Star Trek: Classic or Dud?

Also, it had to be Sisko at DS9.

I don't think so...

(SPOILERS FOR DS9!!!)

The wormhole aliens exist out of time / can exist in any time they want to, so Sisko's "destiny" is something that happens retroactively, only after the aliens have first met him in the present. If it had been some other person commanding DS9, the aliens could've changed his past the same way they did with Sisko.

no way, man. he's THE SISKO...

Also

SPOILER!!!!!!!

Remember who his mother is!

kinda goes back to that whole history-rewriting jazz
liked that angle too with the evil wormhole gods, the sci-fi writer, and the mental institution

I really like the set design in this show. It's kind of throwing me off w the campy stories, they are super old fashioned. Some of them are right out of the 60s show. Picard is so cool at trying not to lose his cool.

Holodeck rules I can't wait to see more of that.

Also

SPOILER!!!!!!!

Remember who his mother is!

But this was part of the point I was trying to make: while inside the wormhole, the Wormhole Aliens exist outside of linear time. When they come out of it to our universe, they can appear in any time period they want to. So Sisko's "destiny" is something they created retroactively. From our causal point of view, they first become aware of Sisko only when he first travels inside the wormhole; during their meeting there, the Aliens realize they can use Sisko as a tool, and only after that do they make Sisko the "chosen one" by tampering with his poor mother. So Sisko didn't come to Deep Space Nine because of who his mother was, his mother was who she was because Sisko came to DS9. If Starfleet had chosen someone else to command the station, the Wormhole Aliens would've done the same fucked-up thing to that person's mother.

yup

Yeah that makes sense. Damn retconning wormhole aliens.

The fact that the Wormhole Aliens did what they did to Sisko's mom, and they're still considered to be benevolent, is one of the dodgiest moments in ST (alongside the Troi pregnancy episode). IIRC Sisko doesn't even react to it any ways besides some general "oh, the Prophets are weird" comment. I wonder, if DS9's regular writing crew hadn't been all-male, would someone have pointed out that maybe you shouldn't portray your supposed good guys as mental and physical rapists?

It's the writers who do the retconning... Maybe the writers ARE the wormhole aliens

Just reached "Contagion" in Season 2 of TNG rewatch. It's the IT Crowd joke! They just fix the problem by turning it off and on again.

lol

Made it through the 2nd Q episode. Man he sounds so much like an every person in an internet comment section argument. Still it's a lot of fun when he's around and there is guaranteed to be some crazy visual effects and fun conceptual shuffling of the decks.

Really digging the humor and pathos Patrick Stewart brings to his role. Little things like keeping people off the deck and getting pissed of when people interrupt him both make the world seem more real than the OST and make the captain seem more competent and worthy of respect for having to put up w the constant barrage of stuff messing with his ship in every way.

Data acting like Sherlock Holmes in that one ep was an easy mark but dang it was fun. Spock is still way cooler but Data is silly in a good way. I like how he turned down Q's offer to make him a human.

http://i.imgur.com/5tJfybD.jpg

Read that as "ethereal whining". :(

actually my new fb profile picture now ty

Ha you're welcome!

what episode is that from?

The Dauphin - Wesley romances young lady/light being/goggle-eyed fur monster

Played by Mädchen Amick!

Or her furry monster guardian is, I mean.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mädchen_Amick

Season 2, aired in 1989. This ep would have been shot right before the Twin Peaks pilot began production, right?

http://img2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20121210010124/memoryalpha/en/images/thumb/c/c7/Anya,_teenage_girl.jpg/500px-Anya,_teenage_girl.jpg

http://memory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/The_Dauphin_(episode)

ilx linker doesn't dig special characters

mmmmmmmmadchen

Funny, I just watched "When the Bough Breaks" which has Brenda Strong, also of Twin Peaks fame:

https://travelingwithjim.files.wordpress.com/2010/12/brendastrong.jpg

> ilx linker doesn't dig special characters

or closing brackets 8)

The Dauphin

is that better? or this?

http://memory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/The_Dauphin_(episode)

(yes, no)

I tried to start watching DS9 and fell asleep 2/3rds of the way through the first episode so... fail

some of the political maneuvering was pretty interesting but man the bad acting... Sisko's line readings are bizarre

ds9 is the best, i've been watching it through slowly over the past year
episode consistency doesnt really pick up until season 4 but there's some v good ones in the first few seasons still

i love the weird avery brooks line readings. they never really go away though so if thats a dealbreaker for you then yeah..

some of it worked - the first scene where he's strong-arming Quark into staying on had a very Sopranos vibe - but then there was stuff like him on the beach talking to his dead wife and it was all so stiff and idk practically inhuman

idk if I have the patience to sit through 3 seasons of boring shit to get to the good stuff

i have this episode guide some dudes on twitter made that shows which ones to watch if you just want the main storyline, so thats another option besides watching them all. condenses things by a lot especially in the first couple seasons.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1nFIFQCxxyCcaOx9o0S0u3Db3g-ViWQUFtynql5XxPeo/edit

I think that's just Avery Brooks's theater theatre background. It bugged me too when I first watched the series, but eventually I came to appreciate how he chewed on scenes.

There's some discussion of Avery Brooks and how fabulously weird he is upthread. I am fully Team Avery Brooks Weird Line Delivery, personally.

avery brooks is the best

That DS9 spreadsheet (lol) is exactly what I was looking for, thanks so much. Want to attempt a series watch (after TNG) as I've heard so many good things about the late seasons (although I also fell asleep during the pilot). But there's just *so much* of it.

I'm fine with Sisqo b does Quark get less annoying?

*but does*

Quark is an acquired taste -- I was surprised how much I liked the comic Ferengi episodes when I rewatched DS9.

He's good at calling out hu-mons on their bullshit and hypocrisy.

He never annoyed me, but I liked his presence more and more as the show went on. Remember at the time he was a way to add to that anti-Federation "peace and harmony" from the other shows - the character develops bit by bit

Just finished "Skin of Evil". The death of Tasha Yar took me by surprise, especially with her hologram appearing at her funeral to give very specific and poignant goodbyes to everyone present. "If you're seeing this, I must be dead."

Trekonomics:

https://vimeo.com/131823542

Damn "Conspiracy" is insane, took me completely off guard! "Come Picard, you will soon be like us, now let's all sit down to a nice meal ..... of bugs!!!"

yeah that episode is mental. I have hazy memories of it ruining certain meals for me, even a year after it aired.

http://quark.name/images/Quark_Complete_final.jpg

Damn "Conspiracy" is insane, took me completely off guard!

I don't think they ever bettered this arc tbh. show peaked early.

It wasn't an arc though- just one episode wasn't it?

Well that main prick was in an earlier episode as an inspector.

Btw his death was just ..... whaaaaaaa? I was expecting Khan-level grossness and got Scanners instead!