Depression and what it's really like

I cosign what rushomancy said about your brain constructing the world you are finding so painful to live in. Reconstructing a better world to live in will take time and help, but it can be done.

the psychiatrists won't take me seriously

If you tell any psychiatrist what you wrote here on this thread and they failed to take you seriously, then they ought to have their license to practice medicine revoked. And be kicked up & down the street by all the patients they've failed to help.

i tried to see a therapist recently and she was terrible and minimized all of my problems. she also got mad at me for "going over" the allotted time even though she didn't tell me that time was up. i thought it was her job to watch the clock.

i mean, from the outside, things might not seem that bad for me, but i am in an overwhelming job and the stress is causing me to slip back into old depressive habits and symptoms. learning to give 100% at a job while still practicing self care seemed like a legitimate thing to seek advice about. idk.

those are just my own issues, but the point is, mm, that mental health workers are like anyone else, some are terrible. so you should keep seeking help and even if you don't find it right away keep seeking it and if you believe you can get better that's your best shot at actually getting better. unfortunately, in this life you have to be your own advocate. sorry if all of this sounds boilerplate.

piggybacking off treeship-

therapy isn't an empirical science. hell, even psychopharmacology isn't an empirical science, because at least my experience is that the way they prescribe drugs is that they just start throwing drugs at you essentially at random until one gets good results without intolerably bad side effects, and then they just keep you on that until it stops working. the good news is that there are way more therapists out there than there are approved anti-depressant drugs, and if you wind up with a therapist who doesn't work for you, you can just try another one. i've had therapists who were much worse than merely ineffective- although they were very nice, well-intentioned, completely compliant in every respect with therapeutic protocol, they just made my life a living hell.

co-sign on treeship: having a shitty experience in therapy is not a very good reason to rule out therapy as ineffective.

I'm scared.

I've actually thought about what it would feel like to die. And not in a way of like passing thought, like oh wonder what that's like.

Like, very deeply going over what it would actually be like and the ramifications it would have. I'm talking doing nothing but laying in bed for hours thinking about it.

I have the means to do myself in. I'm just not sure I want to hurt the others I live with in that way.

Don't do it man, please, these feelings will pass

^^^

maybe try to think as much as possible about the effect it might have on the people who care about you even if you can't see anything but positives for yourself - it's important to try to shift perspective on this if you can i think

xp Thinking about your own death is a pretty natural thing to do. Thinking about deliberately ending your life is a big red flag and you should tell the people who care about you that such thoughts are in your mind.

watch this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3_J0AMPPD34

omg that is one chill lil rabbit dude

So chill I was afraid it was dead at first o_O

Me too!

love his smile =:-)

austin--that sort of suicidal ideation is so fucking awful. hotlines can help at times. in the US, it's 1-800-suicide. it's anonymous. here's a post explaining what it's like:

http://captainawkward.com/2013/03/01/guest-post-what-to-expect-when-you-call-a-helplinehotline/

there's an im service for those who hate phones too. (c/p from comments of above link) crisischat.org is available in the US for limited periods of time. It works similarly to a crisis hotline, just with IM instead of the phone.

you say you have the means to do yrself in. if possible, give that stuff to a friend for safekeeping. you don't want that sort of stuff to be convenient when you're this depressed.

hey i went to a show, even though it wasn't easy to get to, and it was good and i hardly regretted leaving the house at all

:D

so i'm not a professional, but as best i can tell suicidal thoughts get classified in a number of ways. thinking about death and about killing oneself is known as "suicidal ideation". this is sort of like a storm watch- it's bad and you definitely want to keep an eye on the situation. this can escalate to "suicidal intent", which is sort of the equivalent of a storm warning, a very strong indication of danger where you need to take action to protect yourself. if you have means and a plan you need to take steps to prevent that plan from being carried out. concern for loved ones is one of the many defenses people have against suicide- a storm wall, to extend the metaphor- but the depression is battering against it constantly, and there's no real way to know how strong it is, how long it will hold out.

whenever people used to write to ann landers talking about being depressed, she always advised them to get professional help, which is really good advice. there's not really anything we can do about depression from way over here.

so i'm not a professional, but as best i can tell suicidal thoughts get classified in a number of ways. thinking about death and about killing oneself is known as "suicidal ideation". this is sort of like a storm watch- it's bad and you definitely want to keep an eye on the situation.

Not that I'm encouraging anyone to contemplate suicide, but personal experience leads me to think there's some truth to the research that indicates suicidal ideation is like a safety valve--by THINKING about it and then putting off doing it at least for now, you can get through another awful day

they played a really sick joke on me.
i'm having a hard time living with this, anymore.

Please don't do anything silly. I know it's a long way from you, but I have spent the weekend inviting lonely people to spend Christmas day at my mother's. And she was in Pub today and this was brought up, she just shrugged and said she was used to me bringing "waifs and strays" to her house to eat. Which I will hold my hands up, it is true, and especially at Christmas, no-one should be on their own. So I know you can't make it to mine, but just imagine that there are people and places who would welcome you in. I mean, it's mainly a drinking occasion in my family, but you don't need a drink, you need a hug. And if you are as good looking as you claim, my mother would no doubt cosy up to you. But please, don't be acting rash, there are plenty of people here to talk to. It's Christmas, I need everyone to stay safe, we had a Cancer Death last week but we're staying strong, the vodka lets us talk to each other, the creepy doctor says it doesn't help, but IT DOES. But that is not a reccomendation to you, please just talk to another human being, you are a prick but the world would not be better for lack of you. Hold on, tightly, with both hands.

my job is too much for me to deal with. i don't think i can actually deal with all that much. the past couple of weeks i've spent a lot of time fantasizing about doing low skill, lower stress jobs and cutting expenses/simplifying my life to make this work. no one i talk to supports me in this.

this is more confessional than i usually am. i am just so burned out and i think i have always been bad at managing my responsibilities.

i've done that - switched to a lower stress job. after a while i really started to hate the boredom of the lower stress job. anything you can do to make the current job more manageable?

i have really bad depressive tendencies, as documented somewhat on this thread. another bad part of switching was that i really started to question my self-worth, even though i was doing a good job at the low stress job, like a lot worse than when i was sucking at the higher-stress job. and the loss of social capital was a bummer too.

like i thought when i switched it would free up all of this mental energy that i could devote to other things. nope. instead my mental energy just went into stressing out about how i'd disappointed everybody, wondering how anybody would ever take me seriously again, wondering how much of a hit my career had taken, etc. the problem wasn't my job, the problem was / is my depression.

I quit a high stress job i got right after college, i quit after four days. I'm pretty sure I had a nervous breakdown, it had been a rough year.

I spent the next few years working supermarket shifts and just happy to not be stressed about work. Even after getting a regular hours office job on the same money I was still delighted not to have any responsibility or decisions or any of that grown-up shit that (I'd convinced myself by that stage) other people had somehow been groomed and prepared for and somehow, somewhere picked up the certainty and steeliness of resolve that the corporate world seems to require but that I never managed to find when I needed it.

After a few years of satisfying and totally indulging my fears in this way and thereby avoiding that churning panic, I worked my way slowly into competency in enough areas that I didn't feel fraudulent in a professional environment anymore. Somewhere after that I started to think I could maybe chance my arm at further study and promotion and did both, though both terrified me at times. External forces included yeah a desire for status/income that I wasn't going to get at the level I was comfortable at, and eh ms.mac likes me fine but I'm not sure she sees herself settling long, long term with a typist. Internal force was that I knew I was settling within myself for the sake of comfort and I'd eventually witnessed enough around me to realise that there is a lot of front and bluffing going on out there, and that I'd at least be smart enough among it all to do no more harm than the next fella, and with maybe a smidgen more good intent.

TLDR/moral: I think it's common, tlg sympathising above suggests as much. Struggling through it is an available path, I'd imagine lots do. Ducking out and finding your own platform over as long as is needed to do do might be another way, it was for me. Either way, or by any other way you find, needn't mean that you're dropping out forever, just until yknow it works for you. And even if it does, eh fuckit its only work and you're a good guy. With a very photogenic dog. Luck.

One thing tho- talk to the kindest person available at work and let them know you're feeling overwhelmed. Just that. If you're the first ever and get flung out, then relief should be your reaction. But if theyve channels and processes to help in this p common situation it might be a big help- it is for me in my new gig.

i may well be mistaken but i feel like some recent posters here are or have been teachers? teaching is super fucking hard even without depression; imagining it with fills me with dread and awe. that's not to say that one should or should not do it, of course, but feeling overwhelmed is certainly not a personal failure

and maybe visiting the teachers thread would help

i am not a teacher teacher but a college teacher, and several years out from my phd i have a lower level of stress from teaching as such but always generate some out of myself anyway and my own sense of how much i should be doing. i have a stubborn mental block that keeps me from just doing whatever bullshit syllabus one should do for any given course, so whenever i have to do something new, which has been more or less constant in my off-on spates of actual work availability in the past several years, i feel like i have to do something all mine from the ground up, make a plan, choose readings, adapt them and the assignments to my way of doing things, etc. then i spend the whole semester wading through a swamp to try to stay ahead / not behind of the thing. sometimes the quality of my work has suffered. especially when depressed the most. but even when it hasn't i have generally made it way too hard on myself, even if that's not something i know how to fix. after seeing natural improvements in my work with time and repetition, i've supposed that i've just experienced normal growing pains at the beginning of what is a big career transition for anyone, from student to teacher. there's a reason most teachers find something they can work with in a classroom and stick with it for 20 years, after all. but doing this amid bad conditions (no jobs, low pay, etc.) saps my ability to believe that things will improve, or at least my caring about whether they could. turns out receiving fair pay and respect and having security makes you look toward the future with hope!

this past semester i did another round of online-only courses for a nearby state school i've visited and know some faculty at, but am not really 'at'; and a surprise fill-in at a school in town that had every classic 'liberal arts school' feature you could think of. i had already been hella bummed about teaching online since the entire endeavor seems to be a completely thoughtless one on the school's part, and only marginally 'teaching' at my current level of ability to magic a college course into existence for disinterested vocational program majors via a monstrous learning management system. but getting a quick burst of personal contact and in-room teaching experience with the other group simultaneously reminded me of how automatically rewarding the job could be while also making me feel even more isolated, since i literally had no place on campus - i would sit out on the patio of the library after class and contemplate for thirty minutes or so before running home to do the other work on the ol computer - and with time kept having more and more confirmed my feeling that i was just totally alone in both jobs at once. that's something every higher-ed academic recognizes full well, i'd expect, even primary school teachers despite all the bureaucratic nightmares, since the core of the job is you in a room with the students. and in general people who gravitate toward higher ed like it that way anyway; we don't have people telling us how or what to teach or really knowing much of anything about how we conduct ourselves in our work. but the whole point of the whole idea of a campus and collegiality is that in certain ways you're not alone, or don't have to be - there is always someone else there, around, to support you as need be - to be the person you say hi to, to reside in the office you pop in to to ask a question, to remind you that it all went fine last time around and you're going to do it again so your private little anxieties about your disaster of a course or your stack of papers to grade will naturally be mitigated by the social world you live in. so doing all the work for two different schools/departments while feeling zero social involvement in either one… it's not good.

as i recall treezy was looking into or doing teachingish work. even if not, i guess, i would recommend looking at the social validation/engagement you are currently receiving. if perhaps you have been cut off from it or you are not allowing yourself as much of it as you could, maybe time to head on back over to the main office or faculty lounge or wherever, or ask some folks for a meetup.

at my level, teachers exhibit a predictable pattern: they're all around < 1 week before the semester starts, then they gradually vanish into their own worlds as they try to shoulder their burdens w/o getting crushed by them and also to secret away some time for themselves near the end of the semester as they start to realize that their jobs are consuming their lives. then after the break they do it again.

treesh, if quitting a well-paid job will both allow you to fulfill your basic obligation to support yourself (if possible) and seems necessary to preserve your mental health, then bite the bullet and seek a lower stress job regardless of the well-meant advice you get from relatives and friends. They don't have to live in your skin.

The difficulty in making such deeply life-altering decisions in your stage of life is that given your lack of life experience it is easy to mistake a failure of nerve for an existential crisis. My POV would be to stick with it long enough to know there is no satisfactory path to improving your situation and that remaining in place is clearly undermining your physical or mental health in significant ways. When you're certain of this, bail out and don't look back. Then, even if you don't know the way forward, you clearly understand the wholly unacceptable cost of stasis.

one version of what it's really like: hiding from yourself in bed all day, drinking to facilitate naps and make excuses, waking up in enough time to appear normal to other people, repeating

open the curtains

man this time of year blows for so many people. wish we could fast-forward a month or two and skip all the pits of despair.

open the k-hole

at least there's always new drug slang to learn.

open the wordhole

opening of holes can be dangerous, but generally good advice unless new tissue is trying to form there

Not that I'm encouraging anyone to contemplate suicide, but personal experience leads me to think there's some truth to the research that indicates suicidal ideation is like a safety valve--by THINKING about it and then putting off doing it at least for now, you can get through another awful day

This is my experience. I've never been sure that it's healthy, but my bouts of darkness and contemplation of suicide have never seemed like something that could be 'helped' by the regular channels of therapy and medication. (In part, a result, maybe of never having health insurance until recently - the concept of therapists and medication is foreign. I'm not entirely sure how to deal with physical medical issues, much less mental.)

At the bleakest moments, I THINK about and sometimes dwell on suicide but it drives an internal... anger, I guess. The anger isn't self-loathing so much as a desire to do better, sort of a monologue/narration about being a fuck-up. The future seems impossible and miserable, I see no way out and no positive endpoint, so I can just end it all right now - but is that really want I want?

treeship if you are a first-year high school or middle school teacher...you are right on schedule with those feelings. (probably elementary, too; i just don't know much about that.) it sucks, and i am sorry. try to forgive yourself for the things you can't get done--it's an impossible job, especially the first year. people told me to do this my first year and i thought they were crazy, but they were right--blow off your grading sometimes to sleep/cook yourself a nourishing meal/read comic books. you are not bad at handling responsibility. there are too many high-stakes responsibilities for even the most responsible person to fulfill.

my first year i fantasized about working as a supermarket cashier. i also fantasized about getting hit by a bus. not badly enough to be killed, but badly enough for an extended hospital stay so i could have some time to catch up on my grading. it's so hard. be kind to yourself.

are you sleeping? i barely slept my first year and by May i was batshit/burned out. if it's about being "good" at your job (no one's good their first year), sleep is the single biggest predictor of whether i'm lucid and engaging. bigger than the amount of time spent planning, bigger than how well i know the text or how much i love it.

Hey all,

Thanks for the supportive comments. So yeah, I am a first year teacher and I am teaching English to sixth graders. My original plan was to teach high school but I took this job because it was the first offer I received. I have a long commute which has cut into my sleeping (I wake up at 5!) but usually I get at least 5 1/2 to 6 hours. Grading everything on time hasn't happened, and I feel bad about that, but I also feel bad about the fact that I can't get my students' behavior under control. I don't want to reveal too much about the specifics of my school here, but this has been a challenging year for the whole staff so I don't really feel alone in this struggle. Still, I don't know if I can take being yelled at by kids that much longer. I feel guilty that I can't meet all of their learning needs and I am so burned out I feel like I can barely get out of bed, much less do this superhuman job. Many teachers get through this rough patch and come out stronger, better teachers but I am thinking I won't be one of them. I don't really have the desire to do that right now, I just want to go read a book. I feel guilty most of the time which is the biggest trigger for my depression. Definitely planning on leaving this school and maybe the profession in June but don't know if I can last that long.

I went into teaching because I love English as an academic subject and also had previous experience working at schools that showed me I had an affinity for working with kids. But I do not have an affinity for managing stress or, it turns out, classrooms. I think my place might be somewhere simpler with lower stakes.

it made me feel really valiadted that the American Psychological Association made a pamphlet like 'look friends and loved ones of teachers, teacher stress is fucking REAL'

https://www.apa.org/ed/schools/cpse/teacher-stress-brochure.pdf

I am a seventh grade English tear in my fourth year and I had a mental breakdown in front of the school my second year. My kids figured out how to get my to cry every day, and they did. It was bad. I almost quit. Here's some stuff that helped me:

- my job had an EAP that gave me free counseling and a free 24 hour hotline and that helped
- i found a good primary care doctor (recc'ed by another kind teacher who struggles w/mental health ish) who respects teachers and patiently helped figure out a good med combo (this took 1.5 years to NAIL but trying some meds helped)
- stop grading so much ~ NOT all the work they do needs to be graded!!! it is impossible! this one really did me in in tandem with having some very poorly behaved kids -- i have a bunch of things i do to reduce grading, webmail me if you wanna talk
- i wrote a blog post on how to not burn out and it's kind of cliche advice but maybe it will help?

being a middle school teacher is insanely hard!!! mad respect to you! hopefully you get some time to hibernate/decompress over winter break...and please do webmail me if you wanna talk, i am a good listening ear if nothing else

oh yeah and class mgmt is a tricky one, it took me a long time to learn that one too, and like hs says sleep helps, also antidepressants helped me
like before them i would hear some dumb bs a kid says: 'you're boring' and i would think, 'it is true, i am boring, and also, i am a morally bad person...etc etc' depression talk
and after antidepressants it was like 'be respectful' and like 'eh whatever go suck an egg, kid' inside
class mgmt is learnable but it the irony is: it DOES take energy to do right...yet it SAPS you of EVEN MORE energy if you don't do it right

i like this guy's site, it helped me out a lot
http://www.smartclassroommanagement.com/category/classroom-management-strategies/difficult-students/

or if you just wanna QUIT, figure out WHEN is a good time to do it ~~ part of why i did not quit was my district fines you $2000 if you quit midyear, might wanna see if that's gonna be a problem
if that hadn't been the case i'd probably be working in a call center again

My kids figured out how to get my to cry every day, and they did.

Children that age should be killed. Well, not all of them. Just one or two, as an example to the others.

children are the worst

tbh I just needed to get a thicker skin

and pills pills pills