Please watch the Korean game show "Genius" with me

I have so many thoughts about this show! mostly good.

It's really great to see a bunch of fairly smart people get together for a few hours a week and try to out-game-theory each other. Most of the main matches are wildly entertaining. There are some times, however, where they either make the game way too confusing or they don't explain it well enough and I just sit there confused for the whole hour. Or the game is wildly easy to figure out, so everyone's just going through the motions. Also, the two-person matches are for the most part reeeeeeeally boring.

It's well worth it, though, mostly because the players that make it to the later stages of the game are very dynamic.

Ooh, can't wait to watch this.

also, helped so much to watch a youtube beforehand about the Korean older brother/older sister-style nicknaming conventions. otherwise i would've been very confused as to why all their names were Hyung or Oppa etc

damn, i had no idea what that was about. what is it?

this show is off the chain! i love that jinho is on it because i was already aware of him from following starcraft.

hyung is like an affectionate term of respect from a male towards an older male. oppa is the same, except towards an older male from a female, iirc.

and in the same way, females are called unni (by younger females) and nuna (by younger males.

still never managed to look up what sunbae meant, though, ha. somewhat inferable, i guess?

Started last night, up to episode 10 now - it is kind of great, especially episodes 8 and 9. Having a slight bit of difficulty following Confined Scamming Horse Race, but it's quite the episode title, innit?

That said: the incidental music choices are terrible and I kind of don't ever want to watch tactical Yutnori again.

yeah, tactical yutnori suuuucks, indian poker is the best death match game. the music didn't bother me at all. anyone know who did that electronic version of clair de lune they've used a few times? it's on the tip of my tongue...

Just watched the first ep, hooked. Thanks for this.

the only good 1v1 game is the new one in the finals. abundance & famine / catch the burglar easily the worst main match games.

in terms of watching them on a tv show, at least.

Will, where are you up to with this now?

Just half way through scamming horse race ep.

I struggled understanding what was happening in the election one, perhaps just tired, but they're still really entertaining. It helps that the people involved are very watchable.

haha this sounds amazing

this is amazing

Bit disappointed by how it sort of tailed off at the end of series 1, but oh my gosh the first episode of series 2. Main game is so good I want to play it for real, and then the deathmatch has actual proper tension in it and there isn't even a sniff of tactical yutnori.

Albeit they somehow find a way to loop that effing Moby song for even longer than usual.

duuude, the double-crossing in this show is legendary. no spoilers but S2E6 is just...

is the moby song the one that usually starts playing whenever the wheelers and dealers' schemes come to light and spring into action? b/c i think that one serves its purpose pretty adequately

Just finished episode 3, aka my first episode w/ tactical yutnori. goddamn is it hard to wrap my head around. helluva finish tho.

That first indian poker game, wow.

Games I managed to understand so far:
Scamming horse racing
Zombie
Open, Pass (my fave so far)

Games that I struggled a bit with
1.2.3
Abundance and Famine

Games I really couldn't follow
Election
Catch the Burglar (the idea was simple, but I couldn't understand how they were playing it until the end)

love this! Thank you.

have pointed TV friends who are involved with the Only Connect sort of game show at it, so blame me if we're watching Margaret from the Apprentice play tactical yutnori with/against Jimmy Carr this time next year.

i maybe have zoned out during the rules, but yeah, i had no idea what was going on in 'abundance and famine.'

the winning play in 'open, pass' was my favorite moment in the show up to that point, man that was totally surprising and awesome.

abundance and famine was pretty dull w/o a big double-cross, it seemed like cha totally sucked the air out of it by making sure he collected all the tickets and stuff. HERE IS HOW IT WORKED VERY DULL SPOILERS I GUESS.

the strategy was kind of a brute-force one based on how the three-man team would run out of tickets quicker

-- in round one the nine-man team played 4 tickets to abundance, 2 to famine.
--whatever the three-man team did, they could never get an equal or greater amount of bread.
--if they play three or more in abundance, no one gets anything; if they play 2, the big team leads 4-2; if they play 1, 4-1; 0, 4-0
--likewise in famine 2 or more results in nothing; one gives the nine-man team a lead

--if the smaller team had played the five tickets it required to ensure a draw, the larger team would have repeated 4-2 for two more rounds. the smaller team would have run out of tickets in round three.

--instead they played ... 1 and 3? so the nine-man team had someone with four tickets, i.e. a clear lead.
--at which point they switch to playing 6 in abundance, 3 in famine for each remaining round, i.e., anything the other team does can only mean no one gets any tickets
--(which is what happened)
-- meaning the big team ends with a winner and there's a huge tie for last place, which means they pick their loser

--right?

now someone explain to me why they were singing this at sangmin

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Kex4e45APD4

i just thought the abundance v famine rules were glossed over by the show. the entire concept of the tickets was wildly underexplained. catch the burglar was just silly because the strategy was obvious from the outset and it was strange to not see the losing players understand what was happening until they were already in an impossible position. made for really boring tv.

open/pass, zombie, election, 5:5 games were the best. the scamming horse races were pretty fun too. in terms of character arcs, sunggyu >>>>>>>

have pointed TV friends who are involved with the Only Connect sort of game show at it, so blame me if we're watching Margaret from the Apprentice play tactical yutnori with/against Jimmy Carr this time next year.

haha in fact it was OC alumni who turned me onto this in the first place!

ha! I sent it to the question editor, who i am pretty sure will love it (if he hasn't seen it before) - he loves puzzles/rule-driven fun and spent a long time writing a doctorate under Diego Gambetta, sociologist of reputation/trust systems in the mafia.

now someone explain to me why they were singing this at sangmin

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Kex4e45APD4

― ♛ LIL UNIT ♛ (thomp), Monday, January 19, 2015 8:29 AM (7 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

because sang min was in roo'ra!

oops

gotta say, he looks way better these days

so yeah, i'm totally into this

figured out what that version of clair de lune was, with intersting bonus fan video: http://youtu.be/dFsTOm7sWvA

gd looking at player wikis and spoiling the winner :(

i almost fell for that too

i learnt who the winner was but idk, i kind of enjoy knowing who to watch. if i knew when my other favourites were going to fall out i'd be sadder

zombie game: was kind of hoping someone else would be dicking people over for a change, kind of sad about that

http://blog.korea.net/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/kokiri-Yutpoints.png

zombie game: was kind of hoping someone else would be dicking people over for a change, kind of sad about that

― ♛ LIL UNIT ♛ (thomp), Tuesday, January 20, 2015 11:49 AM (4 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

did you see the horse race ep yet?

nah i'm only allowing myself one a night. i v much am hoping yell0w pulls off some kind of heel turn shortly

So that's S2E2 watched and oof, this really is getting brutal. In the good way.

Jinho's very fond of grabbing people's wrists, isn't he?

if nothing else i'm forever grateful to have been introduced to "the angel who lost wings" and its many live performances available on youtube

i actually screamed at one of the players (no spoilers; but you'll know who i mean if you saw it) around the 23 minute mark of "Open, Pass." WHAT A STUPID PERSON YOU ARE, PLAYER AT THE 23 MINUTE MARK

there is not enough scamming happening in this scamming horse race

no, wait, i think there is

ha, yep there is

nah idk there kind of wasn't!! tho i did enjoy mensa and starcraft playing to type by figuring out who must have lied, and then totally botching the chance to develop a strategy based on who to tell

great episode there. delicious combination of wilyness & incompetence by virtually everyone.

btw i think we should talk about our strategies... for example my strategy which would've won week 1 (for what that's worth: aka nothing)

i find one person who wants to win the week, i say "here's what we'll do: i will win 1, and you will win 8." i trade two 3's for two of their 1's. we play one match: my last 3 vs their last 1. i have remaining (11111222) and they have (22233333). They proceed to beat me 8 times. They win, get immunity, grant me immunity with their second wings.

alternatively, play dumb & get 4 wins each and cast your eyes down when the deathmatcher is picking someone, because week 1. but still

i find one person who wants to win the week, i say "here's what we'll do: i will win 1, and you will win 8." i trade two 3's for two of their 1's. we play one match: my last 3 vs their last 1. i have remaining (11111222) and they have (22233333). They proceed to beat me 8 times. They win, get immunity, grant me immunity with their second wings.

i mean, that was Jinho and Junseok's strategy, right? they just didn't go through with it for whatever reason

i thought they only planned to go 6-3 for some weird reason?

If you have the lowest win count then you're automatically in the death match (and can't get immunity). IIRC they wanted to have a safety net?

but the person who wasn't able to play all their cards went in automatically, ahead of the person with the lowest total, right?

i think dongmin has shown himself to be more than a bit more clever than sanggook

True but he ran the gaming aspect from the beginning - remember, he only left really because he withdrew himself as a result of the pressure he'd put himself under. We didn't see his like again until the final few eps.

Haha so for all of my fucking excitement about this show, after season 1, I had a hard time watching season 2 because it was on dailymotion and i kinda lost steam. Welllllllll the subtitler just posted links to all 4 seasons on m3g4-uplode on their twitter so guess who finally started season 2?!?!

(i am told by a friend who burned through all of it years ago, when i originally brought it up, and he warned me that season 2 is the worst because there's some shitty bullying issues -- so now i am additionally watching for that to start lol)

but apparently S3 rules so i will be watching it in pace with my friend who only watched 1-2 so we can comment per episode.

it weirds me out so fucking much that i only know one of these people from outside of this show, and that one guy is in season 2: the dude who dances in the elevator on top of PSY in the gangnam style video.

Yeah, there's one particularly dark episode in season 2. You'll know it when you see it.

I miss this show.

season 3 is soooo good

still haven't seen 3. might watch it for christmas. might watch season 1 tbh.

S3 was probably my favorite too. This show was one of the best things I never would have heard of without this website *wipes tear*

season 3 is good but season 4 is even better - there's more competition and certainly some shocking twists. season 1 is probably still the best and has a certain charm the others never quite manage to have, but also in some ways doesn't quite reach the same levels of complexity in games or schemes as the best moments in 3 and 4. one of my favourite tv shows ever

i def got to the ep in S2 that everyone was down on, and shit honestly i would've been even more of a jerk to the bully-ee, if that makes sense. (i would've never admitted to grabbing the id, and prob planted it somewhere that made it look like someone else used it)

i mean sucks for ihm but then i realize why he's fmaous (hacked a university website to steal a picture of an actress graduating or something?) and i'm like i hope you got double-crossed 42 more times on the way out the door tbrr

Ha, I didn't know any of that.

I'm actually unclear on why stealing the ID wasn't a violation of the rules. I thought they said "no stealing" somewhere upfront.

Though I seem to remember instances of people swiping garnets from each other now and then as well.

I guess it's that if you leave a thing out in the open, then finders keepers applies.

I'm watching the rules again and paying particular attention to the phrasing:
- Two players who wish to trade cards will do so by approaching the dealer's table together
- When ID is presented to the dealer, the dealer will give you the cards
- Both players will reveal their cards and begin trading
- Card trades must be for the same number of cards
- When the trade is complete, the cards will be stored again and the IDs will be returned

They take care (or at least, the subtitler does) to never even say "your" ID. Even at the beginning I thought "there's definitely an opportunity here to give someone your ID or trade with someone to ensure you're working together"

pic.twitter.com/ln5A9lDN0c

— Bumdidlyumptious (@Bumdidlyump) March 13, 2020

loooool. might have to rewatch these as plague viewing.

haaaa

Plague rewatch in place, about 8 into S1 and this is just as incredible as I remember it. Even from a purely televisual point of view, the editing is amazing - the music cues are perfect to drive the drama along and the use of flash forward and back wrongfoots you as a viewer all the time.

great show

I mean I liked Squid Game and everything but it just made me want to rewatch THE GENIUS, so here I go.

ha me too, i rewatched the first ep after watching the first SG ep. Still great.

I rewatched last year, Sangmin in S2 is still some kind of pinnacle of television.

I'm happy I've forgotten all the craziness and can appreciate again.

spoiler ep 1 that Garnet switch is still wow!

also rewatching this. it is the best.

all the old links still work? can someone post them again pls

I had to download the files from a reddit thread

Links also pinned by @Bumdidlyump on Twitter.
But is there a torrent? I hate these fkin download sites.

i couldn't find a torrent when i looked and went to one of the fkn download sites.

Well the foreign remake has finally turned up and one episode down it just reminds me of how much I love this show. Helps that the first game is Eat or Be Eaten, which is one of the best.

Genius Netherlands, all episodes subbed in English on YouTube

Having gone all the way through, it scratches an itch but it's not as well made. There's only one flash forward/back for example and it's kind of throwaway. The immortality ring is absolutely wasted - ok, I'm comparing it to S2 which it was never going to compete with, but such a wasted opportunity.

It's fine, and I'll watch later seasons if there are any, but don't drop everything to watch it.

finally! thanks for the heads up

update for the uk too

https://tbivision.com/2022/12/08/banijay-brings-korean-format-the-genius-game-to-uk-denmark-norway/

the devil's plan is on netflix US, directed by jung jong-yeon who did the genius. i'm an episode and a half in and it seems like its picking up where the genius left off. ridiculously complex but well-balanced rules, flashbacks, a retired starcraft pro, expressionless dealers, its got it all

It feels much more padded, though. What should be one episode takes two.

ooh thanks for the heads up. from the sound of things it seems to be very much genius s5

the uk version is taking contestant applications right now too: https://thegeniusgameuk.com/ i hope it ends up living up to the original

In the second ep of Devil's Plan and it's absolutely Genius S5, even uses the same graphics style while explaining rules. Agree to a point about how stretches out it feels but much like Genius it uses editing remarkably well to create tension and drama where there would normally be none. Not sure I completely understand what the prison mechanic is for.

Yes, there is an application form for the UK one. < wink >

Ha, this thread made me dream last night that I was mining for Garnets in minecraft.

ok, while the devil's plan was not as good as the genius it was still the best new show on a streaming service since idk when.

things it was missing:

-supers that comment on what the players are thinking when they are being cheeky, dumb, sly, etc
-a song that always plays when someone does something badass and shocking that also breaks someone else's heart (yes i miss "extreme ways" by moby)
-better casting. not everyone can be an evil mastermind but we were seriously lacking a dongmin or a sangmin

things it did well [spoilers ahead]:
-living together. it allows more room for a metagame to develop and it deepens relationships
-prison. a comeback mechanic involving sequestering the losers in a dungeon is exactly what you should do with netflix money
-secret out-of-game advantages. si-won and seok-jin figuring out the code in the pieces and what to do with it was absolutely thrilling

watched a few episodes and the games have been a fair bit more complex than the early genius games were right from the start, which has made them compelling even . the prize matches are interesting as an alternative to the elimination matches from the genius, most of which weren't that great, but i think those were still a more interesting way to deal with eliminations since they gave the opportunity for a comeback. on the other hand, not eliminating anyone immediately is also a positive here

oh i forgot to finish a sentence. *compelling even when there aren't dramatic betrayals happening

I'm about 2/3 through and you're right on what it's missing. Extreme Ways (or an equivalent) would improve things massively, although the editing is a dream.

The bullying has been pretty shocking though and two things stand out: the second (? the one with dice and prison and personal and group rules) was pretty horrific, the pile on pushing specific players back continually - and on no stronger reasoning than they played the roles assigned to them in the previous game. The aftermath next game (the one with the numbers) was also terrible with Dong-joo using weirdly domestic violence defensive language - "it's her fault for choosing to trust him so she deserves everything that's coming to her".

So yeah, still great but the changes from Genius make it lesser.

i'm not sure if the incidents you're referring to stood out to me, but there's almost always some bullying-ish stuff that goes on in these shows that i find disturbing. or at least extremely hierarchical behavior based on seniority. but that's part of what makes the shows interesting, the tension between traditional hierarchical SK social structure and the alternate world of the game that incentivizes breaking those rules. however there was something weirder going on in the devil's plan b/c of orbit's whole MO of creating a big alliance but calling it "saving everyone" instead of a "majority alliance." i think it ironically made their behavior towards those on the outside of the alliance look a lot crueler than it otherwise would've if they'd just called it what it was.

anyway, we get a season two!

https://www.soompi.com/article/1624800wpp/netflixs-the-devils-plan-confirms-production-of-season-2

Thanks for the revival of this thread because I would never have known otherwise now that I don't use twitter where I would faithfully along with Bumdidlyump's subs alerts. I look forward to binging some eps the next few weeks!

Ok, most apparent difference for me was a technological one. Whereas previously I had a dodgy 720p rip with Bumdi's subs overlayed as she was releasing in real time, to seeing this is in outrageous 60fps 4K... so much lip tint, concealer & 성괴 scars... and that's just the men!

Lowkey loved that pro-Go player Yeon-Woo was pretty useless even in her element (the land grab/tetris game)...

...but even moreso that ORBIT only really excelled in the game with the least science/strategy (Hi/Lo which has a huge luck factor in the dealt cards). Probably his edit, but he came off as a tiresome blowhard trying to gamesplain at every opportunity, rarely to any success. Joon-Bin had the sickest burn: "Perhaps keeping your cool is also a science."

Loved the prison (kettle and can wash-up anyone?) but the bonus quest was amazing, tho I wish it had gone to a true underdog at that point.

The living quarters being part of the game gave me flashbacks to Society Game (shout-out to the OGs on this thread).

But yes, more of this, I would love to rewatch The Genius again esp in HD and legit subs.

i try not to think of society game, still scarred by MJ's loss

equation hi/lo required maths skills which is why orbit was able to succeed there. a lot of the other players were just not very good at coming up with optimal equations from their cards.

rewatching S2 before looking at the devil’s plan and it’s a lot of fun obv and also sangmin is obv GOAT but nothing will be the slow burn of discovering the mechanics and possibilities with that group of people in S1.

genuinely one of the best things i’ve watched.

what a great watch - think i prefer this format even if the end was slightly rushed

was also nice to see an - albeit fairly loose - adaptation of Patchwork - probably my favourite board game

i had no idea David Holmes featured so highly in the music selection! but yeah this is a wild mix for triggering show memories.

http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLuHoal-SrkIKNnqjENuBJ0nSTDPDbgHo8