Steven Spielberg - classic or dud

No, I mean, Duel was a movie that he made for TV. But he also did a couple of episode for hire regular TV things.

yeesh, if there's any director who isn't all about "the perfect nuclear family setup" it's spielberg -- "close encounters" is basically about a guy who abandons his family, "e.t." is about a lonely kid, the fathers in all of his films tend to be shitty and inattentive or non-existent.

he used to be anyway, in the director commentary for CE, he said he wouldn't have made that movie today, due to his feelings about family. Which basically tells me everything I need to know about modern Spielberg

Having not rewatched this shit (yet), isn't the point of Close Encounters the creation of a new perfect family? Wait, and E.T., it's all about building a new family unit with an alien, I am totally ready to accept that I am wrong here, til I get round to these. But I wasn't suggesting these films initially portrayed a perfect family, just that that seems to be Spielberg's ideal, his happy ending.

in Lincoln and BOS the dads are decidedly chilly.

To me, the point of that movie is tied up in the "when you wish upon a star" motive that runs through the score -- ie, Dreyfuss' character was always someone who didn't quite fit into his own life, and even tho he didn't know how or why, he took his chance to follow a dream by leaving the Earth (and his family) behind. It's a bittersweet message at best, but I've always thought it was one of Spielberg's most honest depictions of humanity on film

xpost No way. If anything, they're all about escape from unhappy, boring lives, and a willingness to chuck the family under the bus to do it. They're like Springsteen's "Hungry Heart:" pretty dark shit hidden in a pop song.

I will give my opinion on Close Encounters on eh Thursday, was there different versions of that? Like a directors cut or summat? Don't tell me I need to visit Family to accomplish this project...

yeah, there was a special edition that featured a few new scenes in the body of the movie, but the main change was actually showing the inside of the ship at the end. Which frankly, you don't need to see and kind of spoils the mystery imo

I want to say there are three cuts now?

he wouldn't have made that movie today, due to his feelings about family. Which basically tells me everything I need to know about modern Spielberg

criticism by express psychoanalysis sure beats thinkin'

or watchin'

Oh OK, I don't need to see Dreyfuss's new(clear) family.

I mean, I'm kidding, but that's 4 on my list chronologically, I recall it being annoying, but I am open to being proved wrong (as I admitted to for Jaws). And I like the first 3, Close Encounters is the first "Spielberg" Spielberg, I am open to re-evaluation, if it means Morbs will be nice to me..

except when a new film comes out i havent got the energy for this anymore.

or watchin'

it's mostly shorthand for messageboard talkin'. I've seen enough modern era Spielberg to know I don't find his movies very interesting or deep or emotionally engaging -- when I heard the quote in the CE DVD feature, it confirmed that feeling, and gave me a kind of retrospective, deja vu-ish feeling of "oh of course he wouldn't have made the movie like that today, because none of his movies are anywhere near as ambiguous or ambitious anymore".

A.I.

lincoln is pretty ambiguous and quite dark in some ways imo

yeah, Munich isn't as ambitious as his early genre films! whaaa?

I should watch AI again. I recall being disappointed, but maybe years removed from having to wonder what Kubrick would have done will make it easier to watch with fresh eyes.

AI is heartbreaking in a really ambitious sorry of way imo. Like, equally smart and sentimental.

Kubrick gave AI to Spielberg (w/ same basic scenario), his death is not the reason he didn't direct it. (years of posts about this if you need em)

AI is chilly as hell, the sheen of spielberg's sentimentality just makes it even more brutal

wheeeeeere is the sentimentality in that film?

in the fake feelgood ending

You've gotta be kidding. Do you understand what's even happening in it?

It's also in the Kubrick treatment, every bit of it.

AI

The think AI is hardcore cold, but it's pervaded by at least an eerie simulacrum of (not a pejorative) sentimentality. I mean, it is about a lost child looking for his mother, guided in part by his teddy bear ...

Also one of the few movies to consistently reduce me to tears.

Boy, I can't remember anything about Catch Me if You Can beyond the title sequence (which was great).

It's pretty good! It's got one of the few great recent non-kooky Walken roles.

Josh otm about the simulacrum of sentimentality. Munich also boasts a queasy, compelling tonal mixture. His late pictures have been fascinating even when they don't fully succeed.

Will check AI this wkd again, because I would certainly *like* to like it. Funny, CMIYC was probably the last Spielberg I enjoyed straight away (and have to back to Jurassic Park before that), even if I didn't think it was a "great" film.

I am open to re-evaluation, if it means Morbs will be nice to me..

― Jonathan Hellion Mumble, Friday, January 29, 2016 12:59 PM (1 hour ago)

I generally value Morbs' contrarianism on this site, but you're chasing a holy grail that just don't exist, man...

it's contrarianism to believe Spielberg is a great filmmaker?

Part of being a great anything, I think, is to include mystifying and garish passages in your work.

No, I meant his general ilx curmudgeonliness. I agree with him on Spielberg.

http://www.sembo.se/media/8238016/nice_950x350_top.jpg

i'm generally a spielbs fan but holy wow has he produced some bad shit over the past fifteen years. he's had a pretty decent directorial run, though i missed his one-two punch of tin tin and war horse.

Tin Tin was fun. I couldn't get through War Horse.

Best Spielberg = 'Murder by the Book'

i had some problems with Munich but overall it's a pretty essential film in the '70s geopolitics/terrorism genre. that and Carlos are sort of the ultimate double feature.

War of the Worlds has some "eh" moments but it's just generally great

xxpost

Haha! Not even that great of a Columbo episode, alas.

AI
Catch Me If You Can
The Terminal
WOTW
Munich
Indiana Jones and the Kingdom of the Crystal Skull
War Horse
Tin Tin
Lincoln
Bridge of Spies

Only one of those movies looks like it's running in place (and I don't care for The Terminal). They've all got flaws of one sort. Still, an amazing new millennium run.

Tin Tin was so much better than I expected, tons of fun. Loved Lincoln and AI. CMIYC also tons of fun. I forgot to see The Terminal and haven't seen the new one, but seriously, if that list is supposed to mark his fall, man, what a fall. Because even the flawed ones are majority solid, imo. Like, WOTW, what it gets wrong it gets so wrong that it pushes the illusion it's not a good film, but that's just maybe 20% of it - the very end and Tim Robbins. Because the rest is really, really strong. (see also: Minority Report).

Spielberg is so good that he's entered the high standard trap. "Yeah, the first 10 or so movies he made were almost all great, with many iconic masterpieces, and several of the films he produced in that era are almost as good, and sure, the next 10 or so movies have had their share of masterpieces and icons, and yeah, sometimes he was working so fast he released a film a year, sometimes two films in a single year, and OK, most of his recent output has been really solid, too, sometimes great, and even when he's off his films are rarely less than confident and competent, and almost always worthwhile, but other than that, what has he done?"

yeah, I forgot Minority Report! What a run.

Privileging early Spielberg above mid-late Spielberg just sounds like millennials goin' OH I WATCHED INDY, JAWS AND E.T. A HUNDRED TIMES WHEN I WAS 8

I saw all those plus CE3K in their theatrical runs and was happy. Then I grew up and so did he (tho E.T. is already a rich work for adults).

I'm not sure I'd privilege early Spielberg, per se, just that his initial run is pretty unimpeachable. It's not until the 90s that he has his first real misses (Hook, Lost World) and even the latter there has its moments. But certainly his mid to later career is every bit worthy of discussion/thought/debate as his initial stuff. He's like Hitchcock in that regard.

Always was released in 1989.