Most well-known songs based around a major seven chord?

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Yes, that's it.

Hurting (Hurting), Monday, 24 October 2005 15:09 (eighteen years ago) link

D///Dmaj7///D7///Dmaj7/// - jangly 90s pop, sweet-voiced female singer ...

Hahahaha it's The Cranberries' first single.

joseph cotten (joseph cotten), Monday, 24 October 2005 15:10 (eighteen years ago) link

Another more or less recent use of conspicuous D / Dmaj7 / D7 is REM's "Find The River."

joseph cotten (joseph cotten), Monday, 24 October 2005 15:11 (eighteen years ago) link

I've been waiting for Geir or Tim to mention "This Boy."

k/l (Ken L), Monday, 24 October 2005 15:13 (eighteen years ago) link

Yeah, and there are major 7ths all over the Hard Day's Night album.

darin (darin), Monday, 24 October 2005 15:31 (eighteen years ago) link

The main riff in the Smashing Pumpkin's "1979" features a major 7th before it resolves.

ajlee, Monday, 24 October 2005 15:40 (eighteen years ago) link

And "Misty"! Did anyone say "Misty"?
(xp)

dr. phil (josh langhoff), Monday, 24 October 2005 15:42 (eighteen years ago) link

and speaking of "1979", I seem to remember that the refrain of Liz Phair's "Rock Me" sounds exactly like the "1979" riff--so that'd count, too

dr. phil (josh langhoff), Monday, 24 October 2005 15:43 (eighteen years ago) link

Everybody's Talkin

Jamie T Smith (Jamie T Smith), Monday, 24 October 2005 16:05 (eighteen years ago) link

Tom Waits, "The Heart of Saturday Night," the vamp that serves as the hook and leads off the verse is an oscilation between Dmaj and Dmaj7. Lovely little thing.

Eppy (Eppy), Monday, 24 October 2005 16:21 (eighteen years ago) link

ha, this far and no ones mentioned the Cocteau Twins????

zappi (joni), Monday, 24 October 2005 16:25 (eighteen years ago) link

Maybe because there are a million bands that use maj-7th chords that also haven't been named?

jaymc (jaymc), Monday, 24 October 2005 16:29 (eighteen years ago) link

I CAN'T BELIEVE NO ONE HAS MENTIONED BEN FOLDS FIVE.

jaymc (jaymc), Monday, 24 October 2005 16:31 (eighteen years ago) link

uh? are you thinking of dominant 7ths?

zappi (joni), Monday, 24 October 2005 16:36 (eighteen years ago) link

No.

jaymc (jaymc), Monday, 24 October 2005 16:40 (eighteen years ago) link

I'm pretty clueless about identifying chords by their sound (having never had any training in music whatsoever will do that...), but if I've learned anything from this thread, it's that I'm apparently a big sucker for the sound of major seventh chords.

Matthew C Perpetua (inca), Monday, 24 October 2005 16:40 (eighteen years ago) link

um. i doubt that there are millions of bands using major 7th chords. most bands don't go beyond major & minor. the cocteaus used them in nearly every song they wrote.

x-post

zappi (joni), Monday, 24 October 2005 16:43 (eighteen years ago) link

(xpost) For instance, the beginning of "Battle of Who Could Care Less."

jaymc (jaymc), Monday, 24 October 2005 16:43 (eighteen years ago) link

No, I know there aren't millions, Zappi. Forgive my hyperbole. But there's quite a few, so it seems weird to be surprised that one particular band hasn't been mentioned. Here's another band that hasn't been mentioned: The Sea and Cake.

Matthew, knowing your tastes, I think your instinct is probably correct.

jaymc (jaymc), Monday, 24 October 2005 16:45 (eighteen years ago) link

ha, this far and no ones mentioned the Cocteau Twins????

yes, "Sugar Hiccup" is Major 7th heaven!

Love - Forever Changes is loaded with them too, very prominent in "Andmoreagain", "The Red Telephone", etc. Bryan MacLean was bigtime into 7ths & 9ths, Major & minor.

Paul (scifisoul), Monday, 24 October 2005 17:11 (eighteen years ago) link

Yeah, I bet a lot of the 70s soft rock you like is big into major 7ths. I'm pretty wary of them but when they're right for a song, they kill.

Eppy (Eppy), Monday, 24 October 2005 17:13 (eighteen years ago) link

Not very well known but the Palace Brothers' "Gulf Shores" is built around Amaj7.

gygax! (gygax!), Monday, 24 October 2005 17:15 (eighteen years ago) link

Perhaps the earliest well-known piece with major-7th chords is Erik Satie's "Trois Gymnopedies."

this is always what I think of when asked to explain what a maj-maj-7th chord is

Dominique (dleone), Monday, 24 October 2005 17:16 (eighteen years ago) link

Wait, what is a maj-maj-7th chord?

jaymc (jaymc), Monday, 24 October 2005 17:18 (eighteen years ago) link

Yeah, I bet a lot of the 70s soft rock you like is big into major 7ths.

Yes, "Close to You" is prob. a textbook example.

jaymc (jaymc), Monday, 24 October 2005 17:19 (eighteen years ago) link

(Although to be honest there's probably more min-7ths in that one than maj-7ths.)

jaymc (jaymc), Monday, 24 October 2005 17:23 (eighteen years ago) link

Wait, what is a maj-maj-7th chord?

major triad + a major 7th added (eg, C-E-G-B)

Dominique (dleone), Monday, 24 October 2005 17:23 (eighteen years ago) link

How is that different from a plain old maj-7th chord?

jaymc (jaymc), Monday, 24 October 2005 17:23 (eighteen years ago) link

well, technically speaking, if you just say "maj 7", you're only referring to that 7th note in the scale, and not to the tonality of the chord (like major or minor)

Dominique (dleone), Monday, 24 October 2005 17:24 (eighteen years ago) link

Ah yes, good one. It has a more maj-7 feel though I think.

Eppy (Eppy), Monday, 24 October 2005 17:25 (eighteen years ago) link

Dominique, so would C-Eb-G-B be a min-maj-7th?

jaymc (jaymc), Monday, 24 October 2005 17:26 (eighteen years ago) link

yep

Dominique (dleone), Monday, 24 October 2005 17:26 (eighteen years ago) link

What about the great min-maj-7 chord, as featured in "Michelle" and loads of other songs, "Summer Rain" maybe?

(xpost)

k/l (Ken L), Monday, 24 October 2005 17:32 (eighteen years ago) link

c-eflat-g-b isn't a minor seventh, a minor seventh would include b-flat. that'd be some kinda augmented chord.

the thing about major sevenths is that they're sweet chords; dominant sevenths are brassier, harder. plus, and correct me if i'm wrong, but a major seventh does refer to the major/minor tonality, because in C, a minor seventh can only contain the two flat notes that are in the minor scale, right? minor sevenths are very warm chords, and one of the things about the Beatles around the time of "Hard Day's Night" and "For Sale" is the fact that they were using them; "What You're Doing" is a good example, I think.

edd s hurt (ddduncan), Monday, 24 October 2005 17:35 (eighteen years ago) link

No one is saying C-Eb-G-B is a minor-7th, they're saying it's a minor-major-7th. I'd never heard of that terminology, but I'm ceding to the dude (Dom) who's studied music theory.

Re sweet chords: I've always thought of them as bittersweet, specifically, because they encapsulate both a major triad (C-E-G) and a minor triad (E-G-B).

jaymc (jaymc), Monday, 24 October 2005 17:37 (eighteen years ago) link

(x-post)

c-eflat-g-b isn't a minor seventh
right

plus, and correct me if i'm wrong, but a major seventh does refer to the major/minor tonality, because in C, a minor seventh can only contain the two flat notes that are in the minor scale, right?

it doesn't, because when notated on a chart, you'll either see:
C7 : refers to a major chord with a flatted 7th
C-7 : refers to a minor chord with a flatted 7th
Cmaj7 : refers to a maj chord with a maj 7th
C-(maj7) : refers to a minor chord with a maj 7th
C+7 : refers to an aug chord with a flatted 7th
C+(maj7) : refers to an aug chord with a maj 7th, tho at this point, you could also notate as E+(maj7) or G#+(maj7) - or E/C for that matter, if you wanted the scale to be E based instead of C based

also note, for minor scales, you should never take for granted that they are referring to any one particular kind. in jazz, usually you're talking about melodic minors (especially in be-bop and beyond charts - though it really depends on the notes of the melody, all cues about what's "correct" come from there)

Dominique (dleone), Monday, 24 October 2005 17:42 (eighteen years ago) link

jaymc otm re: bittersweet. there is a little cliche melody where you play this little half-step thingie- from the major 7th to the root - over and over, that always sounds pretty sad to me. Only examples I can think of right now are the Replacements, "Left of The Dial" and the aforementioned Dinosaur Jr. "Severed Lips." I wanna say Neil Young uses it too, "Powderfinger" maybe?

Dom, I always thought the default minor scale in jazz is Dorian.

k/l (Ken L), Monday, 24 October 2005 17:49 (eighteen years ago) link

Another common way to write Cmaj7: CΔ7

k/l (Ken L), Monday, 24 October 2005 17:54 (eighteen years ago) link

Dang, I don't think I need the 7 after the delta.

k/l (Ken L), Monday, 24 October 2005 17:54 (eighteen years ago) link

(x-post)

well, dorian is actually not technically "minor" scale - it's a mode, which just happens to share the note intervals of the "natural minor" scale. I wouldn't say it was the default one though - Miles Davis used modes on a lot of his late 50s and early 60s records, but for the most part jazz players were using minor scales that contained major 6ths and 7ths (which the natural [and dorian mode] does not)

and keep in mind, one of the most common things jazz improvisers will do is to add notes that aren't technically in the scale when they improvise - hence you get a lot of "chromatic" figures, or figures that that when taken on their own (apart from the context of the entire solo), seem out of the key entirely. see john coltrane especially

Dominique (dleone), Monday, 24 October 2005 17:59 (eighteen years ago) link

ha, and that's not even right - dorian mode has a major 6th, which natural minor does not. I need to download the new service pack to my college theory memory

Dominique (dleone), Monday, 24 October 2005 18:02 (eighteen years ago) link

Oh I wasn't talking about soloists, just those lowly accompanists known as bass players.

(xpost)

k/l (Ken L), Monday, 24 October 2005 18:04 (eighteen years ago) link

hmm, well as a one time jazz soloist, the rule is follow me, damnit! ;)

Dominique (dleone), Monday, 24 October 2005 18:10 (eighteen years ago) link

that'd be some kinda augmented chord.
edd, I think that chord mainly appears when you have a minor chord and then a (bass)line that moves down from the root to the major seventh to the minor seventh to the sixth. Which is another pretty common trick, apparently. You'll know it when you hear it.

k/l (Ken L), Monday, 24 October 2005 18:46 (eighteen years ago) link

Let's not kid ourselves here, for 99% of the world, saying "C major 7th" means a major chord, i.e. play E natural.

Keith C (lync0), Monday, 24 October 2005 19:07 (eighteen years ago) link

No it doesn't. It means nothing to about 80% of the world and the right thing to most of the rest.

joseph cotten (joseph cotten), Monday, 24 October 2005 19:13 (eighteen years ago) link

Let's throw "I'm Not In Love" into the mix. It's a love song to the major seventh chord.

Sang Freud (jeff_s), Monday, 24 October 2005 19:32 (eighteen years ago) link

The maj7 chord sounds a bit melancholic to me. I love it actually. Weren't there a lot of maj7s in late 80's Smiths-influenced jangly indie (like The Sundays)? The one song that comes to mind right now is Morrissey's "Tony the Pony".

daavid (daavid), Monday, 24 October 2005 19:36 (eighteen years ago) link

four weeks pass...
edd, I think I just heard that minor chord thing with the descending line incl. major 7th on your favorite record, Two Yanks In England, on the track "Fifi the Flea."

k/l (Ken L), Monday, 21 November 2005 22:19 (eighteen years ago) link

Tears for Fears' "Pale Shelter," if that counts as a well-known song.

Curt1s St3ph3ns, Monday, 21 November 2005 22:35 (eighteen years ago) link

my fave Ronettes song - "Do I Love You"

Paul (scifisoul), Saturday, 10 December 2005 01:51 (eighteen years ago) link


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