Awesome Audiophile Snake Oil

i had a joke there but i don't think it needs it.

5k words.

http://www.soundstage.com/revequip/atmasphere_mp1iii.htm

On the other end of the spectrum, the MP-1 Mk III is equally adept. Throughout the Mahler piece, heavy timpani strikes were very realistic. I heard the resonance of their skins within their kettles and the authority of the instrument within the hall. While my speakers’ cutoff point keeps me from fully appreciating Thus Spake Zarathustra’s sub-20Hz opening organ note [RCA/Classic LSC 1806], the MP-1 Mk III delivered timpani crescendos, cellos, and bass with unencumbered power. The very lowest bass could be a teeny bit wooly, but it was never without weight and timbral definition. Listen to the standup bass on NRBQ’s "Rocket in My Pocket" from All Hopped Up [Red Rooster LP1806]. I heard it as deep and tight, with the air and resonance of the bass’s body and nicely resolved decay. Here was that elusive bass with ambience.

$12k to listen to 2001 and NRBQ

I wonder if there's a crossroads for audio guys where you either become Douglas Self or one of these loons

I wonder if this crossroads has torn families apart

I first listened to the Anchorwave speaker cables in my otherwise Shunyata-cabled system. The impressive low-frequency weight that I heard during break-in held true across all contexts. With the hybrid Lamm amps connected, the Wilson Sashas lapped up current like cream through those 9-gauge Litz bundles as their woofers purred with weight and tonal depth. Bass through the Lamm M1.2s was the best I’d heard from their pairing with the Sashas: deep, hefty, tonally informed and well controlled. I’ve always heard tonally rich, well-articulated lows from the Atma-Sphere MA-1 Mk 3.1, yet the Anchorwave speaker cables bumped that up a notch to help them deliver a touch bit more grunt and heft than I’d previously experienced from these OTL amps on the Wilson speakers. While the Atma-Sphere amps did not turn into solid-state behemoths, the improvement was welcome.

Isn't this from George Lucas's first-draft Star Wars screenplay?

i think it's from archiveofourown

Someone plz find erotic audiophile fic and report back, see if it's distinguishable from the regular kind

Dragons Fucking Subwoofers

wounded matadors lapping up current

Goole - Atma-sphere is a local guy, a friend of mine used to work for him. He plays mellotron in a heavy psych band

They own multiple Super Audio CDs, and can explain the difference between them and DVD audio

I actually own a lot of Super Audio CDs, because I while ago I got myself a proper surround system, and there are loads of really good 5-channel SACDs of classical music available. Like, hearing René Jacob's recording of Bach's St Matthew Passion with the two choirs separated spatially is certainly a different experience than hearing it in stereo. And the SACDs themselves don't cost that much more than regular CDs... It's the SACD players that tend to be expensive, because SACDs are such a niche market that it's mostly the audiophile companies that produce compatible players. But thankfully Sony recently released a normal-prized BluRay player that can also play SACDs (though Sony doesn't mention that function on its site or even in the manual for the player, wtf?!), so you don't have to invest a shitload of money for a Marantz or anything.

That said, anyone who buys stereo SACDs must be fooling themselves, I can't imagine there's any such difference between those and regular CDs that human ears could perceive. It's just the same crap as with these high bitrate Pono WAVs.

He plays mellotron in a heavy psych band

― kurt kobaïan (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Wednesday, February 25, 2015 5:44 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

oh word

those atma-sphere amps look very cool, but lol @ guy wanting a 'distortionless' interconnect while using a tube amp

Yeah Thunderbolt Pagoda

This is old-school audiophilia, from an insert to an early Elecktra Records sampler from 1954, engineered by Jac Holzman:
http://s9.postimg.org/hek0yf9n3/2014_10_08_00_05_15_2.jpg

new display name

I wish that was a full-on debunking of this "hot stampers" charlatan:
http://www.wired.com/2015/03/hot-stampers/

haha, that article is a treat

I'd love to see someone do some real controlled blind listening tests with "hot stampers" - I bet it would yield the same results as that Freakonomics story on the study that showed wine buffs couldn't tell cheap wine from expensive wine: http://freakonomics.com/2010/12/16/freakonomics-radio-do-more-expensive-wines-taste-better/

the thing is, theres something to the "hot stamper" theory, I'd guess -- just not nearly as much as to justify paying a lot for a purportedly great pressing. most mastering people I know think there's a sweet spot in the pressing where stuff sounds best -- this is part of what makes auditing test pressings difficult, though I think most presses ditch the first few records off a fresh plate. but I've had test pressings that sounded pretty different from one to the next, and then a European pressing (from the same master) that sounded really unmissably better than its American counterpart, just a gorgeous clear amazing eye-opening sound that even my Rega P1 & radio shack speakers couldn't miss.

but any real difference can be measured by expensive instruments. lol at some dudes sitting in a room and listening to a hot stamper before providing their notes on the experience and slapping a $1000 price tag on it.

hot stampers has a snakeoilish scent for sure, but it's also my experience that most reissues (and really most new presses of any record) are terrible, both the cardboard covers but especially the sound - when I started collecting records I never thought I'd obsess over finding a good press, but now I've begun selling those reissues I naively wasted money on 7 years ago to buy proper 60s/70s/80s presses instead.

for what it's worh the only new 45rpm double LP's I have - the Mr. Fine Wine soul comps - sound AMAZING. Especially compared to most other comps of rare soul 45's.

agree that a lot of the last decade's 180 gram reissues were poorly done though, and I wasted $ on them too

It really sucks when you buy a brand new remaster on 180 gram and it has a skip in it. Has this happened to anyone else?

There's a preposterous amount of skill, art, quality raw materials, source media and well maintained equipment needed to make a record well. That's a big part of what makes it a compulsive medium of course but as the manufacturing biz has come back to life in a small way not all of that is always up to scratch for any given release. I mean yes there are reasons why more recent vinyl isn't always great. Actually "cold stampers" is supposedly an issue with typically small runs because the stamper needs to warm up for a good transfer to the vinyl. I gather that in the olden days an initial couple of hundred units of a major release would be discarded / reground but now a couple of hundred is often a whole run or a good part of it.

I'd love to see someone do some real controlled blind listening tests with "hot stampers" - I bet it would yield the same results as that Freakonomics story on the study that showed wine buffs couldn't tell cheap wine from expensive wine: http://freakonomics.com/2010/12/16/freakonomics-radio-do-more-expensive-wines-taste-better/

― Brio2, Thursday, March 5, 2015 10:40 AM (2 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Reminds me of this Beatles vinyl comparison, done on a $165,000 stereo. The new vinyl (mastered from a digital source) beat the old:
http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2012-11-12/entertainment/ct-ent-1113-beatles-vinyl-20121112_1_beatles-nostalgia-beatles-catalog-beatles-lps

It really sucks when you buy a brand new remaster on 180 gram and it has a skip in it. Has this happened to anyone else?

― ©Oz Quiz© (Adam Bruneau), Thursday, March 5, 2015 1:25 PM (5 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Not to me personally, but quality control is largely nonexistent where pressing plants are concerned. This is Matador's response to widespread complaints about the recent reissue of Yo La Tengo's Painful:

We're as frustrated by the situation as you are. Unfortunately it's become impossible to get consistent quality from any pressing plant these days.

United are as you note a prime culprit - they are so busy now that they are working 24-6, and until their new warehouse expansion is completed, they don't have sufficient space to allow the discs to dry properly before insertion.

However we have run into comparable quality control problems with Rainbo, RIP-V, QRP, MPO, Optimal and even Pallas - all of whom we have used for recent pressings.

Test pressings can be good and the actual LP can be bad. And there can be massive variations across batches.

Unfortunately this the downside of the vinyl revival - you have aging equipment that is non-replaceable, being strained far beyond the capacity for which it was originally designed, and often operated by people who were born in the age of the CD and the cassette and don't really understand what they're doing.

I'm copying in Dave Martin, who will help you with complementary replacements for all your defective discs, but please be aware that perfection (or even acceptable levels of surface noise) is hard to come by these days.

Best wishes,
Patrick

yeah. vinyl is fun for big artwork, finding random cheap stuff, and the joy of maintaining a simple turntable. surface noise and skips just happen. I try to not buy too much new vinyl.

I buy new vinyl mostly out of loyalty - but I think I'll go over to cds instead (prices are really good, and no bad pressings! although supposedly the sound is a bit harder compressed). I've bought a lot of reissues/new records that skipped - and I don't return them, cause I realize that's the way it is. Recently bought Jenny Lewis' Voyager, and apparently even Warner Bros can't do a proper press, since it had noise from the first track (should have bought the cd, but hey, the artwork's cool, and most of the tracks work). Similarly disappointed with my Kacey Musgraves record - vinyl sounds like cheap digital transfer and I should have stuck with my cd. Anyway, lessons learned - now I appreciate old vinyl so much more (what's up with reissues anyway, since you're getting into the medium for the materiality, supposedly, why mix it up with weird nostalgic 3rd order simulacra when you have easy access to first order 60s simulacra!)

yes! hot stampers going mainstream!! *puts $1K copy of brothers in arms on the platter*

yeah, I love that Hot Stamper-types seem obsessed with the most yard sale-y records like Tattoo You and Sweet Baby James. Just buy 100 copies for 2 bucks each if you really want to drop $200 on them.

although supposedly the sound is a bit harder compressed

I don't think this is the case as much today as it was in the mid-00s (the "Loudness Wars"). And some stuff is even being reissued sans-hard compression (e.g., Rush's Vapor Trails).

lol when I got to the Emotional Rescue part of that article I was o_O. brothers in arms is also perfect. picturing those jerks listening to the synth riff of Walk of Life 15 times in a row and then scribbling 'silky bottom end' on a post-it.

and then the dude who spends $250 on it

hot stampers has a snakeoilish scent for sure, but it's also my experience that most reissues (and really most new presses of any record) are terrible, both the cardboard covers but especially the sound - when I started collecting records I never thought I'd obsess over finding a good press, but now I've begun selling those reissues I naively wasted money on 7 years ago to buy proper 60s/70s/80s presses instead.

― niels, Thursday, March 5, 2015 10:02 AM

this is sadly OTM, it's been getting noticeably worse over the last few years

Matador email is also OTM

Love a silky bottom end on my hot stampers

what's the "Matador email"?

But yeah I've been bummed out a few times recently with new vinyl-will probably stick to CDs for new albums, dig around for deals on old LPs. Same as it ever was!

my 180g Remain in Light sounds good, though

this is sadly OTM, it's been getting noticeably worse over the last few years

Matador email is also OTM

― sleeve, Thursday, March 5, 2015 2:22 PM (13 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I have to wonder, given the decidedly hit-or-miss quality of new vinyl (reissues or otherwise), are we in the middle of an uncanny valley of vinyl production? In 5-10 years, are the reissues/new releases of 2008-2015 going to be piling up in dollar bins (while "proper"/"fixed"/we-goofed-on-that-last-reissue vinyl hits the market)?

hasn't that been an ongoing cycle for about 40 years now?

Yeah, I suppose so. I guess I just meant it specifically in terms of vinyl manufacturing -- potentially fixing physical defects via reissues -- rather than "Here's another Dark Side of the Moon box with a limited-edition sticker!"-type reissues.

Yeah, I know what you're saying - the last few years of reissues could definitely get a bad rep, like some of the first wave of CD's that just sound off when you hear them now

what's the "Matador email"?

regarding the Yo La Tengo 'Painful" reissue, just a bit upthread

thanks - really interesting, pretty amazing for them to be so up front about it.

a couple of quid for a crappy 80s/90s cd being replaced by a newly remastered edition for £10 vs this excess.

no contest.

i.e. i have bought original cd 80s/90s/00s edition and then the remaster has been issued, and the sound quality has rarely been an issue.

no financial excess required for either edition, nor the equipment to actually hear the difference.

i will never ever understand the love of the scratchy groove.

big art work. fun turn tables. cheap stevie wonder records that sound amazing. cheap fleetwood mac records that sound amazing. cheap steely dan records that, etc.

studio productions until the mid 80s, dance music after that, probably rap after that...

cds are totally the hot bargain rn though imo

yeah. early 2000s were amazing for vinyl