Freelance Hivemind: We Are Not Amused

Message Bookmarked
Bookmark Removed
Not all messages are displayed: show all messages (116 of them)
Not specifically (competition innit!) (it would rock if you did tho) just saying that not only can you do BETTER than whatever unfulfilling freelance you're in right now, you *should* be doing better, and you have to accept that before it'll get better... Don't get dispirited, is what i'm saying, because there *is* better out there, and we have to *make* the mags we work at better, from within.

stevie (stevie), Thursday, 7 October 2004 09:55 (nineteen years ago) link

Interesting...Stevie, I've just emailed you off board.

Marcello Carlin, Thursday, 7 October 2004 10:11 (nineteen years ago) link

one year passes...
Need a little bit of advice.

I've started doing some articles for submission to the broadsheets around here, I'm trying to avoid music, more feature style articles.

I guess since it's a while since I finished college I'm keen to just refresh on the basics of cold calling features editors. What are the golden rules here? As I say I'm sure this was drummed into me in college but I forget alot of it.

I mailed one of my completed articles to the features eds of 4 broadsheets here. I got two replies, one said "not appropriate for our paper, no real local angle, not enough real life stories", I sort of disagreed but didn't expect that paper to publish anyway, tho now I wonder if the fact that my story just can't really have a local angle will go against me, or is it just the paper in question.

The other reply said "I found this very interesting, can you tell a little more about your background, and show me some other samples of your work". So I did this, no response yet. But why would they want to know my background, is the article not the important thing?

I haven't recieved any reply from the other two. Not a bad start I thought though, at least things are happening, even two replies isn't bad and one of them was potentially positive.

But I'm just wondering about the best way to handle this kind of thing, is just coming up with ideas and churning out as many articles as I can, then sending them off, a viable route to success/money?

What about the days where you want to work but can't think of an idea and end up scouring the news sites?

I am really keen to make a go of this, I want to leave my current job, but I think it would be stupid until I have succeeded a little.

I know there are lots of good freelancers and smart people here, what do you think?

Ronan (Ronan), Wednesday, 16 August 2006 14:19 (seventeen years ago) link

sorry I just want to bump this, bump!

Ronan (Ronan), Thursday, 17 August 2006 09:32 (seventeen years ago) link

It's a bit odd for a broadsheet to require a local angle. At least it would be in the UK. Generally they specifically don't want it to be too parochial. I guess a couple of the Irish broadsheets are still quite city-focused (actually I don't even know what the fourth one is after the Times, the Independent and the Examiner).

Anyway I don't really have any expertise here but might as well chip in just to keep the thread alive. Do be on the lookout for features editors giving you the knockback on unsolicited copy and then nicking your ideas!

Maybe best to mail them (or talk to them if poss) and them send a CV with some of your previous stuff (music stuff and anything non-music you did for college paper or whatever) if they show interest?

Alba (Alba), Thursday, 17 August 2006 19:04 (seventeen years ago) link

(in my limited experience, I've found editors to be most keen on people they can trust to be around, flexible and able to file cleanish copy to deadline. People who make their lives easier. But that was reviewing more than feature writing)

Alba (Alba), Thursday, 17 August 2006 19:08 (seventeen years ago) link

Ronan, if they're asking about your background, it may just be to reassure themselves that you'll actually get the piece in, etc. etc. I wouldn't sweat it.

Rickey Wright (Rrrickey), Thursday, 17 August 2006 23:30 (seventeen years ago) link

Editors are sometimes just curious about where you're coming from, as it were, if they like your stuff and see potential . . .

Rickey Wright (Rrrickey), Thursday, 17 August 2006 23:39 (seventeen years ago) link

this is the best advice i've seen:

"Accumulate well-placed acquaintances. Turn nothing down.
-- Pete W (petershepherdwatt...), July 26th, 2006."

Bashment Jakes (Enrique), Friday, 18 August 2006 07:51 (seventeen years ago) link

Do be on the lookout for features editors giving you the knockback on unsolicited copy and then nicking your ideas!

I am really worried about this yes. So it does happen!

Ronan (Ronan), Friday, 18 August 2006 19:11 (seventeen years ago) link

Yup. A lot. Especially with the3 v1ll4ge and the editor's acolytes. He really has put the fear of fuck into them, cute really...

Kv_nol (Kv_nol), Saturday, 19 August 2006 01:15 (seventeen years ago) link

Accumulate well-placed acquaintances. Turn nothing down.

One time, I told a print broker "I'm sorry, I'm buried under other deadlines." Never heard from her again.

Danny Aioli (Rock Hardy), Saturday, 19 August 2006 03:03 (seventeen years ago) link

In my (US) experience, and there are exceptions, editors are happier if you send them ideas, not completed articles, as this allows them to flatter themselves that you are then writing the article with their publication in mind, not promiscuously sending something prewritten around to see where it sticks.

What about the days where you want to work but can't think of an idea and end up scouring the news sites?

Your subconscious is steeping new ideas while you scour. Alternately, call it a day after a few unproductive hours and do something concrete, like laundry.

Paul Eater (eater), Saturday, 19 August 2006 03:21 (seventeen years ago) link

something concrete, like laundry.

maybe you need to cut down on the starch?

Sterling Clover (s_clover), Saturday, 19 August 2006 08:21 (seventeen years ago) link

Oh yeah, one other thing, perhaps this is Alba's department.

Any advice with the Guardian? Is living here going to hamper me beyond having to make calls to Britain for the odd quote?

Just some of the pieces I've written are more like what the Guardian would print than the Irish papers, I fear.

Ronan (Ronan), Monday, 21 August 2006 10:07 (seventeen years ago) link

There is no "media" section in the IT or Examiner or Indo as far as I know.

Ronan (Ronan), Monday, 21 August 2006 10:08 (seventeen years ago) link

Good.

;p

Kv_nol (Kv_nol), Monday, 21 August 2006 10:11 (seventeen years ago) link

Sorry that was a kneejerk agains the media supplement thing, not about you, sorry.

Kv_nol (Kv_nol), Monday, 21 August 2006 10:12 (seventeen years ago) link

No reason I can see on holding back on trying to pitch to the Guardian, as far as I can see. You might always get someone thinking "he's in another country, what does he know?" but if you start worrying about reasons why people might potentially not want your stuff then you'll never get anything done. That's my no-longer-an-insider-and-never-really-was advice. Others (stelfox - does he still post anywhere?) might have more specific info.

Alba (Alba), Monday, 21 August 2006 10:16 (seventeen years ago) link

Hmmm, just saw the article I wanted to write is printed TODAY in the Guardian, by someone far more qualified and well known in the field than me.

Maybe it's best to stick to Irish papers since they can be relied upon to not be very up to date on new and interesting things.

Ronan (Ronan), Monday, 21 August 2006 10:25 (seventeen years ago) link

that bastard followed me to the Lake District

Ronan (Ronan), Monday, 21 August 2006 10:30 (seventeen years ago) link

Oh yeah one other thing, finally.

Is there any decent resource that gives info about who does what job in the papers, all in one place?

I've been just calling the newspapers and asking, which is fine, but it would be easier to just have a website or something.

Ronan (Ronan), Monday, 21 August 2006 10:45 (seventeen years ago) link

there is a book.

Bashment Jakes (Enrique), Monday, 21 August 2006 10:45 (seventeen years ago) link

Ah that makes sense, thanks alot.

Ronan (Ronan), Monday, 21 August 2006 10:53 (seventeen years ago) link

there ought to be a website though. obv positions change o'er the year. but it is infuriating how anon they keep themselves. i've had a couple of things published in an american magazine where i just straight pitched the editor -- and they replied. uk eds seem to do this only about 1/4 of the time.

Bashment Jakes (Enrique), Monday, 21 August 2006 10:55 (seventeen years ago) link

ronan: try to arrange face-to-face meetings with features editors if possible. hit them with as many ideas as possible, and be willing to take on commissions they might want you to write (although, in the current zero-cash climate, this is unlikely to happen).

just sending in the odd article here and there means you could end up being overlooked. pitching up with a stream of quality ideas and trying to cultivate some kind of relationship with commissioning editors is by far the best idea.

i know it's a truism, but don't give up or be disheartened. the best resource a freelance feature-writer can have is IDEAS.

x-post: er, two-step approach to success here involves 1) ringing up the paper in question and saying: "hello, what's the name and direct line of your features editor?" and 2) ringing them. rocket science, eh? o yeh: don't just rely on e-mail. always make a follow-up call.

grimly fiendish (grimlord), Monday, 21 August 2006 11:04 (seventeen years ago) link

Do you think it's best then to send just one mail with a couple of ideas? And not have the articles done? To sort of attempt to have them say "ok, can you write this article you suggested, here is how many words I want etc". that way seems to make sense since you tailor it for the publication automatically, tho I was writing the articles first, because in a way then I have a better idea of what I'm selling.

perhaps a combination of the two approaches is best.

i'm going to try and keep in contact with the two eds who replied, particularly the one who asked for other examples of my work, and see how that goes.

Ronan (Ronan), Monday, 21 August 2006 11:25 (seventeen years ago) link

in your case, ronan, you might be best to have finished articles to show them because you're an unknown quantity to them.

need to zoom to work now. will look back in here later. but yes, all yr approaches here seem sound.

grimly fiendish (grimlord), Monday, 21 August 2006 11:30 (seventeen years ago) link

jesus I just got an email back from one of the places I mailed, probably the one I'd most like to be printed in, saying they find it really interesting but want me to change it, with more quotes and a slightly different angle. then "can you do this for 12 tomorrow, let me know".

panic!

Ronan (Ronan), Monday, 28 August 2006 09:56 (seventeen years ago) link

do the best you can and send it back to them at 11:30, show you can turn copy around quickly

Ed (dali), Monday, 28 August 2006 10:08 (seventeen years ago) link

the problem is, he sort of faintly outlined suggestions for changes, then said "let me know how this seems to you", and I feel unsure as to whether I should say "yes this is great" and proceed, or quickly clarify what he wants a little. with the latter, I'm just afraid of seeming slow on the uptake in my questions, perhaps what he sees as obvious I amn't seeing. though I do generally understand his suggestions, obv this is a bit weird without the topic being known here.

Ronan (Ronan), Monday, 28 August 2006 10:12 (seventeen years ago) link

If you're not sure ring back and chat some more. He's asked you to do it now, so the important thing is doing it to his satisfaction. He's not going to care at all about spending a couple of minutes with you if it means he gets what he wants. Don't say "I don't understand, can you explain again?" – just make contact again like it's the most natural thing in the world to be continuing a dialogue about it.

Well done, by the way.

Alba (Alba), Monday, 28 August 2006 10:17 (seventeen years ago) link

He emailed me, so I guess I'll email back, it's easier to organise my thoughts in print I think.

Ronan (Ronan), Monday, 28 August 2006 10:27 (seventeen years ago) link

Good stuff Ro - and when they ask for changes just say 'fine' in a pleasant way and then ask for clarification if needed.

suzy (suzy), Monday, 28 August 2006 12:07 (seventeen years ago) link

The only other problem, I've just realised, is that it's a Bank Holiday in the UK so I'm going to have to contact any UK sources tomorrow from 9-12 and get it written up in that time. Makes it difficult to work on it today except this evening with American people I need to speak to.

I basically said in my email "yes I'm keen to make those changes and can do it for tomorrow at midday" then made my suggestions for what my idea of those changes was, he was quite general, so I said what I specifically planned to include and asked if this was what he wanted.

No reply, it was about an hour and a half ago, so I guess just keep going with my interpretation of what he asked for? Presuming he might not be rooted to the office seat on a Bank Holiday Monday.

Ronan (Ronan), Monday, 28 August 2006 12:16 (seventeen years ago) link

two weeks pass...
£60 a page? What the fuck is this, a magazine or a fanzine? There better be travel expenses in this one. Teach me to write about things I'm interested in rather than stuff that actually pays well.

Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Monday, 11 September 2006 13:43 (seventeen years ago) link

retro gamer?

a rapper singing about hos and bitches and money (Enrique), Monday, 11 September 2006 13:46 (seventeen years ago) link

Sssssshhhh.

Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Monday, 11 September 2006 13:50 (seventeen years ago) link

oh right!

a rapper singing about hos and bitches and money (Enrique), Monday, 11 September 2006 13:51 (seventeen years ago) link

http://www.squashsa.asn.au/images/Schweppes.gif

Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Monday, 11 September 2006 13:51 (seventeen years ago) link

So.......here I am. It was a pretty severe edit which makes me a bit unhappy, and doesn't inspire me with confidence for future work, but I guess I should just enjoy this. Though....it's hard, some of the sentences at the end kinda stop making sense they're tweaked around and changed so much! Still I suppose editor knows best.

http://technology.guardian.co.uk/

Ronan (Ronan), Thursday, 14 September 2006 07:53 (seventeen years ago) link

damn, currently on front-page banner

a rapper singing about hos and bitches and money (Enrique), Thursday, 14 September 2006 08:00 (seventeen years ago) link

Just read that on the bus on the way into work - good work Ronan!

Jerry the Nipper (Jerrynipper), Thursday, 14 September 2006 08:32 (seventeen years ago) link

Well done! Glad to hear it. I thought it read very well. It's all a bit easier from now on I'd hope!

Kv_nol (Kv_nol), Thursday, 14 September 2006 09:27 (seventeen years ago) link

Well, whatever your ed did, the article flowed nicely to someone who hadn't seen orig copy and concomitant 'iceberg issues' and one would think the ed would use you again. Don't sweat it. Good intro etc.

Next step: Ro does an invoice to GNL (and no you don't get extra £££s for the front page stuff). Should get btwn £225-£300.

suzy (suzy), Thursday, 14 September 2006 09:47 (seventeen years ago) link

Ronan Fitzgerald examines the potential for abuse! (V cool)

I'm getting my first proper artwork for proper CD released soon. So far it's going pretty well but deadline is imminent and still loads of things to sort out. And I'm too scared to ask them how much they're going to pay me (or I'm going to have to pay them if it all goes tits up). Hoping it will lead to more tho.

Konal Doddz (blueski), Thursday, 14 September 2006 09:55 (seventeen years ago) link

Why would you have to pay?

Kv_nol (Kv_nol), Thursday, 14 September 2006 09:55 (seventeen years ago) link

if we're doing freelance circle-jerks now, i got 1x review in s1ght and s0und tomorrow, mini-rah.

a rapper singing about hos and bitches and money (Enrique), Thursday, 14 September 2006 09:59 (seventeen years ago) link

I don't envy the life of the livestock show photographer. They sell a web-resolution image one time and suddenly everybody has it, including people who haven't paid for it and people who want to use it for print even though it's not big enough. Still puts me in a tough spot between the photographer and the advertiser.

My name is Donald J. Trump, millionaire. I own a mansion and a yacht. (WilliamC), Wednesday, 17 August 2016 17:09 (seven years ago) link

three years pass...

Can we talk about the Paycheck Protection Program? I got email from my bank this morning that included this:

On Tuesday, March 31, 2020, the Treasury Department issued much-anticipated guidance for the Paycheck Protection Program, which starting this week will provide up to $350 billion in fully forgivable loans to help small businesses maintain payrolls during the coronavirus pandemic.

Small businesses and sole proprietorships—generally, those with 500 or fewer employees—may apply for PPP loans with their bank starting on Friday, April 3; independent contractors and self-employed workers can apply starting April 10. PPP loans will be fully forgiven when used for payroll costs, interest on mortgages, rent and utilities, with at least three quarters of the forgiven amount being used for payroll; forgiveness is based on employers maintaining headcount or quickly rehiring and maintaining salary levels.

The phrase "fully forgivable loan" is throwing me. If I wind up qualifying and use the money under their constraints, does that mean it becomes just a free-money grant? I think I read on the Treasury website that I'd have to apply for loan forgiveness and that it's not automatic. But still, this sounds like a lifeline for me (independent contractor).

Miami weisse (WmC), Wednesday, 1 April 2020 16:29 (four years ago) link

two years pass...

moving from the 'working from home' thread

I've worked from home for almost 19 years. I expect it to all come crashing down around my ears any day now.

― Miami weisse (WmC), Thursday, March 12, 2020 8:14 AM (two years ago)

lol it kinda did. My client held on through the end of '21 before shuttering, and I billed another client $310 in '22. My tax guy says I can claim to be self employed and claim a loss for four years before I have to start calling myself a bartender instead of a graphic designer and quit claiming internet/phone/WFMU donations as business expenses.

The Terroir of Tiny Town (WmC), Friday, 10 March 2023 18:22 (one year ago) link


You must be logged in to post. Please either login here, or if you are not registered, you may register here.