Big & Rich: Album of the Decade?

Then it's even more genius! Haha, Chuck must now champion the Balaam and the Angel revival.

<1. That they are a total and long-deserved slap in the fact to the sexless white-bread goody-goody PURITANISM of country, as typified not only by alt-style No Depression horseshit but also by such semi-talented superstar bores as George Strait, Randy Travis, Alan Jackson, Clint Black, etc (all of whom have a few great moments, but who cares. Especially now.)

2. That their sudden ubiquitousness on country stations may well represent the most quantum leap taken by ANY musical genre in, I dunno, decades. At least.>>

Chuck, I get what you're saying here, and I kinda agree, but do you really think Big & Rich is that big a leap from the ironic jiggle-and-bling videos that have been all over mainstream country for at least the past 5 years? the quasi-hip hop bravado of Toby Keith, etc? I mean, B&R definitely are the most dramatic shift in this direction so far, but I don't see it as that surprising or unprecedented.

also, I like the song too, but I think it's kinda funny (and maybe a little inspiring) that the unbridled enthusiasm of a couple key people can suddenly turn ILM's attention toward a record most people here would otherwise never touch with a ten foot pole.

As I sorta note above, though, most of what mainstream country I hear courtesy of my dad just turns me off because it's neither here nor there -- so when Chuck articulates the differences so well, combined with his general enthusiasm, then I'm intrigued. To be honest Toby Keith does jack shit for me.

I dunno. This whole country/hip-hop synergy has been the "Next Big Thing" on ILM for some time now. Though it remains to be seen if it has more staying power (as opposed to novelty value) when approached from the country direction (a la Big & Rich) than when approached from the hip-hop side (a la Bubba Sparxxx). Still I'm intrigued enough to give it a listen if I get a chance.

The attitude on these guys reminds me as much of Jerry Jeff Walker as it does oh Hank Jr.

damn, have I become
a "key people" around here?
IS IT THAT BAD THEN?

Amazon has a Cowboy Troy album and one mp3 download ("Tae Kwon Flow") I could get (the other one didn't work). Album was released 2 years ago, but the mp3 just was added last month. Not particularly exciting, but good for obsessive completists such as myself.

So yeah, I totally admit there has been lots of dancey country and lots of non-puritan country (and I've written about tons of it) over the past decade or so -- not just Toby and Hank Jr (whose last couple albums are real good, actually), but everybody from Confederate Railroad and Kentucky Headhunters and Sawyer Brown to Montgomery Gentry and Brooks and Dunn and Kenny Chesney, obviously. And that's only the guys -- girls like Leann Rimes and Shania Twain and Faith Hill and Joe Dee Messina (and even Dolly Parton, way back with "Romeo" a decade or so ago) have actually been braver about dance beats and r&b than the guys have been. I've been saying all this all along. And right, Toby has used talked vocal rhythms, and the Bellamy Brothers had a song called "Country Rap" way back in the late '80s, as I recall. (And country rap goes back way further than hip-hop, to Commander Cody and Charlie Daniels and Roger Miller; I've spilled hundreds of words on this over the years, and it's even gotten me in a couple fights on ILM.) That said, it all felt *held back* and *cordoned off* til now somehow, in a way that Big & Rich don't, to me, at all -- held back rhythmically, but also glitz-wise, and humor wise, and brains wise, and colorfulness wise, and tossing everything into the pot like Disco Tex and the Sexolettes or the Skatt Bros used to wise. I guess somebody could make the argument (like I tend to do with lots of *other* music) that Big & Rich are just taking the glitz and rhythm that was already there in country and making a BIG DEAL of it, putting neon lights around it, saying loookit us we're really eclectic aren't you impressed even though Toby Keith and Shania (say) were already eclectic as hell. I'm surprised nobody's tossed that argument (my own biggest shtick!) back at me, because I'm not positive I'd know what to say. I mean -- so country has a BECK now, who gives a shit, right? They lead off the album TELLING us how open-minded about black folks they are, asking us to pat them on the back for it, right? And their beats still aren't Timbaland's, I suppose. And disco was almost two decades ago, right? And Cowboy Troy raps like it's 1979. Those are all valid complaints, I guess, but somehow they manage not to diminish the record for me; I'm not sure I *know* why, yet. Part of me believes Big & Rich are inventing NEW rhythms, anyway; doing disco and fiddle jigs and '60s dance rock AT THE SAME TIME, somehow. I dunno; I've tried to break down why the music MOVES so much, and I tried to talk about it in my piece, but maybe I didn't pull it off. And I've never been good at talking about voices, and Big & Rich's are great. Plus, I LIKE how people rapped in 1979, so sue me. But thing is, all these things I say above are not complaints people seem to me making about this record, so maybe I'm not alone in not worrying too much about all this stuff. Oddly, people talk about the rap and race thing, but nobody has commented to me about the paragraph in my review when I talk about how Big & Rich repeatedly beg the GAYNESS question, in what seems a very intentional way. Which, too, is obviously not entirely unprecedented; Garth Brooks had a song about his gay sister or something like that, and there have been gay two-step clubs for years. And I've written about that before, too. But Big & Rich just go FARTHER, somehow. But, uh, maybe I'm just talking in circles here. Upshot is, I think that this record does what DISCO used to do, and very few records of ANY kind do that anymore. What do you guys think?

It's also possible, of course, that there have been lots of jiggle and bling videos I've never seen - I never saw Toby's "Who's Your Daddy," for instance, which Matos says was great, and I believe him. (It's definitely a great song.) So maybe I'm just clueless?

re: gayness - yeah, the one guy (Rich? or is it Big?) with the mustache and the higher voice has a very Freddy Mercury/cowboy from the Village People vibe going on.

"Devil Went Down to Georgia" equated disco w/ Satan!

Good call, Al -- "Drinkin' About You" could so easily be on A Night at the Opera or A Day at the Races!

Oops, disco was almost THREE decades ago, I meant!

B&R video vs notorious Queen record-launch party with nude midget bicyclists or whatever

From their press bio: "The play country music, but country music that has room for echoes of everything from the Everly Brothers to Limp Bizkit to Queen, from honky tonk to rock 'n' rap."

it's inclusiveness,
throwing those gates open wide,
country as Country

refusal to bend,
if we're feeling ten feet tall
then screw the midgets

Given the deliberate all-inclusiveness and all-over-the-mapness, I'm starting consider the spectre of a "TS: Big & Rich vs. Outkast" thread (and yet I fear, deeply).

(starting *to* consider, duh)

It's not really the new ideas on the record that strikes me, because, yes, probably all the elements on the record have been done before. I guess you could argue that it's the synthesis of all the elements that's new, but a) I don't know if that's really the case, and b) I'm fairly certain that's not what makes the record so fun to listen to. For me, it's the irrepresible energy and sense of humour, and the flawless production of the thing that has it in the lead for my summer album. The gorgeous harmonies, the crisp production, the hilarious sound effects (see the sound of sucking on a longneck in "Save a Horse"), and the sense energetic ease that permeates the record are what make it so addictive. Somehow that combination is what feels new.

FWIW, "the race thing" is probably the most irritating thing on the record to me. I can't really listen to Love Train (even though I love the fact that they just decided to call their song Love Train, as if it didn't matter that there already was a Love Train--it's a great little snapshot of their "Fuck it" attitude) because the lyrics are just too hard to take: "The whole color thing's never made sense to me." Really? It hasn't? That's shocking. You think we should all just get along? Can I subsribe to your newsletter? To me, this line by itself undercuts some of the other actually interesting stuff about race on the alum.

While it sounds hamhanded (still haven't had a chance to pick up the record), it's not like American society in general is over that issue anyway...

am i the only one who hears the tractors in a big way?

Plus, "we're all mixed up anyway" is a pretty great line!

xpost

x-post, Ned, the thing I hate about that line is not that it's hamhanded but that it's smug and willfully ignorant. I hear it as "Gee, I'm really enlightened and color-blind and I don't see what all you folks are making a big fuss about."

I think that attitude is total horseshit. They might as well sing "some of my best friends are black!" Though that's obviously implied on the record, of course.

Musicians not being social scientists in general shockah! (I see your point, Scott, but I've long since learned not to be surprised by strange attitudes in music or out of it, to put it politely.)

Yeah, yeah, I know, I shouldn't care. This is just one of those cases where I can't get over the cringe factor, so I have just started skipping the song.

There's a reason I let most lyrics slip by!

>am i the only one who hears the tractors in a big way? <

What tractors, Yancey?? You mean the country group by that name, from a few years ago, who I remember nothing about, assuming that was even their name? Were they even any good? (I thought they were some corny retro act, but maybe I was as wrong about them as I was about the Kentucky Headhunters, who I stupidly ignored back when they actually had hits.) I do know that some people think Kenny Chesny's tractor is sexy, though. (Unless that was Marc Chesnutt's tractor; I forget.)

I do find "Love Train" to be a weak link. But the race thing is not what gets to me most: "So let's forget about ... how the Bulls are playin' without Jordan on the team." Boy, that one really gets me. Otherwise...well, I don't need to repeat myself here. I'll just do it in other threads.

Entertainment Weekly actually compared Big & Rich to the Mavericks, which I guess might make sense as far as the harmonies are concerned, but not beyond that, as far I can figure...

xpost

haha, FrankE, I think that's the only part of the song I really like!

I agree with Scott. My second favorite band of all time, the Drive By Truckers, have lyrics on Southern Rock Opera that make me cringe. Mostly it's Patterson's songs ("hate's the only thing that my truck would wanna drag") - and it is hamfisted and obvious and more than a tad bit obsequious. Like, just by being white Southerners they have to go the exta mile to somehow prove they're not prejudiced or something. Fuck that shit.

that's funny you mention them b/c I've been looking for bands that reminded me of DBT and Big and Rich is just about the closest I've come so far, not in the sense that they sound a whole bunch alike, but that I like Big and Rich for the same reasons I like DBT - b/c they're country but they still play some mean-ass rock, that the lyrics are funny and self-deprecating without being corny or parodic (SCOTS to thread), that they've got a real genuine, 21st century "Southern" feel to them rather than a No Depression dustbowl aesthetic or a pop-country Anytown, USA Mall-of-America vibe either.

Overall, I still prefer DBT's lyrics but I think Big and Rich have got better hooks, both great bands in my book.

Big & Rich have a WAY more swinging rhythm section, though. Which means they rock harder. (Even when DBT were trying to be Skynyrd, they never seemed to understand that "Sweet Home Alabama" and "Saturday Night Special" and "Gimme Three Steps" and "What's Your Name" are DANCE songs. Their new album, the two times I played it, seemed even more mellow than their last one, which I still say was completely bland compared to *Southern Rock Opera.* But I'm apparently the only person who thinks that, so it's probably just best to ignore my dumb opinion and move on...)

21st-century Parrotheads

Jimmy Buffett (and calypso & western in general) is underrated by most non-Parrotheads, actually. (And besides B&R don't sound nearly as parrot-like as the Bellamy Brothers, David Allen Coe, Garth Brooks, and Kenny Chesney have at certain points in their careers. Which isn't to pretend they *never* sound like Buffett.)

I dunno. I assume Love Train was written a long time ago. Being from Chicago, trust me, we've forgotten.

so you've heard the new DBT, Chuck? You really don't like it? I've heard I think at least half of the songs live and I thought they were great, esp. "Daddy's Cup," "Carl Perkins' Cadillac," and "Danko/Manuel"

no way MV dude,
have you heard Kenny Chesney?
THAT guy wants the Reef

Big and Rich are quite
aggressive and flashy in
their lyrical approach

It's criminal I haven't been given the opportunity to hear The Dirty South yet...

The rhythm section might be better (or worse) now that Isbell's wife is playing bass for them (Earl Hicks left the band, right?)

yeah i know, i've been harassing their PR girl for about six months now about it, she sent me Patterson's CD but still no Dirty South, and I'd think I would get dibs since I'm in Athens!

and that's true about Shonna Isbell being the new bassist, when I saw them play last year here in town she was terrific, a great new addition.

not to turn the conversation too far from Big and Rich cuz their album is terrific, even though I think I like Gretchen Wilson a smidge more.

Oh my god are these guys terrible. When my mom told me my grandfather died, it sounded better than that fucking Save a Horse Ride a Cowboy song.

OK, because of this thread, I bought the Big & Rich album a few hours ago, and I can't remember the last time I've been as torn. Some of it just out and out sucks ass - I mean, I was embarrassed to be playing "Rollin" with the windows open - but some of it is fantastic. I love "The Big Time" and "Kick My Ass" SO much - but there are parts of this album where I actually caught myself cringing and wondering for a second what the fuck I was listening to.

Anyone who likes the black cowboy rapper, whatever the fuck his name is, is batshit - he's TERRIBLE. That song he's on is inexcusably awful. Awful kanawful. Totally without merit.

Overall, I dig the album. Not sellin' it back. I'm definitely sold on the homoerotic angle yall got goin upthread too, even the booklet speaks volumes.

Are there any available solo recordings? Who's who? Does Big do most of the lead vocals or is it John Rich?

a few minutes after watching the video for the hundredth time today, I got into my car and put on Aerosmith's Pump, which struck me as a good parallel to Big & Rich - as slick as its contemporaries and maybe even as calculated or restrained, but so much more fun and harder rocking.

It takes something really really special to reference the word "country" and still get me interested. What that means is, I'll check this out, but the odds are pretty slim.

can't be bothered to see if anyone has linked to the video for "save a horse" yet, so in case not, here you go:

http://wmm.warnermusic.ca/ecard/big&rich/

i just put this up on friday afternoon and it hasn't been sent out yet. there appear to be problems with the windows media stream, so i recommend choosing the realplayer option for now.

And then America tells him to step right up despite not allowing him to buy a glass of whiskey.

— John Legend (@johnlegend) May 28, 2022