reissued on vinyl recently, dunno abt CD
― sleeve, Tuesday, 27 October 2015 19:39 (eight years ago) link
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forever_Burned 2003 OOP
― StanM, Tuesday, 27 October 2015 19:48 (eight years ago) link
Has anybody found out if Omniscience is duplicated in tracks on the bonus disc here? Or if the versions are different? Seem to be some of the same titles at least.
― Stevolende, Tuesday, 27 October 2015 22:02 (eight years ago) link
Some, but far from all.
― the top man in the language department (誤訳侮辱), Wednesday, 28 October 2015 01:05 (eight years ago) link
I had forgotten that The Burning World was reissued by Water in 2012 and remains in print.
― the top man in the language department (誤訳侮辱), Wednesday, 28 October 2015 01:11 (eight years ago) link
Weird question that I never thought of before, but is Jarboe's age per Wikipedia accurate (January 30, 1970)? I never thought of her as particularly young looking, but that would make her like 14 or 15 when she gets involved with Swans. Wondering if that's possible. Gira born in 1954. Kind of hoping that Wiki has her birthdate wrong.
― dlp9001, Monday, 7 December 2015 02:30 (eight years ago) link
Still waiting for my copy of the White Light/Love set to arrive, but I also just ordered the reissue of The Burning World from Amazon.
― the top man in the language department (誤訳侮辱), Monday, 7 December 2015 03:17 (eight years ago) link
No way is that date of birth accurate.
― schlep and back trio (anagram), Monday, 7 December 2015 06:23 (eight years ago) link
I'd say it would be about 10 years out. Might be 1960. She was certainly older than me in the mid 80s when i met the band a few times.Probably still is in fact.
― Stevolende, Monday, 7 December 2015 09:04 (eight years ago) link
http://www.swans.pair.com/PRESS/int_com.html :
Oh, thats not samples, thats tapes which Jarboe recorded as a little girl, about 12 years old.
The "Her" tape mentions the Grateful Dead playing Piedmont Park "this afternoon" = July 7, 1969.
so... she's from 1957.
/investigative journalism
― StanM, Monday, 7 December 2015 10:28 (eight years ago) link
but she has chosen not to reveal that officially so um, if you get a cease & desist, it wasn't me :-)
― StanM, Monday, 7 December 2015 10:29 (eight years ago) link
ok, it's slightly weird not to have the tracklist anywhere in the 3CD box/packaging & to have to go look it up online but anyway (the booklet only contains the lyrics and "#5, #9, #13 etc originally appeared on World of Skin" etc, not what those tracks might be)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_Light_from_the_Mouth_of_Infinity -> "2015 remaster version" for the differenceshttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Love_of_Life_%28album%29 -> "background" and "2015 bonus tracks" for CD 2 & 3 details
― StanM, Wednesday, 16 December 2015 17:45 (eight years ago) link
my head hurts now
― sleeve, Wednesday, 16 December 2015 17:55 (eight years ago) link
can someone tell me the current status of swans song "black hole man"? i have a live recording that's like 19 min long and i was wondering if there was a not-live version of it.
― La Lechuza (La Lechera), Wednesday, 16 December 2015 18:23 (eight years ago) link
No, the only officially released version at the moment is on The Gate, live, as the second part of "Bring The Sun" (28:16).(Maybe they'll record a studio version for the 2016 album, I don't know)
― StanM, Wednesday, 16 December 2015 18:32 (eight years ago) link
hope so!
― La Lechuza (La Lechera), Wednesday, 16 December 2015 18:35 (eight years ago) link
Larkin Grimm has accused Gira of rape.
https://t.co/iO2IF5x1ZX
― a serious and fascinating fartist (Simon H.), Friday, 26 February 2016 00:44 (eight years ago) link
Dud
― albvivertine, Friday, 26 February 2016 01:21 (eight years ago) link
ugh
― jmm, Friday, 26 February 2016 03:06 (eight years ago) link
Don't know if legit:
http://i65.tinypic.com/2jcvbo.png
― StanM, Friday, 26 February 2016 04:16 (eight years ago) link
(Me = not me, obv, just found this being linked to somewhere else)
― StanM, Friday, 26 February 2016 04:17 (eight years ago) link
Larkin has commented further to Pitchfork:
http://pitchfork.com/news/63780-swans-michael-gira-accused-of-rape-by-former-collaborator-larkin-grimm/
I am not in this for vengeance. I am not angry. I do not want Michael Gira to have his life destroyed. If one in four or five women has been raped, we have to acknowledge the possibility that one in five men might be rapists. What are we going to do with them all? Send them to jail for 10 years and cut off their dicks? NO. It is the whole culture that has to change. We have created this epidemic of harassment and disrespect and violence together. We have to end it together.
― Ned Raggett, Friday, 26 February 2016 04:50 (eight years ago) link
I believe I will stay off the internet for a few days until this whole thing blows over
― Wimmels, Friday, 26 February 2016 05:01 (eight years ago) link
Gira has responded.
https://www.facebook.com/mgira/posts/10201368018239159
― Ned Raggett, Friday, 26 February 2016 05:14 (eight years ago) link
well that got ugly fast
― the 'major tom guy' (sleeve), Friday, 26 February 2016 05:24 (eight years ago) link
Made mistake of reading comments to his post.
― One bad call from barely losing to (Alex in SF), Friday, 26 February 2016 05:30 (eight years ago) link
And for fucks sake, has anyone listened to his songs speaking out against rape??!??Like · 4 · 13 minsDennis MandarinDennis Mandarin EXAAAACTLYLike · 1 · 13 minsDennis MandarinDennis Mandarin Anyone who believes this probably doesn't listen to swans.
^^^^ "but his best friend is black!"
― just1n3, Friday, 26 February 2016 05:53 (eight years ago) link
yeah that one stood out
― the 'major tom guy' (sleeve), Friday, 26 February 2016 05:58 (eight years ago) link
fuck what a depressing story
― François Pitchforkian (NickB), Friday, 26 February 2016 07:22 (eight years ago) link
Gira's wife reacts as well
https://www.facebook.com/coveredwithstars/posts/10206691239732330
― StanM, Friday, 26 February 2016 08:49 (eight years ago) link
god what a mess
― François Pitchforkian (NickB), Friday, 26 February 2016 11:15 (eight years ago) link
Damn :-(
― robbie ca$hflo (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Friday, 26 February 2016 13:10 (eight years ago) link
kinda wondering what the hell this "proof" is gonna be
― frogbs, Friday, 26 February 2016 13:40 (eight years ago) link
They're claiming it's emails the woman sent to him through the years that show a pattern of vindictiveness and erratic behavior.
― spirited ai weiwei (Treeship), Friday, 26 February 2016 13:49 (eight years ago) link
Obv that's not "proof" of anything. This is going to be a long, ugly debacle.
― spirited ai weiwei (Treeship), Friday, 26 February 2016 13:54 (eight years ago) link
This was the second instance of exactly this kind of announcement on FB I saw this week (curiously enough both involving NY musicians), and would be very surprised if it was the last. And yeah, keep away from the comments if you don't want to get angry.
― Dominique, Friday, 26 February 2016 13:58 (eight years ago) link
xpost
Yeah, reading Jennifer Gira's post I was thinking that even if that pattern of behavior is true, it wouldn't exactly be inconsistent with what Grimm is saying. "Traumatized victim behaves erratically, threatens revenge" is not an unlikely scenario.
― A nationally known air show announcer/personality (tipsy mothra), Friday, 26 February 2016 14:00 (eight years ago) link
"actual rapist accuses victim of being mentally unstable & bent on revenge as soon as the truth comes out" is not an unlikely scenario either
― crüt, Friday, 26 February 2016 14:01 (eight years ago) link
otm
― A nationally known air show announcer/personality (tipsy mothra), Friday, 26 February 2016 14:04 (eight years ago) link
yup
― François Pitchforkian (NickB), Friday, 26 February 2016 14:06 (eight years ago) link
the super-gross victim-blaming response is maybe more distasteful than the actual allegations, which were (despite the graphic detail) so couched in qualifications as to be almost polite ('I heard he stopped drinking, so hopefully he doesn't behave like that anymore' = !!)
― Posts found in a bottle by (bernard snowy), Friday, 26 February 2016 14:09 (eight years ago) link
Oh I don't know about that the actual allegations are pretty gross (esp. the pattern of harassment).
― One bad call from barely losing to (Alex in SF), Friday, 26 February 2016 14:19 (eight years ago) link
xp ... not that I'm tryna write a thinkpiece about it or anything, but it feels like there's this weird double-bind characterizing our particular cultural moment: people assume that the "rape allegation as character assassination" narrative still makes sense, even as we try to move towards a culture in which the stigma of "being a rapist" is, if not lessened, then certainly different*... in which case, the real crime** is being tethered to an outdated mentality which demands smearing the accuser to protect one's good name
*: because keeping that stigma intact allows us to think of rape as a rare occurrence, perpetrated by insane people**: "the real crime" = in the eyes of the gossipy internet-driven public sphere that passes character judgments -- obviously from the standpoint of the legal system, the real crime is still rape
― Posts found in a bottle by (bernard snowy), Friday, 26 February 2016 14:21 (eight years ago) link
anyway, that's the last I'll say on this subject. I'm on the verge of tears listening to The Seer right now. it's been a tough week.
― Posts found in a bottle by (bernard snowy), Friday, 26 February 2016 14:23 (eight years ago) link
― Posts found in a bottle by (bernard snowy)
this was my reaction as well, the stark contrast between Grimm's clear-eyed, very compassionate take on things and Gira's ugly defensive hatefulness is so jarring.
― the 'major tom guy' (sleeve), Friday, 26 February 2016 15:05 (eight years ago) link
P4K headline on this comes down heavily on Gira's side of things. "Swans' Michael Gira Calls Rape Accusations by Former Collaborator Larkin Grimm a "Slanderous Lie".
― Position Position, Friday, 26 February 2016 15:15 (eight years ago) link
Whether they realize it or not, most people seem to pick a side, it's fascinating. Based on preconceptions, artistic achievement, language skills, sometimes based on the photo that accompanies an article.
― StanM, Friday, 26 February 2016 15:22 (eight years ago) link
And I'm guessing often based on sex. My question with accusations like this is always the same, "why would she lie?" I realize that sometimes people falsely accuse other people for a variety of reasons, and that unless all the facts are known, we can't ever really be sure who's being truthful. But unless you're clinically narcissistic and a sociopath, how could lying about something like this be worth the trouble?
― Dominique, Friday, 26 February 2016 15:38 (eight years ago) link
― frogbs, Friday, February 26, 2016 8:40 AM (2 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
it's not proof she have, it's PROOF
― Van Horn Street, Friday, 26 February 2016 15:41 (eight years ago) link
But unless you're clinically narcissistic and a sociopath, how could lying about something like this be worth the trouble?
It seems insane for someone to do that, but it is not unprecedented.
― kornrulez6969, Friday, 26 February 2016 15:49 (eight years ago) link