, it would be amazing if santana could play at it (people often mention hendrix, and he sounded more hendrix-y as he got older, and ive seen some ppl here say eddie hazel, but santana, esp in the 80s, was prob princes biggest key influence, or at least the one he would mention).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-2nH8LTg8SU Irresistible Bitch / Possessed Melody live.

the guitar break at the end of Let's Go Crazy (one of the greatest moments in his catalog) has always felt like a Hazel homage to me, it feels like it was lifted right out of Super Stupid or Comin' Round the Mountain

xp

im prob the only person in the world who found the hit n run show i saw, not boring, but a bit too solo-happy, just solo after solo, in a slightly leaden - to my ears at least - hard rock trio format (though i liked the undertaker session he did in that same format in the 90s, maybe the band was better than this one).

but there was one point when he was just doing his sampler and keyboard routine, and then he triggered the loop for forever in my life, and started riffing on the bass, he started using some pedal while playing, and took it somewhere totally improvised (also quite weird and sort of abrasive sounding), and it was the best thing in the whole show (apart from the piano medley). in the later years, it was little moments like that, where you could see a small spark suddenly come alive, away from his more trad 'real music yall!' moments that made his shows for me.

eddie hazel, michael hampton, idk

We've written a lot about his guitar skills, but how would y'all rate his piano, bass, and drum skills?

I think his skills on everything but drums were ace. Drums, he was good but nothing special (apparently Morris Day is/was a killer drummer).

if there was one area Prince showed no signs of decline in it was his chops as a performer. his material might not have been up to snuff, but his voice, guitar playing etc. remained undiminished.

Yeah, this is exactly what I meant. As a recording artist, sure, a huge hunk of his catalog is worthless, in my opinion, though never because he declined as a singer/guitarist/producer, just because (often) he switched tacks/styles/bands and so on. But while his performances changed, he remained totally on-point, unless, for whatever reason, he didn't feel like doing what he did best (i.e. ceding singing to backing vocalists, playing covers, not playing guitar, all things he did or did not do in recent years for some reason). And when Prince was great, it was never "he was great for an old person," or "welcome back," and so on. It was all on par with tremendous expectations.

http://www.nbcnews.com/news/nbcblk/time-i-opened-tower-records-early-so-prince-could-shop-n560896

I've seen him at an after show play bass on Days of Wild and I would, without hesitation, rate him as a bassist. It didn't feel like there was a plan or a setlist, he just wandered over and tapped her on the shoulder and took her bass and played and then everyone in the room had to relocate their knees and pick themselves off the floor. You know that feeling when the bottom of your eyes widen without your eyebrows even having time to go up? That.

piano, bass, and drum skills?

I rate him pretty highly, just based on his recorded output, on piano and especially synthesizer. Not Stevie Wonder-level but v close. On bass he was quite good, drums = proficient.

his drumming is really underrated - he did the first three songs on parade in sequence IIRC, in one take. he wasnt super flashy, but i like his drumming on dirty mind a lot. hes got a certain personality as a drummer, a bit like stevie wonder.

any guy that played the bassline of lets work is ok with me. but im not sure you would think of there being a 'prince bassline'. IMO he was more interesting for what he did with bass, esp slap bass, than actual fluid basslines.

im not an expert but hes obviously a great, if not distinct pianist. i think this might be the main criticism of prince as a musician, that hes technically astonishing at everything he played, but perhaps lacks a concrete identity, in the way that say, santana or hendrix did.

Me: "Mr. Nelson, may I ask you a question?"

Prince: "Mr. Nelson? I don't see my father in here, HAHAHA! What is it dear?"

Me: "What is that scent you're wearing, it's amazing!"

Prince: "Magic."

this guy

yeah I totally rate his synth and programming skills, especially on 1999. Anyone found good live synth clips?

BTW, a lot of guitar friends of mine don't really rate Prince that highly as a lead guitarist. I should say, they think he's a really good guitarist, just not that special/original (the distortion, wah etc. does a lot of the heavy lifting). But what blows them away is his subtle rhythm playing, like the stuff at the end of "Lady Cab Driver."

There's some Prince organ/synth soloing here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0BuCppIjBKg

Prince as a guitarist is pretty identifiable to me, maybe not on other instruments, but for someone like him, just as other songwriters work with session guys or a band to support their vision, I view his instrumental skills as support for himself -- the overall vision was his genius, and his singing and guitar playing (which are arguably the same kind of gift) the most immediately distinctive.

BTW, a lot of guitar friends of mine don't really rate Prince that highly as a lead guitarist. I should say, they think he's a really good guitarist, just not that special/original (the distortion, wah etc. does a lot of the heavy lifting). But what blows them away is his subtle rhythm playing, like the stuff at the end of "Lady Cab Driver."

his synths and drum programming in the 80s were incredible. 1999 is so brilliant because of that.

the guitar work on SOTT in the SOTT movie makes me wish prince got into alt/noise-rock more :)

yeah let's not forget: the other instrument besides guitar on which Prince was a master was the Linn drum

yeah i wish he found a new drum machine in the 90s to work with rather than the NPG

"But what blows them away is his subtle rhythm playing, like the stuff at the end of "Lady Cab Driver"

prince is one of my fave rhythm guitarists ever. so, so tight and incredible. the little choppy parts (which he didnt play i know, but im sure he told his guitarist what to play) in that live version of hot thing posted upthread are amazing.

But what blows them away is his subtle rhythm playing, like the stuff at the end of "Lady Cab Driver."

the economy of his rhythm parts is remarkable, compact but with tons of distinctive fluorishes

yeah let's not forget: the other instrument besides guitar on which Prince was a master was the Linn drum

777-9311 alone earns him a spot on the drum programming Mount Rushmore

Yeah, I with you. Here's a guy welcome on anyone's list of the best lead guitarists of all time who's content and disciplined enough to play rhythm on any given song to the point that for decades you had to make a case in the public consciousness for his guitar chops. I've always been amazed by the rhythm work on 1999. And, as I said upthread, here's a guy who could do anything the instrument was capable of but then played like he did on The Cross?

i wish he found a new drum machine in the 90s to work with rather than the NPG

^^^this. relistening to the NPG stuff man I really just hate a lot of those players, including and maybe especially the drummer, it is a real bummer he couldn't keep some version of the Revolution together.

I never saw a Prince concer live. Well, I kind of did. I was with friends at Coachella festival. It was before it completely turned into the circus it is now, but it was well on its way. And someone who's thankfully not in my life anymore really had to leave, so we left less than halfway into Prince's performance.

What I saw was amazing. That show has been uploaded in the last week, and it's how I remember it -- Prince was a little late taking the stage, but once he did, it was electric. I was wondering who would be in the live lineup, and the first part of the show was half-introduction, half showcase. Morris Day! Sheila E!

I still get the chills thinking about how crazy it was, and I barely saw anything at all. I'd planned to go see him the next time I could, and I completely failed to do so.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RPCbe_rFwc8 Counterpoint to Prince not being able to play lead.