Rideshare services - Uber, Lyft, Hailo, etc.

the day upworthy breaks the story of the lyft murderer who drove his victims to an airbnb death dungeon is the day u know ur paradigm has truly been disrupted

"Please rate your driver"

Echoing that taxis are fine if you can get them -- in SF, depending on where you are and what time it is, sometimes you might as well walk. Lyft has the app and the ease of taking care of everything that way. However, the drivers don't generally know the city as well as taxi cab drivers (though they also don't typically drive as recklessly).

1. there was a big taxi protest in DC today:

Drivers in and around downtown D.C. were gridlocked in traffic Wednesday as a caravan of angry taxi drivers made its way from East Potomac Park to Freedom Plaza — in a protest against app-based ride sharing services such as UberX.

the taxis all honked constantly for about 2-3 hours outside of my work. they weren't little short honks but rather of the HOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOONK, HOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOONK, HOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOONK variety. one one hand, the drivers achieved their goal of getting people to think about the Uber/Lyft/Sidecar issue and to talk about it. on the other hand, the most common thing i heard among pedestrians and workers in the area was "SHUT THE FUCK UP! GODDAMIT, SHUT THE FUCK UP!!"

i want to be sympathetic toward the taxi drivers. but even though i've never used Uber-like services as i don't use taxis very often at all, they clearly seem to be better on a technological level. when a rottweiler munched on my shin and calf a few weeks ago, it took calls to 3 different taxi companies before someone was able to pick up the phone and then agree to send someone to my house. 40 minutes passed before it finally arrived, and i live in DC proper, not way out in the suburbs or something. when the driver showed up, he refused to shut the fuck up even though i made it clear that i was bleeding and in a great deal of pain. he was physically unable to shut the fuck up. then he refused to take me to the nearest hospital (howard university) because "that's not a good hospital". instead he took me to a hospital across town, during rush hour, so the ride took forever. the entire time he talked about how much he loved money and also gave me advice about dog bites. he also, of course, spent a good chunk of time complaining about Uber.

anywhere, clearly an anecdote about a terrible taxi ride doesn't build a very strong case against taxi drivers, but pretty much every time i take a taxi i end up with the most terrible human beings of all time. i haven't used Uber but i've heard that they actually show up, you can tell when they'll arrive using an app, and that they don't talk much. sounds heavenly.

My god, Karl, I hope you called to complain about that driver! The delay is absurd and part of why I am in favor of the decentralized dispatch services provided by Uber and Hailo, but him not taking you to your requested destination is not only straight up awful but must violate some kind of DC consumer services regulation. Is there a complaint number to call? That guy is a god damn menace.

when a rottweiler munched on my shin and calf a few weeks ago, it took calls to 3 different taxi companies before someone was able to pick up the phone and then agree to send someone to my house. 40 minutes passed before it finally arrived, and i live in DC proper, not way out in the suburbs or something. when the driver showed up, he refused to shut the fuck up even though i made it clear that i was bleeding and in a great deal of pain.

sounds like a shitty situation and i feel for you karl malone but you didn't want to call an ambulance?

i was more concerned about the pulsing pain and shooting blood from my leg then taking his taxi ID number or whatever. i kept saying "yeah i'm in a lot of pain right now" as my response to his running monologue about how much he loved money that was occasionally sprinkled with questions to confirm that i agreed that money was awesome as well.

xpost
hard to explain, but i was in enough pain and bleeding enough to need to go to the hospital, but not enough to feel the need to pay several hundred dollars for an ambulance ride.

i (as well as several friends) have been using Uber X and Lyft fairly regularly for months now and they are a thousand times better than your typical taxi service in nearly every conceivable way.

i want to be sympathetic toward the taxi drivers. but even though i've never used Uber-like services as i don't use taxis very often at all, they clearly seem to be better on a technological level. when a rottweiler munched on my shin and calf a few weeks ago, it took calls to 3 different taxi companies before someone was able to pick up the phone and then agree to send someone to my house. 40 minutes passed before it finally arrived, and i live in DC proper, not way out in the suburbs or something.

it took me a while to understand this in my area, being a very infrequent taxi user who never had any of them around growing up, but i think basically taxi companies have a lot of unspoken ways of doing things that they require you to deal with if you want their convenience. factor in having to deal with a lot of demanding erratic customers who don't understand these things and i guess i can understand why they can get kind of fuck-you sometimes.

i'm thinking things like expectations about when people travel, under what circumstances it's reasonable to expect a fast pickup, where they expect you to go (wrt taxis being around you and finding fares wherever they end up).

recently i had an injury and had to take more taxis than i could afford because i didn't have any other way, and i got quite a range of service. some drivers had very slick smartphone apps, a square thingy. some knew where they were going. some couldn't find me standing at the opposite corner from where they expected. one guy had to fill out a card charge on fuckin carbon-copied slips by hand, but when i saw the phone he was working with, and figured what he must be making driving the cab, i really couldn't be irritated at him - anyone who could afford it would leap at the conveniences that would probably help them pull down more tips and other desirables. once i got picked up on a street corner by a passing cabbie i flagged down (apparently this does not really work much) who was ok with dumping me in the front seat with another fare in the back, only to have the actual cab i had called (there were a LOT driving past that night) swoop in and get irritated at the other one, and at me, for taking the fare he had oked. but how was i to know?? i was just standing in a snowstorm with a bum foot miles from home! etc.

i was more concerned about the pulsing pain and shooting blood from my leg then taking his taxi ID number or whatever. i kept saying "yeah i'm in a lot of pain right now" as my response to his running monologue about how much he loved money that was occasionally sprinkled with questions to confirm that i agreed that money was awesome as well.

I'm sorry. I didn't mean to imply that you had any sort of responsibility to report this guy. It was more of a "Justice for Karl Malone!" kind of thing. I get that way when I get angry at something on someone's behalf.

Oh no, it's cool! Believe me, as I sat I sat in the backseat I thought "what would a more direct person do here? Most people wouldn't stand for this." It's totally reasonable. People's thresholds for bullshit change over time, and I hope that when I'm an older man I'll have the courage to call out bullshit like that.

anyone used relayrides? looks pretty sweet.

this is probably a dumb question but if you get pulled over what are you supposed to show for insurance?

I use Uber and Hailo for calling real cabs. I don't use the ride sharing services, probably because I just use the real cabs, they always seem more plentiful. But I like the idea of them and fully support them.

relayrides = car rental

cab drivers i'm sentimental about but i truly hope car rental companies get disrupted out of existence by this thing

http://www.buzzfeed.com/bensmith/uber-executive-suggests-digging-up-dirt-on-journalists

what exactly did this guy say? I can't track it down anywhere, just reactions to it.

fuck these services

no way in hell am I entrusting the lives of my children with some unlicensed uninsured asshole with a handlebar mustache

A pink handlebar mustache pasted to the front of his car, even.

had way more shady shit pulled on me by cab drivers than i have ever received while using uber/lyft.

^

lol shakey wtf are you talking about unlicensed uninsured

Ubs has been pretty good to me except the multiplier suxxxxxxxx

THe uber app is also pretty awful it's like a videogame interface

I mean the #aesthetics

uber means never having to find a dd / leaving my car somewhere distant if im out and alcohol becomes a factor. plus reduction in such stressors as finding parking v valet etc. it's pretty much the best. i never fuck w lyft or whatever else tho

tax the hell out of these people and do more buses / trains at all hours in cities that aren't new york ffs. i get how it's better than cabs for the customer but it's not solving any other problems and libertarians are wrong abt this shit being inherently good. it was totally galling to see a "fb friend" share a "petition" to keep lyft legal in my city, like ok fine it's very weird and hypocritical how this place is "pro-business" only if it jibes with a religious cult, but on the other hand, if trax ran until 2 here, drunk driving is addressed, less drivers on the road is addressed (we have the biggest smog problem in the country), suddenly you might have a night life, etc.

miateesslessness

I don't think you should be opposed to expanding the market for taxis if you want to stop drunk driving and make it easier to live w/o a car

these companies are pretty clearly run by terrible people but so are taxi cartels

http://i975.photobucket.com/albums/ae232/daggerlee/668CE98E-0A61-406E-87E5-546157F4E18C.png_zpshjrvwiti.jpeg

Legit terrifying

lol shakey wtf are you talking about unlicensed uninsured

― ✓ out this insane nakh yall (gr8080), Tuesday, November 18, 2014 11:57 AM (5 days ago)

these drivers tend to only be insured for personal travel -- not for transporting passengers for money.

http://blog.uber.com/ridesharinginsurance

i was thinking of lyft -- not sure about shakey

https://www.lyft.com/safety

personally, it just seems like there's too overwhelming a douche factor involved with using these services, but i felt that way about cell phones in the late 90s/early 00's

i agree with matt though about regulating and taxing these things -- same with Air BnB

sarahell, what's your opinion about the types of insurance the drivers for these companies carry?

http://www.dnainfo.com/chicago/20141122/lakeview/cyclist-struck-by-two-cars-on-lake-shore-drive-early-saturday-police

Awful situation but wondering how the insurance stuff may shake out here with the Uber driver.

http://www.policygenius.com/blog/insurance-secret-uber-doesnt-want-know/

http://www.sfgate.com/business/article/Leaked-transcript-shows-Geico-s-stance-against-5910113.php

I took UberX a few times recently just to try it out (once when we didn't have our car and needed to get somewhere), here are my thoughts:

1) From work (midtown manhattan) to home it was exactly the same price as a regular yellowcab, and unlike the yellowcab the uber guy didn't gun it and didn't take what I know to be the fastest route, so not doing it again from work
2) From my neighborhood, however, it was great -- car services around here suck and often just tell you they don't have someone available, whereas uber had a guy with a car seat her in five minutes.
3) However, they charged about 30% extra for the car seat, which seemed kind of ridiculous
4) I was annoyed at how unclear it was how much it was going to cost -- the first time I specifically got the fare estimate, but the second time I somehow missed it, and once you pass that there doesn't seem to be any meter or anything else telling you how much you're paying and why
5) Uber is just the douchiest name ever, and their logo looks like something out of Robocop
6) All three Uber drivers I had were professional drivers who had previously driven for black car services so the "ridesharing" thing is nonsense
7) Ultimately yeah there is a douchey vibe to the whole thing -- you can even hook up your spotify account to the driver's stereo so you're the fucking DJ in your uber while you do lines off a hooker's ass or whatever
8) The cars were all very nice, though almost pointlessly so -- the "family" one we got was a Toyota Avalon hybrid, and the one that took me home from work was some monstrosity luxury SUV

TL;DR, I'll probably use it again in my neighborhood just because cabs and car services are so difficult, but otherwise it has no major appeal for me over a regular cab, and I barely ever take cabs anyway

Also, one of the drivers told me "Last year, it was great, I made good money and I could work a normal day and go home. Now they cut the rates and I have to work 15 hours to make the same money I made in 8"

my friend is a Lyft driver & she said basically the same thing -- she's driving for both to try to make up the shortfall

I still dont think I understand whats better about Uber (or what was percieved to be) than taxis. Here in Melb we can order a proper taxi with iphone apps as well as by calling or hailing on the street; you can pay by card (credit or debit) on proper wifi connected machines in all the taxis, and its reasonably cheap.

Is it something else that makes uber better? Cant be the price from what im reading here.

There are some cities in the US where the cab system really doesn't work well, and I think San Francisco is one of these.

Trayce, in NYC we mostly have a pretty good yellowcab system and black car car services make up the difference, but there are places like my neighborhood where it's still difficult to find any kind of cab. I also don't think you can hail regular taxis by smartphone app right now in NYC but not sure. Beyond that though, the improvements are not huge -- the cars are a little nicer (in my three experiences) but modern NYC cabs tend to be well-maintained, clean, up-to-date cars. I guess the choice of music thing is sort of neat but I didn't use it because it seemed assholish. I do like the fact that there are so many uber drivers with carseats ready - I don't think regular cabs ever have this.

But yeah there are cities with poor cab service. My brother in LA says everyone there uses Uber because both public transit and cabs are not great there.

But yeah, taxis are so different in different cities that I think there's a lot of yawning gaps of incomprehension -- people in cities with good taxis say "what is the point of this" and people in cities with crap taxis say "how are you not using this"

Similarly -- I think Uber-like services are really well-adapted for the use case of "it's 3am and I'm drunk at a bar whose street address I don't know and I need to get home and I don't live in a city where cabs are just driving by all the time" -- I think this is the kind of situation most people are either in reasonably often (in which case they're in the "how can you not use this" camp) or basically never (in which case "what is the point of this.")

e.g. someone whose typical use of a taxi is "I'm out of town for work and I need to get from my hotel to the airport" (e.g me) seldom to never encounters the situation where this service would be useful.

i’ve said it before but my local minicab company has an app and it basically looks like uber’s and it works great. you see the little picture of the car coming towards you and everything. i mean it wouldn’t work in LA but how often am i in LA.

Yes but does your local minicab company have a self driving division

neither does Uber, they sold it

They spend a lot on lobbying too, no?

That's another great thing about my minicab company - lobbying costs are very low.

neither does Uber, they sold it

things seem to be going well here

https://www.cnn.com/2021/06/16/tech/uber-software-bug-drivers-charged/index.html

Fares have been bonkers in Chicago. City cabs, which used to seem expensive, have fares at about half the price.

Same in NY. Easily 5 x what they were pre COVID.

(Cue someone to explain why like we’re all 10 years old…zzzzz)

wow https://mostlysignssomeportents.tumblr.com/post/659150190242054144/end-of-the-line-for-uber

Might have been mentioned upthread but while Uber et al ultimately can fuck off, one thing I've consistently seen for years in mentions on social media -- predominantly but not solely from Black posters here in America, and very consistently from them, NYC being a key focus but not the sole -- is that, at the least anecdotally but likely more systematically, before the basic innovation of smartphone car service ordering happened calling for a taxi, per said posters, was at best sporadic especially if the calls were from 'bad' neighborhoods, real or imagined. I have no reason to doubt that at all, and essentially by Uber et al becoming huge and forcing the official industries to adapt -- Flywheel, YoTaxi, etc -- that broke that pattern. So the legacy will always have to be nuanced at the least; the collapse in subsidization and more that Doctorow identifies is clear and much of the overall legacy eats, and yet.

That would be a worthy legacy for sure; the post does address it: "It’s true that Uber had upsides, like bringing transport to underserved communities of color — but because Uber was always doomed, this was a temporary mirage that would strand those communities again."

On that front, while I understand his pessimism, I'm also willing to bet that said formal taxi companies are more on the 'uh let's not leave obvious money on the table here' tip now. We'll have to see.

The rideshares may have fucked up by ensuring that the legislature couldn't legislate

Breaking: CA Superior Court judge finds Prop 22 UNCONSTITUTIONAL!!! pic.twitter.com/R4gFoDrs0n

— Veena Dubal (@veenadubal) August 21, 2021

Lmao

Spending $200m to buy a law and having it struck down as unconstitutional bc you tried to make it impossible for the legislature to ever amend it couldn’t have happened to a nicer industry

— Julia Carrie Wong (@juliacarriew) August 21, 2021

The last two times I had to use Uber, my drivers were seething about ways in which the company had actively been ripping them off of late.

This was … maybe 4-5 weeks ago

https://sfstandard.com/technology/san-francisco-birthplace-of-ridehailing-becomes-the-center-of-its-decline/

https://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2023/08/hubert-horan-can-uber-ever-deliver-part-thirty-three-uber-isnt-really-profitable-yet-but-is-getting-closer-the-antitrust-case-against-uber.html

“The third factor, the delinking of passenger fares and driver compensation was a major driver of this labor to capital wealth transfer. Prior to 2022, driver payments were a function of what passengers paid, with adjustments for incentive programs and peak period demand. Uber has developed algorithms for tailoring customer prices based on what they believe individual customers would be willing to pay and tailoring payments to individual drivers so they are as low as possible to get them to accept trips.

This is fundamentally different from Uber’s pre-pandemic price discrimination, where it could apply Surge Pricing during periods of high customer demand (or driver shortages) but any customer in a given zone requesting the same trip at the same time would see the same price, and drivers would receive the same payment for those trips. Now different passengers/drivers making the same trip can see very different fares/payments. System average revenue per trip goes up, average driver payments per trip go down. Airlines have decades of experience changing fares depending on demand but have no ability to discriminate between passengers booking the same flight at the same time. [5]“

Love drunken conversations with drivers. Best part