Bowie's Outside: C or D?

like i enjoyed that last byrne/eno record but i think if it had been presold as 'get ready for another my life eating bush' i would have been let down. unfair to hold an album's hype against it i know but it definitely influenced my perspective, was something i had to work past.

I bought Buddha of Suburbia the other day, too. There aren't any threads about it that I can see on here. Any major discussion in any other threads that anyone knows of? I'm very intrigued by it. It does in retrospect seem to sit very neatly between BTWN and this.

it's really good (buddha). title track is one of his best songs and all the instrumentals are super interesting; if not quite on par with side 2 of low or heroes, they show bowie really stretching out and doing something different.

Buddha>Outside.

I think Buddha is one of the reasons people were let down/confused by Outside. Buddha (along with BTWN) broke his losing streak - I remember at the time people really excited it marked a return to "experimental" Bowie - and then came the announcement he was reconvening with Eno (on his own winning streak as producer) for a full collaboration. And then the album was this unfocused sprawl with a crazy concept that embraced both weird improv and then fashionably ugly electronica/industrial tropes. I recall my introduction to "Outside" via the end credits to "Seven" the week before.

No one heard Buddha at the time though, did they?

I kinda admire the fact that Bowie used electronica/industrial tropes, and later on some jungle tropes... could you imagine McCartney/Jagger/Ferry going "jungle"!?

It was hard to find. I think it was pulled in England, sneaked out in December 1993? In the USA it didn't get a release until fall '95.

I mean, christ, the Stones' idea of broadening their palette at the time was getting in The Dust Brothers and ripping off k.d. lang!

It's true, trip hop seemed more Mick's speed. Though Bowie dipped into that, too.

i can imagine ferry going trip-hop

he flirted with it mildly on his '90s solo albums.

No one heard Buddha at the time though, did they?

Got an MM review I'm pretty sure. I've heard good things about the series itself. Kurieshi wrote a piece that ran in the Times but (precisely because it's in the Times and thus paywalled) I've not read it beyond the introduction.

http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/arts/article4662362.ece

Never cared about the story or reading the liner notes or anything, but I love the spoken tracks. He does good voices over nice music and I like the mangled sci-fi syntax (though I'm sad to learn the "something is about to be heard" I've always got before Hallo Spaceboy is a mishearing.

The two songs people often mention as classics, Have Not Been to Oxford Town and Strangers When We Meet, are maybe the most underwhelming for me on this record.

I love A Small Plot of Land most. It could easily fit on Blackstar - very similar to Tis A Pity She Was a Whore.

I had to buy buddha as an import when it was released; yeah it got no airplay or attention in the US outside of bowie fans.

Wrote this on the RIP thread because it felt more appropriate there but selfishly I want to talk about this record.

A lot of has been written about Bowie’s legacy since his passing, but for me, the thing I keep coming back to is the fact, or perception anyway, that Bowie was /the/ guy who spotted trends before they were trends and brought them into the mainstream. /Outside/ very clearly—and very self-consciously—was designed to explore that side of Bowie's persona. Yes, it was a celebration of “outsider” art and the sordid characters that produce it, but even more than that, a tribute to Bowie's own mythology for championing, popularizing, consuming, and, ultimately, discarding those artists and movements before moving on to something else.

Candidly, I think Bowie understood the significance of that role—as Lester Bangs wrote about /Young Americans,/ Bowie's best work often seemed to be when he failed at something so wildly that it became something else entirely—but don’t think he was ever entirely satisfied playing it. Deep down, Bowie really did wish he could be a pop hermit like Scott Walker or a performance artist like Chris Burden physically harming himself for his art. But as his copious interviews on the talk show circuit reveal, he also wanted to be loved, admired and appreciated.

I realize now that this is one of the reasons I have always found /Outside/ so fascinating, because it not only self-consciously exploits that tension — but the project itself was consumed by it, transforming from the ambitious, careening, improvised opera about “outsider" art it was initially conceived as into a messy, overstuffed “gothic non-linear hyper-cycle” into an art rock concept album, the subject of which is "David Bowie."

That’s why, even tho PAotD judges /Outside/ to be something of a failure … I’m not sure it actually is. The songs are great. The bootlegged /Leon/ sessions that started it off are completely unique. The story is intentionally batshit and incomprehensible. Not everything works and some of it is baffling, but it’s never boring. As a result, the project as a whole feels like…pretty much everything Bowie ever did. And on those terms, I feel like it has to be judged as one of his most important releases.

I love A Small Plot of Land most. It could easily fit on Blackstar - very similar to Tis A Pity She Was a Whore.
― Eyeball Kicks, Tuesday, February 2, 2016 10:51 PM (seven months ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Donny McCaslin covers it (and "Warszawa") on his upcoming album.
http://www.ew.com/article/2016/07/29/donny-mccaslin-small-plot-land-cover

This is on Spotify. It's a nice thread from the Blackstar era to its roots in Bowie's catalogue. I like the instrumental sax solo section, perhaps unsurprisingly. Makes me think that some enterprising person could make an interesting cover of the whole record.

Tho it was recorded later in NYC, 'Small Plot' always struck me as a bit of a head nod to the Leon sessions (PAotD agrees). Joey Baron and Mike Garson are amazing on it. There's another mix of it that Eno supposedly did on the Basquiat OST that mixes them both out – but I prefer the original.

Listening to this again after a long while, I'd say this is up there with Blackstar as one of his very best post-Let's Dance LP's.

Or "classic", in other words.

no doubt, IMO anyway. I can kind of see how people find it overly indulgent and maybe, story-wise, even silly, but I really like basically all of it.

The "indulgent" nature of it is a huge part of why it rules so much, IMO.

Combined with Leon Sessions, maybe some other working pieces and anything that survived from the aborted followups, this would make a *great* boxed set. I wonder if Eno, who has fashioned himself in the press as something of a a keeper of Bowie's legacy since his passing, would consider curating such a thing.

Dud, but I appreciate the effort.

Classic as far as I'm concerned. Outside is my second favourite Bowie album (Diamond Dogs is no. 1).

It might come off as somewhat indulgent but it's so energetic and diverse that it also sounds to me like Bowie, and everyone else involved, were having a real blast with it.

POOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOR

dunce

Nice piece about this era of Bowie’s career:

David Bowie: No Control in RECORD COLLECTOR PRESENTS BOWIE December 2016 #BrianEno #Outside #PetShopBoys https://t.co/eJ7W9S0M1b pic.twitter.com/bw1xbSvGvh

— Brian Eno (@dark_shark) January 7, 2018

Tennant's talked about that remix often, but I like the thought of him being nervous about Bowie's approval, like a schoolboy who's disappointed his favourite schoolteacher.

Anyone read the Swollen Appendix book?

Other thought about Outside: (for me, anyway) it's the only bowie record that *needs* gabrels, whereas everywhere else i kinda just tolerate him or wish he wouldn't ruin the song by doing that

Anyone read the Swollen Appendix book?

― Chuck_Tatum,

Essential reading -- lots of offhand sundry insights, reflections on his urine, valentines to his wife and daughter, revelatory bits about recording James, Bowie, U2..

For those who have HBO, there is a new Bowie documentary on tomorrow, focusing on the end of his life, The Last 5 Years.

xpost

Turns out it's out of print and sixty quid on eBay. Used to see that thing all the time in used bookstores. Oh well.

I read A Year With Swollen Appendices!

I am a secret enormous James fan and mostly absorbed the parts about that band. I'd been frustrated with all of Saul's violin contributions to that band and was delighted to read passages of Eno slagging him off as a musician, heh

I don't remember much about what he said about Bowie tho, oddly enough-- probably because it was just uniformly positive?

This album, to me, is his actual "best since Scary Monsters" ... Blackstar is even better, though.

That Bowie doc is okay, I watched it on a long flight a few months back. The best thing about it is just him being in a good mood and goofing around at truck stops and stuff.

There's a quote on the back of the Eno book I think about Bowie calling him one day to express admiration for the new Scott Walker album, which at the time was Tilt, and Eno being relieved that it was totally different from what they were up to.

Also, re Gabrels, I hate this dude's guitar playing, even the sound of his guitar. I much prefer the boring ambient stuff David Torn provided Bowie.

Bowie might have been the world's only Reeves Gabrels fan.

Robert Smith seemed to like him for a minute. Or is he still in the Cure?

I've always kinda of loved this ridiculous record. The "Leon Suites" boot is fantastic, just got hipped to it

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=06wXwgGpO9c

xpost -- He's still in the Cure.

And I have to say when I saw them last year that Gabrels's tendency towards 'let me art-deconstruct this 'solo' you speak of' has shifted more towards actually good, creative solos that fit well within the arrangements.

so people do learn then

Anyway how dare you mock someone who found love

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/01/06/fashion/weddings/maybe-in-another-life-becomes-now.html

(Seriously, this is a story about Gabrels from the other day.)

I just saw that on my twitter feed the other day. Good for him. I guess.

Remember when this came out some review describing "another unlovely Gabrels solo" and the phrase has stayed with me to this day.

Baby Grace is the victim

Reeves Gabrels is my favourite of Bowie's guitarists tbh!

Also for a relatively hideous middle-aged man he makes a dapper older gentleman

This is his actual "best since Scary Monsters", IMO.

Between the players (Joey Baron!) and Eno on board as a full collaborator, during his '90s imperial phase (Achtung Baby!, Laid, Wah Wah, Bright Red, Zooropa, Passengers) this came as and remains to me a huge disappointment. Lots of great ideas, little I want to return to with any regularity.