taking sides: lyndon baines johnson vs. richard milhous nixon

oh you're all over here. i put this on that reagan thread:

perlstein update! they're going after him for plagiarism

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/08/05/business/media/rick-perlsteins-the-invisible-bridge-draws-criticism.html

oh i'm for sure buying it now.

― ♪♫ teenage wasteman ♪♫ (goole), Tuesday, August 5, 2014 11:06 AM (15 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

yeah that 'controversy' is laughable

I've done enough research to sympathize with any attempt to simply the act of collation.

having the endnotes on a website makes perfect sense to me.

i mean, nixonland almost broke my back carrying it around while i was reading it.

sorry morbs, as per usual i foolishly assumed your posting on a message board full of ppl with diverse views meant you were interested in a conversation, as opposed to just throwing out glib statements with an undertone of "y'all can't handle the truth" and offering either more of the same or "fuck you" when asked to back them up, will try to avoid making that mistake in the future.

go have a conversation with 'balls'

morbs when you're curled up on the floor in the middle of the night, crying and moaning about how you turned into such a dumb miserable fuck, a bigot playing out his last days online defending child rape and richard nixon, when you're there on the floor, thinking about how it'll all be over soon and how few will notice and fewer still care, do you take those deep intake sobs where it's almost like you're hyperventilating and you can hear the emptiness of your thick skull? cuz that's how i picture. or do you just lie there, silent, unblinking, urinating all over yrself? the latter seems to subtle and lacking of self pity for you ime so it's the sobs right?

Man what is your problem

bumping to flag that post

wtf balls

let's all use our FPs judiciously

i bet that sounded really great in your head

i said it out loud b4 i typed

(test the good stuff that way)

the armond white of political opinions

hey hey now balls, that was a mean thing to say to the guy who told you to die

mine was an xp but whatevs

"go die" is standard Tombot shit

also Obama needs to be credited with his share of the billions (ie everyone) who will die in climate change

'superior' to Nixon in prosecuting whistleblowers as well

oh no Armondized by the guy who worships Brian fucking de Palma

hooray!

i support balls

hang in there balls

example #2,457,478 in the never-ending "morbz can dish it out but can't take it" exhibition:

http://www.ashcroftsurgery.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/crying-baby.jpg

http://www.gotfuturama.com/Multimedia/FrameGrabs/2ACV17/Grabs/pic00612.jpg

What balls said was disgusting. No amount of obtuseness or dickishness can justify that sort of post. Wtf is wrong with everyone

Nixon.

http://i.imgur.com/HNaVoNk.jpg

^^^ A+

all i'm saying is, don't throw a punch if you've got a glass jaw.

that shit is Nixonian (to bring this back to something related to this thread's purpose).

yer still a sad little creep

Morbs, his point is legit whether you acknowledge it or not.

per the new board style, no more name-calling from me til ppl get cancer.

as you were

http://www.whha.org/photographs/white-house-administrations/images/nixon-oval-office-on-phone.jpg

"When you're curled up on the floor in the middle of the night, crying and moaning about how you turned into such a dumb miserable fuck, how few will notice and fewer still care, do you take those deep intake sobs where it's almost like you're hyperventilating and you can hear the emptiness of your thick skull?"

http://31.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mdoodyh7bZ1qe7o43o1_500.jpg

"What? Who is this?"

http://www.motherjones.com/files/nixon-phone.jpg

"Yeah, that's what I thought." *click*

http://www.whitehousemuseum.org/west-wing/oval-office/oval-office-1969-apollo.jpg

"When you're curled up on the floor in the middle of the night, crying and moaning about how you turned into such a dumb miserable fuck, how few will notice and fewer still care, do you take those deep intake sobs where it's almost like you're hyperventilating and you can hear the emptiness of your thick skull?"

http://pixel.nymag.com/imgs/daily/intel/2011/03/25/25_reagan.o.jpg/a_560x375.jpg

"Sorry. Couldn't quite make out that last part!"

http://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Guardian/About/General/2013/6/13/1371125278391/Richard-Nixon-007.jpg

"Damn, nothing gets to that guy."

http://thewallbreakers.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/JFK_1960_21.jpg

"When you're curled up on the floor in the middle of the night, crying and moaning about how you turned into such a dumb miserable fuck, how few will notice and fewer still care, do you take those deep intake sobs where it's almost like you're hyperventilating and you can hear the emptiness of your thick skull?"

http://blog.chron.com/txpotomac/files/legacy/lbj.jpg

"Wait, now just wait. Not sure how I got this iPhone here in 1969, but just wait a cotton-picking second here while I work this thing out. Bird!"

http://www.hrc.utexas.edu/exhibitions/web/ddd/includes/images/475/185.jpg

"Goddamm chickenshit hillbillies."

Amazing thing about this pair is that I think they would have really gotten each other. Not liked each other at all but here's two proper old-school prewar assholes who probably saw most of the changes taking place in America through fairly similar lenses - can't see Nixon loathing LBJ the way he would the Kennedys or whoever. I'm sure there's actual facts to back up/contradict this reading.

http://blog.nixonfoundation.org/files/2011/05/1.jpg

They both disliked the Kennedys. They both came from the West. They both had the same us-or-them attitude about everyone they met. Had it not been for Nixon purposefully sabotaging peace plans to end the war in 1968, they might've become buds.

i'd like to think that chair in the foreground is obscuring, like, a giant bowl of ham salad

Here is the leader of the free world and his would-be successors sounding like they're callers on the Paul Finebaum Show.

President Johnson: Now--so I think it’s very important this be confidential. Do you know whether your talking to me is knowledge to any of your people?

Nixon: Well, in my case, the phone was picked up by somebody here. I’m at the Union Station in Kansas City. The phone was picked up by somebody else. It may be known, but I will seal them down. I’ll just tell them we got a routine report.

President Johnson: OK. If anybody asks, we will not mention it here. If they ask us, we'll say that we stated the facts as we see them, namely, that there has been no agreement between us, that we will constantly negotiate, and when there is, why, the candidates will be among the first informed...

Humphrey: Mr. President?

President Johnson: Yes?

Humphrey: It’s obvious that I’m here at a school and I’m all alone. There’s nobody with me, and they do not know that I’ve got a call from you. But I’ve been held up in a meeting, and that press is always very alert. I’m just simply--is it all right just simply to say that we’ve had our regular report?

Nixon: That’s good.

Politically, however, (JFK and Nixon) were not continents apart. They agreed, for example, on the threat of communism. Kennedy had voted to continue funding the House Un-American Activities Committee (HUAC) and favored the latest version of the Mundt-Nixon internal-security bill. Like Nixon, he strongly hinted that Truman’s policy of vacillation had led to “losing” China and inviting Communist advances in Korea. He favored aid to Franco’s Spain and vast increases in the Pentagon budget.

Both congressmen felt that organized labor had grown too powerful. Earlier that year, upon receiving an honorary degree at Notre Dame, Kennedy had warned of the “ever expanding power of the Federal government” and “putting all major problems” into the all-absorbing hands of the great Leviathan the state....

Speaking to a group of students at Harvard three days after the election that autumn, Congressman Kennedy remarked that he was “personally very happy” that Nixon had defeated Helen Douglas. He reportedly explained that Douglas was “not the sort of person I like working with on committees,” but he did not make clear whether this was because of her manner, her politics, or her gender. On November 14, Kennedy wrote his friend Paul Fay, “I was glad to…see Nixon win by a big vote,” and he predicted that the winner would go far in national GOP politics, for he was “an outstanding guy.”

http://www.thenation.com/blog/168769/when-jfk-backed-nixon-against-progressive-woman#

Amazing thing about this pair is that I think they would have really gotten each other. Not liked each other at all but here's two proper old-school prewar assholes who probably saw most of the changes taking place in America through fairly similar lense

oh you weren't talking about Morbs and balls

JFK ran "to the right" of Nixon on the missile gap (which didn't exist). He talked tougher than Ike ever did.

LBJ and Nixon had mutual respect: both in the Congress at the same time, both loving J. Edgar Hoover. Nixon more afraid of LBJ, who wasn't afraid of anyone. Never understood why in the last year of his life he didn't just say "ah fuck it I'm dying" and release what he knew about the Nixon people and Chennault.

ask Oliver Stone

certainly by 1969 Nixon was scared shitless of J Edgar

you can tell i'm a postwar asshole bcz i'm culling my FB friends list

In everything I've ever read on Nixon, I think it's the commonly held view that he and LBJ were in sync on most everything by '68 and '69.

Nixon and Haldeman were careful to give LBJ any national security briefings they got: keep your enemies close, etc

I can't quite remember--was it LBJ's preference even that Nixon won in '68? I know that seems like a stretch, but I seem to remember that he had very mixed feelings about Humphrey.

LBJ was a mess by the end. He held evidence that Nixon's people had approached through an independent operative (Chennaut) the South Vietnamese about holding out (prob because LBJ had bugged Nixon's people) and thought Nixon would try to dismantle the Great Society.

These guys - Nixon, John Dean, Bob Haldeman - trying to figure out how to excuse their tape recordings by using the "he did it too!" defense, going back to LBJ bugging Nixon's plane and discovering the whole Chennault affair.

President Nixon: The difficulty with using it, of course, is that it reflects on Johnson.

Dean: Right.

President Nixon: He ordered it. If it weren't for that, I'd use it. Is there any way we could use it without reflecting on Johnson? How--“could we say that the Democratic National Committee did it? No, the FBI did the bugging, though.

Haldeman: That's the problem.

Dean: Is it going to reflect on Johnson or Humphrey?

Haldeman: Johnson. Humphrey didn't do it.

Dean: Humphrey didn't do it?

President Nixon: Oh, hell no.

Haldeman: He was bugging Humphrey, too.

All three men laugh.

President Nixon: Well, God damn.

Haldeman laughs.

Nixon was in the Senate while LBJ was there, not to mention he was VP when LBJ was Senate Majority Leader. the real story is that there's so little about their interactions till 1968 or so -- given all of the info about the both of them out there now, neither was really on the other's radar until late in the game. unless there's some book on LBJ and Nixon interacting that i've missed.