DOOM: Classic or Dud?

very visceral feeling on firing for sure. it's funny, but even with the force feedback and vibrating controllers of today, that thing really seemed more.. tactile?

i like DOOM II's levels more. DOOM has a lot of good marine base on mars-style levels where you are working through these weird techno mazes with the occasional weird room with demonic symbols in it. DOOM 2 really felt like you had entered these other realms. the final levels of DOOM II are some of my favorite ever. level 26 might be my favorite just based on style. you are in these industrial-style weird caged walkways constructed in these weird caverns and maybe built to cross pass the boiling lava that bubbles beneath.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OGYbwJYB3xg

yea those final doom ii levels are amazing

not to be confused with Final Doom :)

def not lol

i don't even know what that is lol

Final Doom is a first-person shooter video game released in 1996. The game uses the engine, items, and characters from Doom II: Hell on Earth, and was distributed as an official id Software product.

Final Doom consists of two 32-level megawads (level files), TNT: Evilution by TeamTNT, and The Plutonia Experiment by the Casali brothers. TNT: Evilution features a new soundtrack, while The Plutonia Experiment uses music from Doom and Doom II. In addition to the PC version, Final Doom was also released for the PlayStation; that version included a selection of Final Doom and Master Levels for Doom II levels combined into one game.

Final Doom is levels not made by the iD team but by modders and DOOM fans who were contacted by iD in part as a response to the rampant bootlegging of DOOM add-on CD-ROMs.

http://cdn.overclock.net/a/af/af203014_972067336-00.jpeg

Maybe the most famous of the unofficial DOOM add-ons.

morbid 90s kid post: inhumanly, columbine shooter eric harris' late-period single-player doom wads replace the gun sounds, i guess because they weren't enough like ejaculating death. the wads are also, i can report, unfair.

great point about doom ii's levels. knew exactly what you meant about the caged walkways before even seeing the youtube thumbs. i do think there were some great ones sprinkled in the later doom episodes but i didn't replay those as much and they're not as vivid. the skimpy 'story' attached to doom ii also did a surprising amount of work in cementing the sense of a real journey to more and more disturbed, unsettled and dangerous places, combined with the evocative level titles. "i'm descending through the Underhalls," i'd think. i do think both I and II struggle a bit to keep the momentum/intensity going throughout - in particular i remember the "city" levels of Doom II feeling a bit draggy, or there were just too many of them. i like everything they did to try and play different cards through different level design... some slow slogs, some intense onslaughts, etc. but i feel like they should have saved up a few more suprises - more monsters that you don't see until a certain point, etc. final boss is also 50/50 with me, cool concept and definitely 'bigger' than anything else but too much of a nintendo-boss puzzle/gimmick kind of thing.

music also an enormously important part of why these are so awesome, obviously. pretty sure i've posted about that many times on other threads - very formative to a lot of my music tastes later on.

oh man, that "D! Zone" cover! so evocative of a very particular period in packaging/design.

i didn't expect to find myself stoned and watching playthroughs of Eric Harris' DOOM levels tonight but here i am

Shareware you would see at the local Wal-Mart/Target in a vertical software slice

the city levels in DOOM II were draggy yes. it was an odd dip towards a kind of RPG or open world approach. a modern comparison may be the ruined city shells in fallout.

i made a DOOM level based on my school's floorplan. i didn't put enemies in it tho. i didn't really texture it either cos mapping it was a lot of work and it was not very interesting for a DOOM level. i know there are lots of kids that did the same. at the time I was taking an architecture class and had access to this amazing customizable 3d tool and was making all kind of levels based on movies and things. my big project was Stargate DOOM. i had this Stargate CD-ROM that was basically an interactive encyclopedia with images i was taking right from the movie for the game. the bad guys were the hawk-headed soldiers, you shot bolts of light with a magic staff, and the levels were the pyramid and various tombs. i had some sand textures and was trying to make sand dunes with lots of sectors going up like steps but there were a lot of limits to what you could do with those old tools.

and i loved Star Wars DOOM that was the first one that blew my mind

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aKrdiGkMN_g

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KXq1Jrh-YGY

Aliens TC was even better than regular DOOM at times.

oooh, will definitely be sampling:
http://www.wolfensteingoodies.com/archives/olddoom/music.htm

Old news, but needs to be mentioned:

https://youtu.be/8Y3RWlDz_AA

Oh: classic, of course.

http://www.pcgamer.com/john-romero-has-just-released-a-new-doom-wad/

about to play this. can't wait! this is a total surprise

i have to hand it to him, well done, he doesn't seem to have lost his touch. the level design is INSANE (upon opening the map I was like, holy moly) twisting and turning and having fake-outs and traps around every corner. when he did some Let's Plays of DOOM levels recently Romero explained that he designed rooms to take full advantage of the odd treatment of height in the engine. there is one spot where you exit a keyed door and look out to see nothing but toxic green acid. if you are using mouselook you can look down and see there is a tiny platform for you to jump to directly underneath. similarly there are spots where the ceiling cuts just short of your viewing range, and you can see enemies lurking around on the floor above you. so great.

i like the motif of having the weird sketchy red markings that harm the player. this level takes place at the end of Episode I, where you just reach the entrance to Hell from your moonbase. Romero has included some really cool setpiece rooms designed around this, especially that final room w the two barons. it was in the original DOOM (made by someone other than Romero, and frankly, worked perfectly as an appetizer by holding back) and the level follows the same narrative, but the art in that main room has to be seen to be believed. after winding your way through ledges on the edge of acid pits and ambushing enemies in claustrophobic spaces, reaching this big open room is an awesome experience.

Am I the only one interested in this? Lot of suspicion surrounding it because id/Beth held back review copies, most likely spooked by the (unfair imo) evisceration the multiplayer beta got, but early response to the single player has been OTT enthusiastic. Will be playing this weekend.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=anrvBD4aTGY

how many guns can you carry at once?

if it is >=8 distinct weapons i will purchase this game

Pretty sure you can carry all of them at once and there are > 8

Going for a return to FPS basics, which is exactly what I've been wanting.

Well, plenty of new stuff like upgrading yr weapons and armor and flashy melee, but a return to no regenerating health, no cover mechanics, no reloading, no carry limitations, etc.

Listened to some of the soundtrack today at work and it's pretty righteous.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ua-f0ypVbPA

yes this is getting lots of praise for the singleplayer, comparisons to Wolfenstein new order, so i caved and just ordered it... if its genuinely that fun i have no idea what bethesda are doing marketing wise

if it's half as good as the new order i'll be happy - that was one of the most pleasant surprises of the last few years for me

looks dope but im pretty sure im not cut out for fast twitchy fps :(

Just put in 2 hours. This is a blast. Kinda regretting making plans to go out tonight.

ahahaha i love this

feels like it was dropped in from an alternate reality where plodding military man shooters never took over. modern gameplay amenities (3 different types of upgrade tree, for example) mixed with fast movement, wide open level design, colored keycards, and crunchy industrial metal.

map creation/community content stuff seems ok, only messed with it a little. played a couple rounds of multiplayer which felt better than the beta but is definitely more chaos than skill (for me, at least). fun tho.

pretty good shotgun too

ahahaha i love this

LOL OTM. Was by myself grinning, laughing, and saying "aw fuck yeah!" to nobody like a total dork weirdo. This is crazy fun. Exactly what this genre needs.

The ~synergy~ of the melee to get health, chainsaw to get ammo, rush-n-attack to survive is really brilliant and satisfying. After a full on brawl your hands are shaking.

lol at the calm robot voice intoning 'demonic presence at unsafe levels' over and over

this is fun as hell so far, but getting a lot of distracting screen tearing on my ps4 - maybe the giant patch i'm currently downloading will help?

Yeah, I think the patch should solve all of that. Also playing on PS4, really impressed with the graphics overall.

the melee kill for health mechanic is swiped from the (also excellent) SPACE MARINE, the chainsaw-for-ammo balancing mechanic is a pretty brilliant addition

patch fixed the screen-tearing, seems rock-solid now

this is amazing - can't understand why review copies weren't sent out ahead of time. I can already see myself doing levels over again to get bonuses.

also super-glad you can widen the field of view

admit with no pride that i find the concept of an old-school twitch shooter played with thumbsticks heretical (hexenal?) but uh stop making me wanna drop $$ on the pc version of this

glad this stuff is coming back. the free, community-reliant new unreal tournament is not bad at all despite (because of?) not seeming to have much corporate attention paid it.

(adam+i talked abt this upthread i think but the original doom's control scheme is flawless in a way even mouselook, let alone thumbsticks, never managed to become -- but of course you can't have the original doom's controls without the original doom's strange, illusive approach to the z-axis.)

Original DOOM control, like that of its predecessors, is so elemental and unrealistic but so playable - it's like Galaga or something in that the movement and shooting of these enemies turns out to work really well with two hands at the board and your brain never once is troubled by not being able to look up or down, and your aim automagically correcting for enemies above and below your line of sight. It might as well be played in Flatland and if the map mode showed enemies and their attacks it could almost be played as such.

Not quite related, but I was also thinking how smart the theming was, over and above the designers' obvious affection for horror and scifi cliches; a fairly detail-free, nonfunctional level design just glides right by as weird space or demonic places. You're a grunt, they're just spaces to be in; a different theme that demanded more window-dressing to be convincing would just induce a whole lot of wasted effort and probably overstrain the technology re: the number of sprites and textures onscreen at any one time.

It might as well be played in Flatland and if the map mode showed enemies and their attacks it could almost be played as such.

otm

despite its Visceral Immersion there is an abstraction to doom that really stands out from this distance. controls and movement have nothing to do with being a human; environments have almost nothing to do (less and less, as hell deepens) with real places. funny to compare the moral panic over it to the distinct lack of moral panic over the numbing realism of call of imperialism. i guess novelty did most of it and satan did the rest (plus i guess everyone's been distracted by GTA).

hope the level design on this new one is great. strange to think that romero-style level design -- mazes, secret doors, "how do i even get out there?"/"holy shit i'm out here!" -- largely disappeared. dark forces/jedi knight had it, but even half-life is almost as much just-a-ride as a call of duty (and for half-life 2, drop the almost). suspect the closest thing to it at the turn of the century was deus ex, which you can play like doom, if you want; nowadays i dunno -- i'm sure there's something i haven't played.

(and really it's not in deus ex, which is too busy being Real to try for anything like the density of romero's levels -- aha.)

so it's notable+funny that

a fairly detail-free, nonfunctional level design

as a collection of textures/objects/interactivity is also such an insanely detailed design as a layout, in a way that has diminished in proportion to the skyrocketing of the other kind of detail

http://img4.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20061030000624/doom/images/thumb/9/96/E1M3dots.png/300px-E1M3dots.png

http://doomwiki.org/w/images/thumb/0/09/KDIZD_Map_Z1M9.png/300px-KDIZD_Map_Z1M9.png

http://static3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20070916114742/doom/images/thumb/f/f9/E2M2dots.png/500px-E2M2dots.png

sry about that hueg last one

Being able to run to your ball while it is in flight (or just run around the course whenever) would be awesome in realistic golf games.

what the
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bkhXSLmRbiE

A N N T H I L A T I O N

the first doom movie, despite being basically indefensible, is kind of a guilty pleasure for me so i’m in for this

trailer does manage to capture the feeling of a cheesy 2000s adaptation of a video game tho

It looks like this adaptation, like the first one, makes the mistake of having more than one character. The only way to make a Doom film, IMO, is to have one character (Doomguy) and zero dialogue. It should be a silent horror-comedy, basically. Cast the dude from Letterkenny, he'd be a perfect Doomguy.

It seems to me like the biggest mistake made by filmmakers when adapting a videogame into a movie is that they wake up each day and decide to continue doing that instead of considering their actions rationally and doing something less terrible with all of that time and money.

Cast the dude from Letterkenny, he'd be a perfect Doomguy.

the main problem with the first movie is that they cast the rock and made him a villain when he's clearly doomguy material

the other problem, of course, is that neither movie has gone down the route of doing a straight-up verbatim adaptation of the doom comic book

https://proxy.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Fi1.wp.com%2Fwww.dreadcentral.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2016%2F07%2FDoom-pic-1.jpg%3Fresize%3D584%252C444&f=1&nofb=1

Would watch two hours of that man's hinges coming loose.

Doom Eternal delayed to March

oh there's a different thread for the new ones isn't there

So the new one is delayed until March ... and the Switch version delayed even further past that to some yet to be determined date.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KFDlVgBMomQ

good lord. humanity is capable of things