Michael Jackson: Classic or Dud?

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Let me take a wild guess - you are about 22 years old or younger. Am I correct?

hey! ageism! and not true for everyone.. alex in nyc is a lot older than that! (yeah?)

Vic (Vic), Sunday, 9 November 2003 12:17 (twenty years ago) link

i'm 29, but how is that relevant?

And Geir, I don't quite understand your question.

Stephen Stockwell (Stephen Stockwell), Sunday, 9 November 2003 13:52 (twenty years ago) link

Anthony, when you say the jew me screw me kick me kike me line in They Don't Care About Us is pretty rank, do you mean it's just a badly written lyric, or do you mean it's offensive in some way?

If it's the former, then I don't have much of a view either way, it's not great, but in the spectrum of bad lyrics I think it's insignificant.

If it's the latter, I strongly disagree. I never saw ANYTHING remotely offensive or anti-Semetic about that line - surely it's crystal clear (though it didn't seem to be to the world media) to any person who, er, can read, that it was basically saying "yeah, do whatever the hell you want to me, kick me, call me a kike, I remain unbowed"? The whole controversy was absurd. The fact that he eventually changed the lines (to something stupid like "do me, sue me, kick me, strike me") is even more absurd. He should have stuck to his guns.

syntaxfree, Sunday, 9 November 2003 15:22 (twenty years ago) link

I don't quite understand which question you are pointing towards, as I have asked no question :-)

Geir Hongro (GeirHong), Sunday, 9 November 2003 16:33 (twenty years ago) link

Let me take a wild guess - you are about 22 years old or younger. Am I correct?
hey! ageism! and not true for everyone.. alex in nyc is a lot older than that! (yeah?)


I just turned 36. Michael Jackson is, was, and invariably always will be a deplorably overrated side-show freak. Shun him.

Alex in NYC (vassifer), Sunday, 9 November 2003 16:43 (twenty years ago) link

one year passes...
rampant capitalism in action:

via NewsNow this was on the news wire:

The Essential Michael Jackson To Be Released
http://www.undercover.com.au/news/2005/jun05/20050630_michaeljackson.html

Sony-BMG will release the 2CD Michael Jackson compilation, 'The Essential Michael Jackson' on July 15.

DJ Martian (djmartian), Thursday, 30 June 2005 11:11 (eighteen years ago) link

And what better way for one to celebrate their vindication of paedophilia charges (and pay legal costs) than to crank out another compilation. Might Jackson have also overheard those placard-waving fans outside the courthouse on the day of his aquittal agitating for a career comeback?

Stay tuned...

Stephen Stockwell (Stephen Stockwell), Thursday, 30 June 2005 12:40 (eighteen years ago) link

record company exploits publicity to sell records shocker

mark s (mark s), Thursday, 30 June 2005 12:45 (eighteen years ago) link

Disc 1 is HOTT, but my own version is better.

Spencer Chow (spencermfi), Thursday, 30 June 2005 17:25 (eighteen years ago) link

He still sucks.

Alex in NYC (vassifer), Thursday, 30 June 2005 20:26 (eighteen years ago) link

His apologists are almost creepier than he is.

(almost)

Shakey Mo Collier, Thursday, 30 June 2005 20:30 (eighteen years ago) link

"the jew me screw me kick me kike me line ... I never saw ANYTHING remotely offensive or anti-Semetic about that line"

Using the term "Jew" (a noun, an ethnic identifier - NOT A VERB) to connote a negative, stereotyped behavior is totally anti-semitic. gimme a fucking break.

Shakey Mo Collier, Thursday, 30 June 2005 20:39 (eighteen years ago) link

Can I just step out a bit on that point and ask the panel (and the world) how and why anti-Jewish racism has come to be in a class of its own, that's implicitly a greater evil than any other type of racism?

Just bugs me.

Stephen Stockwell (Stephen Stockwell), Thursday, 30 June 2005 22:57 (eighteen years ago) link

I don't consider it in a "class" of its own, I'm not sure what you mean by that.

Shakey Mo Collier, Thursday, 30 June 2005 23:02 (eighteen years ago) link

Has its own term, Shakey. I suppose that's not really much of a point you could hang your coat on, but a lot of the discourse on the subject in the media seems to follow a theme that there's Racism (such as that endured by indigenous Australian's, for example, which we don't really like, find kinda embarssing and hope will one day come to an end), and then there's Anti-Semitism, which seems to absolutely require a coordinated national response between governments, the intelligence community and public.

It's on-the-nose.

Stephen Stockwell (Stephen Stockwell), Friday, 1 July 2005 00:12 (eighteen years ago) link

well, taking your examples, Aborigines are only discriminated against by Australians. Nobody in the rest of the world rarely encounters (much less cares about) Aborigines. Jews, on the other hand, have been stereotyped, vilified, murdered, and otherwise discriminated against in multiple cultures across several continents. For several thousand years. So I imagine the difference in terminology that rankles you (which I think is fairly recent? does the term anti-semite predate the Nazis...?), simply reflects the varying scale of the type of racism in question.

Shakey Mo Collier, Friday, 1 July 2005 15:12 (eighteen years ago) link

classic, of course!

Susan Douglas (Susan Douglas), Friday, 1 July 2005 15:21 (eighteen years ago) link

(I guess my point is that anti-semitism is international and much older than most, more localized, instances of racism, hence the difference in terminology. Tho qualitatively speaking I wouldn't say that anti-semitism is worse than, say, slavery. but such kinds of comparisons aren't really helpful to anybody. "I've been persecuted more than you!" etc. nothing productive there.)

Shakey Mo Collier, Friday, 1 July 2005 15:26 (eighteen years ago) link

anyway back to the topic at hand - Michael's like Elvis: classic for the media spectacle/personal drama, but I don't have any use for the actual music. So duddily classic. I don't own any Elvis or Michael Jackson and don't feel the urge to ever listen to either, really.

Shakey Mo Collier, Friday, 1 July 2005 15:28 (eighteen years ago) link

ten months pass...
classic- The man is a legend. Michael Jackson is the most important musician in our planet. He is definitely the best. He started singing when he was 5 years old, give the guy some credit. Songs like billie jean and Beat it , don't stop till you get enough are easily the best songs in history. I don't know any other popstar who has been successful for 30 years. He is going to be back soon and shock you all!

Tolu, Thursday, 25 May 2006 11:02 (seventeen years ago) link

I don't know any other popstar who has been successful for 30 years.

Um, the Stones? McCartney? Robert Plant? Ozzy? (I know, I shouldn't take the bait...)

Thomas Inskeep (submeat), Thursday, 25 May 2006 20:35 (seventeen years ago) link

but he's been singing SINCE HE WAS FIVE. fuck that Stevie Wonder punkass!

Shakey Mo Collier (Shakey Mo Collier), Thursday, 25 May 2006 20:51 (seventeen years ago) link

Um, the Stones? McCartney? Robert Plant? Ozzy? (I know, I shouldn't take the bait...)

But let's be honest, he's funkier than those dudes.

Jordan (Jordan), Thursday, 25 May 2006 21:03 (seventeen years ago) link

actually I don't think he's funkier than any of them, except maybe Ozzy.

Shakey Mo Collier (Shakey Mo Collier), Thursday, 25 May 2006 21:10 (seventeen years ago) link

Okay.

Jordan (Jordan), Thursday, 25 May 2006 21:13 (seventeen years ago) link

LET'S AGREE TO DISAGREE

Jordan (Jordan), Thursday, 25 May 2006 21:14 (seventeen years ago) link

He is going to be back soon and shock you all!

in the genitals?

latebloomer (latebloomer), Thursday, 25 May 2006 21:32 (seventeen years ago) link

Alex in NYC's hate upthread looks hilarious in retrospect.

Alfred, Lord Sotosyn (Alfred Soto), Thursday, 25 May 2006 21:51 (seventeen years ago) link

it didn't at the time?

J.D. (Justyn Dillingham), Thursday, 25 May 2006 21:54 (seventeen years ago) link

hilariously OTM maybe

Shakey Mo Collier (Shakey Mo Collier), Thursday, 25 May 2006 21:56 (seventeen years ago) link

Michael Jackson is classic, and he has made a lot of great music.

However, he isn't even one hundredth of the Godlike creature that his fanatical fans have turned him into.

Geir Hongro (GeirHong), Thursday, 25 May 2006 22:08 (seventeen years ago) link

oh geirpaws

Shakey Mo Collier (Shakey Mo Collier), Thursday, 25 May 2006 22:10 (seventeen years ago) link

Yeah, but when do you ever meet these fans? I mean, they show up outside the courtroom and google their way to ILM threads, but ... are they even real?

jaymc (jaymc), Thursday, 25 May 2006 22:12 (seventeen years ago) link

they are all old abandoned animatronic Disney robots run amok and only Jacko truly loves them

Shakey Mo Collier (Shakey Mo Collier), Thursday, 25 May 2006 22:13 (seventeen years ago) link

I am a Michael Jackson fan!

Uh, a fan of Michael Jackson's music!

Jordan (Jordan), Friday, 26 May 2006 00:33 (seventeen years ago) link

Alex in NYC's hate upthread looks hilarious in retrospect.

I stand by every word of it.

Alex in NYC (vassifer), Friday, 26 May 2006 01:39 (seventeen years ago) link

they are all old abandoned animatronic Disney robots run amok and only Jacko truly loves them

I just coughed up a cup of coffee for laughing.

Alfred, Lord Sotosyn (Alfred Soto), Friday, 26 May 2006 01:40 (seventeen years ago) link

Hey, Alex! I can send you a YSI of "Morphine" -- a track as anything by Killing Joke.

Alfred, Lord Sotosyn (Alfred Soto), Friday, 26 May 2006 01:41 (seventeen years ago) link

*er, whack

Alfred, Lord Sotosyn (Alfred Soto), Friday, 26 May 2006 01:42 (seventeen years ago) link

eleven months pass...
If guilty pleasures are the best kind, I've just discovered the joy that is "Off The Wall". Against my better judgment, my arse is shaking, and disco is rarely better than that, my friend.

And all because I heard "Rock With You" in a porn shop.

Bimble, Monday, 30 April 2007 00:50 (sixteen years ago) link

eight months pass...

classic (though I'd rather listen to Prince)

I was kinda surprised when I bought HIStory that he says "stop fucking with me" on Scream

Bo Jackson Overdrive, Friday, 11 January 2008 05:36 (sixteen years ago) link

one year passes...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/entertainment/7927497.stm

Page last updated at 08:42 GMT, Friday, 6 March 2009

Jackson eyes $400m comeback plan

By Ian Youngs Music reporter, BBC News

Michael Jackson announces his comeback

Michael Jackson could earn more than $400m (£283m) from a comeback deal involving new music and movies as well as concerts, his promoter has revealed.

The pop superstar has announced 10 gigs at the O2 arena in London this summer.

Randy Phillips, head of AEG Live, which is staging the gigs, said they had a wider deal that could cover a world tour and a 3D film based on Thriller.

He also said: "We're talking to him about helping him figure a new plan for the release of singles, new music."

Last tour

Jackson appeared at the London venue on Thursday to announce his comeback concerts.

He billed them as "the final curtain call" and "my final show performances in London".

Speaking afterwards, Mr Phillips said: "These will be the last shows in London. Whether he will go on from here around the world... this will be his last tour.

"All he's agreed to are the London shows at this point."

He said AEG Live had a "broader relationship" with Jackson.

"We have a film development deal that's part of this to do a film, Thriller 3D," he said.

It would be a new film that could star Jackson himself, he said.

Asked how much Jackson could earn from the ventures, Mr Phillips replied: "If we complete the full three-and-a-half year plan, he could gross over $400m in that time. London could be north of $50m (£35m)."

The star made a five-minute appearance in front of hundreds of screaming fans on Thursday to announce the 10 London dates.

I'll be performing the songs my fans want to hear - this is the final curtain call
Michael Jackson

Is the King of Pop still a thriller?

His first words to fans were: "I love you so much.

"This will be it. When I say this is it, it really means this is it," he added.

"I'll be performing the songs my fans want to hear."

Jackson had been expected to appear at the 02 arena at 1600 GMT, but arrived an hour and a half late for the announcement.

The first concert at the 20,000-capacity venue will be on 8 July, with tickets costing between £50 and £75. They go on general sale on 13 March.

Jackson last toured 12 years ago. In 2006, he performed at the World Music Awards in London, but disappointed fans by singing just a few lines of We Are The World.

Bee OK, Sunday, 8 March 2009 04:50 (fifteen years ago) link

Michael Jackson: Child Molester or Pedophile?

ilxor, Sunday, 8 March 2009 15:19 (fifteen years ago) link

Add on top of that the fact that in real life he's such a freakshow that punks and anarchists everywhere shuld curl up and die with envy, and there's really no question.

OTM. IMO GG Allin has got nothing on Michael Jackson. While obviously MJ is less of a freak than GG, dude went from being the most famous person in the world to a freaky looking creep and child molester, and has lost probably millions of fans as a result: it's not how low you go but how far you fall.

samosa gibreel, Monday, 9 March 2009 02:40 (fifteen years ago) link

Good lord, who cares that MJ out-freaks an idiot like GG Allin? Is that supposed to be a compliment?

thirdalternative, Monday, 9 March 2009 08:48 (fifteen years ago) link

While the court cases have definitely mattered and cause his downfall, they are not the main reason. I think a lot of people are able to say that, well, he seems kind of weird and maybe even creepy, but he was found innocent, and then he should be viewed as innocent.

His downfall has more to do with the constantly detoriating quality of his output. "Off The Wall", "Thriller" and even "Bad" were all fantastic. "Dangerous" and "HIStory" were not, but still quite good. But then, "Invincible" contained hardly anything of value at all.

I think what he would need now is to do an album with Quincy Jones again. Q has earlier showed the ability to get the best of him, and also to take influence from current music, but without losing sense of the typical Jackson style. If the music holds up, people (well, not all, but most) can forgive him for being creepy as long as he isn't proven creepy in an illegal way.

Geir Hongro, Monday, 9 March 2009 13:37 (fifteen years ago) link

The BBC got approx. 9000 hits over the weekend for people typing in "bbc.co.uk/O_2" presumably in an effort to find out ticket information

Tracer Hand, Monday, 9 March 2009 13:41 (fifteen years ago) link

Touring your old hits is always a secure way of getting income for somebody whose artistic prime was in the past. Just as Rolling Stones or AC/DC.

Geir Hongro, Monday, 9 March 2009 13:43 (fifteen years ago) link

Agree with Geir. But I feel as if those first two MJ albums were mostly inspired by the (at the time) new drum machines and synths. I don't know how easily MJ could return to that sound.

Although, looking at shots of his home studio, it looks like MJ's got an eye for "old school"... I saw Distressors and an MPC-60. Chouette!

Regarding his creepiness. After watching that Bashir documentary, I found him to be far less creepy than expected. Considering that he's an extremely famous, vitiligo'd, surgery addicted, child-abused, multi-millionaire, gay dad and (chaste) pederast, he seemed kind of... normal? Like he'd be fun at a dinner party? Bashir, on the other hand, would have two glasses of wine and start talking about boning chicks.

Tourtiere (Owen Pallett), Monday, 9 March 2009 16:23 (fifteen years ago) link

four months pass...

pretty amazing how often the phrase child molester appeared in the thread despite the second case being thrown out, and the first never going to criminal court (and rumors flying that Jordan Chandler may come forward and say the allegations were false)....

III IV V (Bo Jackson Overdrive), Wednesday, 15 July 2009 04:09 (fourteen years ago) link


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